Scrutiny on Vaccines....

[s0me0nesmind1]

Was watching Bill Maher when he decided to bring this guy on. Was curious how P&N feels on this?

Apologies for the crappy video, but it's the only one of it I can find on Youtube

He's trying to make it seem like "I'm not an anti-vaxxer, but there are a lot of known issues with vaccinations"... To which I say.. fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck you. Regardless of any 0.0001% of the population truth to this - everything you are saying - ESPECIALLY on public TV can only result in more misinformation, deception, and incompetent fools.... and he knows this.

 

[Amused]

Anti-vax is a science denialism cult.

Anti-vaxxers are the flat earthers of medicine.

What started as one fraudulent study claiming a single vaccine causes a single issue (autism) has mushroomed into every vaccine causes literally everything, even child abuse (anti-vax groups are claiming shaken baby syndrome and fetal alcohol syndrome are a vaccine injury)... and everyone in the world is lying to you.

This is the very definition of a conspiracy cult. The first thing a cult must convince you is that everyone else is conspiring to lie to you. Once all objective fact is doubted, they can tell you anything, no matter how absurd, and you'll believe it.

Think about this for a minute. To believe the anti-vaxxer narrative you must first believe that every immunologist, epidemiologist, virologist and 99.99% of medical doctors in every country on earth, hundreds of thousands of individual people, are conspiring to lie to you.

Debating an anti-vaxxer with their ever moving goalposts becomes a ridiculous game of conspiracy whack-a-mole.

Here is the single resource that catalogues and debunks every anti-vax conspiracy:

Vaxopedia - A to Z Index

An A-Z guide to vaccines to help get you educated about vaccines.

vaxopedia.org

 

[fskimospy]

Was watching Bill Maher when he decided to bring this guy on. Was curious how P&N feels on this?

Apologies for the crappy video, but it's the only one of it I can find on Youtube

He's trying to make it seem like "I'm not an anti-vaxxer, but there are a lot of known issues with vaccinations"... To which I say.. fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck you. Regardless of any 0.0001% of the population truth to this - everything you are saying - ESPECIALLY on public TV can only result in more misinformation, deception, and incompetent fools.

I normally like Bill Maher and watch his show every week but this is one of the worst and stupidest things I’ve ever seen him say. It’s exactly the sort of nonsensical anti-science thinking that Maher frequently (and correctly) accuses climate deniers of.

The fact that he was trying to push the vaccine/autism link based on the idea that doctors get things wrong sometime was enraging. Science 101 is that it if assumed things don’t have a relationship until evidence indicates otherwise. More importantly here we DID study the issue, extensively, and still found nothing.

I bet next week he comes on and complains about the twitter mob being mean to him over this as if it’s their fault he said something moronic.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Anti-vax is a science denialism cult.

Anti-vaxxers are the flat earthers of medicine.

What started as one fraudulent study claiming a single vaccine causes a single issue (autism) has mushroomed into every vaccine causes literally everything, even child abuse (anti-vax groups are claiming shaken baby syndrome and fetal alcohol syndrome are a vaccine injury)... and everyone in the world is lying to you.

This is the very definition of a conspiracy cult. The first thing a cult must convince you is that everyone else is conspiring to lie to you. Once all objective fact is doubted, they can tell you anything, no matter how absurd, and you'll believe it.

Think about this for a minute. To believe the anti-vaxxer narrative you must first believe that every immunologist, epidemiologist, virologist and 99.99% of medical doctors in every country on earth, hundreds of thousands of individual people, are conspiring to lie to you.

Debating an anti-vaxxer with their ever moving goalposts becomes a ridiculous game of conspiracy whack-a-mole.

Here is the single resource that catalogues and debunks every anti-vax conspiracy:

Vaxopedia - A to Z Index

An A-Z guide to vaccines to help get you educated about vaccines.

vaxopedia.org

I get that - and my problem is it used to be a bastard child that we could at least keep under the bed for the most part like flat earthers....

But now it's on HBO on Bill Maher?

Or maybe I'm taking this too far and this guy really isn't an anti-vaxxer? That's why I'm curious what everyone else here sees when they see this.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

There's nothing wrong with but...

Yeah.

In other news it seems that measles can erase immune memory so people can get other diseases they shouldn't have again. Joy!

 

[SteveGrabowski]

Maher completely lost me when he was discussing the drug war on his show and claimed crystal meth is just like diet pill amphetamines and you can still be a high functioning adult while being a meth user like you can with drugs like cocaine and weed. That's gotta be one of the stupidest things I have ever heard since crystal meth use slashes your natural dopamine production so you can't be happy from doing anything that would naturally lead to happiness, like eating bacon or having sex.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

I normally like Bill Maher and watch his show every week but this is one of the worst and stupidest things I’ve ever seen him say. It’s exactly the sort of nonsensical anti-science thinking that Maher frequently (and correctly) accuses climate deniers of.

The fact that he was trying to push the vaccine/autism link based on the idea that doctors get things wrong sometime was enraging. Science 101 is that it if assumed things don’t have a relationship until evidence indicates otherwise. More importantly here we DID study the issue, extensively, and still found nothing.

I bet next week he comes on and complains about the twitter mob being mean to him over this as if it’s their fault he said something moronic.

Yup - and him equating this to other shit like the food pyramid, salt not increasing blood pressure, etc... as if that is an apples to apples comparison is ludicrous.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

I like to keep it simple.
Decades ago when people used to have to deal with major outbreaks they chose to get immunized. They didn’t say well getting this shot thing could be dangerous....
They already knew and witnessed the alternative. They chose to vaccinate by an overwhelming margin.

 

[Amused]

I get that - and my problem is it used to be a bastard child that we could at least keep under the bed for the most part like flat earthers....

But now it's on HBO on Bill Maher?

Or maybe I'm taking this too far and this guy really isn't an anti-vaxxer? That's why I'm curious what everyone else here sees when they see this.

He's an anti-vaxxer. Always has been. And he's a fucking idiot. The great granddaddy of postmodern pseudo intellectual brologic.

When will people realize cults of personality are never worth following???

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Wikipedia quote on this guy:

Gordon claims that, to an individual child, the risks of vaccination often outweigh its benefits. Therefore, he stopped following the recommended vaccine schedule for his patients in 1980, although he still administers vaccinations to some children on a case-by-case basis.[1] Gordon has cited the debunked connection between vaccines and autism among the alleged risks to children that prevent him from routinely administering vaccinations.[1] He has signed hundreds of personal-belief exemptions to school vaccine requirements.[7]

In a 2015 interview with Ben Tracy of CBS News, Gordon was asked about the risk of contagion should someone with measles walk into his office, given that most of his patients delay or avoid the measles vaccine. Gordon responded: "You just said it, they'd get measles. Not meningitis, not the plague, not Ebola, they'd get measles. Measles is almost an [sic] always a benign childhood illness."[7] However, Dr. Deborah Lehman at Cedars Sinai Medical Center says: "People don't remember children staying in dark rooms because they have measles and the light hurts their eyes and developing brain swelling and serious developmental problems, we've given people a false sense of security and it's situations like this, outbreaks like this [Disneyland measles outbreak] that really remind us of the importance of these diseases and really the benefit of vaccine [sic]."[7]

Yeap. Anti-vaxxer. I have lost a lot of respect for Maher. I watch his show more religiously than even Oliver because he at least has the balls to call out the lefties on their bullshit.

 

[zinfamous]

I get that - and my problem is it used to be a bastard child that we could at least keep under the bed for the most part like flat earthers....

But now it's on HBO on Bill Maher?

Or maybe I'm taking this too far and this guy really isn't an anti-vaxxer? That's why I'm curious what everyone else here sees when they see this.

Oh, he's anti-vaxxer all right. It's one of those many mysterious things about the fellow where he seems to display no personal confusion between his piecemeal acceptance and denial of the same scientific principles in the same breath.

It is also, to support common refrain, why we don't blindly listen to celebrities for hard science. It's nice to have advocates, of course, but any layman can say stupid things. Stupid things isn't always that big of a deal, unless it's absolutely dangerous. Anti-Vaxx is a direct threat to public safety and health, and it's one of the reasons that I've always held a very "grey region" opinion of Bill Maher

 

[Amused]

Oh, he's anti-vaxxer all right. It's one of those many mysterious things about the fellow where he seems to display no personal confusion between his piecemeal acceptance and denial of the same scientific principles in the same breath.

It is also, to support common refrain, why we don't blindly listen to celebrities for hard science. It's nice to have advocates, of course, but any layman can say stupid things. Stupid things isn't always that big of a deal, unless it's absolutely dangerous. Anti-Vaxx is a direct threat to public safety and health, and it's one of the reasons that I've always held a very "grey region" opinion of Bill Maher

There is no grey area here. Once I discover a person is an anti-vaxxer it's no different from a flat earther or alt-med believer.

I lose all but basic human respect for the person. I consider them utterly incompetent and anything further claimed by them is automatically suspect.

 

[zinfamous]

There is no grey area here. Once I discover a person is an anti-vaxxer it's no different from a flat earther or alt-med believer.

I lose all but basic human respect for the person. I consider them utterly incompetent and anything further claimed by them is automatically suspect.

That's certainly fair. I still find him somewhat humorous, and I like a lot of the guests on his show. I don't really like him as a host, though.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

That's certainly fair. I still find him somewhat humorous, and I like a lot of the guests on his show. I don't really like him as a host, though.

lol I presumed that amused meant the person being interviewed - not Maher necessarily.

But maybe I'm wrong....

 

[zinfamous]

lol I presumed that amused meant the person being interviewed - not Maher necessarily.

But maybe I'm wrong....

well, I directly applied the "grey area" function to Maher, then Amused replied specifically about "no grey area here" ...so, you know, logic.

Come on bro, I think you are finally learning how to read and understand context!

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Wikipedia quote on this guy:



Yeap. Anti-vaxxer. I have lost a lot of respect for Maher. I watch his show more religiously than even Oliver because he at least has the balls to call out the lefties on their bullshit.

Yep, anti-vaxxer. He "occasionally" gives immunizations? There are very rare conditions that prevent the use of vaccines such as an allergy to one of the components or an immunocompromised state. But he's decided to invent a schedule with no demonstrated necessity in fact. He goes by "feels" but occasionally gives shots.


Righties embrace fiction and blame the left who go by science.

Well that right there is a fail.

 

[Amused]

lol I presumed that amused meant the person being interviewed - not Maher necessarily.

But maybe I'm wrong....

Why not both? Any anti-vaxxer.

Anyone who holds an irrational and illogical conspiracy cult belief. I instantly lose all intellectual respect for them. I wouldn't even trust driving directions from them anymore. I would double check anything they tell me.

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Why not both? Any anti-vaxxer.

Anyone who holds an irrational and illogical conspiracy cult belief. I instantly lose all intellectual respect for them. I wouldn't even trust driving directions from them anymore. I would double check anything they tell me.

I have a natural cognitive bias to want to give Maher the benefit of the doubt. I also give him extra points that since he doesn't have kids (and adamantly says he doesn't want them) that even if he was anti-vaxx that he at least isn't able to apply it.

Regardless I fully give him 100% blame for giving an anti-vaxxer a platform to portray his message of idiocy.

 

[KMFJD]

Maher completely lost me when he was discussing the drug war on his show and claimed crystal meth is just like diet pill amphetamines and you can still be a high functioning adult while being a meth user like you can with drugs like cocaine and weed. That's gotta be one of the stupidest things I have ever heard since crystal meth use slashes your natural dopamine production so you can't be happy from doing anything that would naturally lead to happiness, like eating bacon or having sex.

We used to be able to buy pseudoephedrine pills at wallmart, talk about an energy boost

 

[Amused]

I have a natural cognitive bias to want to give Maher the benefit of the doubt. I also give him extra points that since he doesn't have kids (and adamantly says he doesn't want them) that even if he was anti-vaxx that he at least isn't able to apply it.

Regardless I fully give him 100% blame for giving an anti-vaxxer a platform to portray his message of idiocy.

He has been an anti-vax nutjob for years.

From 2015:

Bill Maher: Still an antivaccine crank after all these years

Bill Maher likes to represent himself as the epitome of rationality, primarily on the basis of his rejection of religion. However, rejection of religion does not necessarily make one a skeptic. Maher

sciencebasedmedicine.org

Bill Maher likes to represent himself as the epitome of rationality, primarily on the basis of his rejection of religion. However, rejection of religion does not necessarily make one a skeptic. Maher has demonstrated this over the last decade based on his embrace of antivaccine pseudoscience and other unscientific views. This time around, he fawned over antivaccine activist Robert F. Kennedy Jr.


Arguably Maher reached his peak of antivaccine advocacy through his weekly HBO talk show, Real Time With Bill Maher, five years ago, when the H1N1 pandemic was going on and public health officials were working hard to persuade people to get vaccinated against H1N1 influenza. Indeed, it got so bad that his own guests, such as Bill Frist and Bob Costas, were openly dissing him on his own show for his antivaccine views. Perhaps my favorite example came from Bob Costas, who in response to a wild claim by Maher that he doesn’t worry about getting the flu, even in the crowded confines of an airplane because of his superior lifestyle that apparently made him immune, blurted out, “Oh, come on, Superman!” Even worse, a friend of Maher, Michael Shermer, published an “Open Letter to Bill Maher on Vaccinations” in—of all places—The Huffington Post, which led Maher to respond, both on his show (in which he referred to vaccination as a “risky medical procedure”) and in a post on HuffPo himself entitled “Vaccination: A Conversation Worth Having“. It was, as a certain “friend of the blog” put it, a pyre of stupidity.

After early 2010, however, Maher seemed to drop (or at least deemphasize) his promotion of antivaccine viewpoints and quackery on Real Time

 

[dank69]

We used to be able to buy pseudoephedrine pills at wallmart, talk about an energy boost

No doz. Stuff was great, hehe.

 

[Paratus]

We used to be able to buy pseudoephedrine pills at wallmart, talk about an energy boost

Pretty sure you still can if your Wal-Mart has a pharmacy. Just have to provide a driver license and sign a form.

I’ve got some 12 hour stuff at home as it’s the only thing that lets me breath with a head cold. But I can’t sleep worth a damn if I take one over night.

No doz. Stuff was great, hehe.

I thought no doz was caffeine pills?

 

[s0me0nesmind1]

Pretty sure you still can if your Wal-Mart has a pharmacy. Just have to provide a driver license and sign a form.

I’ve got some 12 hour stuff at home as it’s the only thing that lets me breath with a head cold. But I can’t sleep worth a damn if I take one over night.

I thought no doz was caffeine pills?

Before ephedrine was outlawed inside of fat-burners / diet pills, it did contain ephedrine along with the caffeine.

Ephedrine Caffeine is still to this day used for dieting, and it worked DAMN good for me when I had my big weight loss from 330 to ~170. Google "EC Stack".

It was outlawed because diet pill makers are dumb dumbs and played games of "Let's include more ephedrine than our competitor so people will lose more weight!"... Reality is if you take a simple low dose it's absolutely fine.

Anyhow, you can still buy ephedrine today over the counter like Paratus said, just look behind the counter at any pharmacy and look for Bronkaid.

 

[fskimospy]

Pretty sure you still can if your Wal-Mart has a pharmacy. Just have to provide a driver license and sign a form.

I’ve got some 12 hour stuff at home as it’s the only thing that lets me breath with a head cold. But I can’t sleep worth a damn if I take one over night.

I thought no doz was caffeine pills?

Yup, get the real meth-y cold medicine from behind the counter. It's simply amazing how much more effective it is.

 

[hal2kilo]

Was watching Bill Maher when he decided to bring this guy on. Was curious how P&N feels on this?

Apologies for the crappy video, but it's the only one of it I can find on Youtube

He's trying to make it seem like "I'm not an anti-vaxxer, but there are a lot of known issues with vaccinations"... To which I say.. fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck you. Regardless of any 0.0001% of the population truth to this - everything you are saying - ESPECIALLY on public TV can only result in more misinformation, deception, and incompetent fools.... and he knows this.

OK, I admit it, your chances of something bad happening to you, is slightly more than your chance of winning Powerball.