Scouts and Homosexuals... again!?

[brennan]

The Boy Scouts can be as ignorant as they want; what they can't do is promote that ignorance with my tax dollars. They absolutely have a soverign right to allow or deny membership based on whatever 18th-century standard they want. But once they accept funding from government agencies, they are subject to equal protection challenges. The Supreme Court didn't address this specific issue, but if they do, I'm reasonably confident that they'll hold that the Scouts have to accept gays or get their government funding stripped.

They want to be cretins with private dollars, good on them. Using my money is an entirely different issue.

-brennan

 

[brennan]

blueghost75:

Actually, the Scouts *officially* share your opinion; that is, they specifically hold that religion and heterosexuality are absolutely essential to good citizenship. This is a laughably insane doctrine, but they agree with you on it.

-brennan

 

[Moonbeam]

blueghost75, I don't agree with your opinion and Harvey's reaction is fine with me, but I have a different reaction to to now that you've said more. You experience some inner revulsion to homosexuals and it is not exactly rare. I'm glad that whatever made you say what you said made you say it. It was very politically incorrect and I think it really is morally incorrect too, but hiding that feeling and pretending you are above it wouldn't really be much of an improvement. It has been my experience that letting go and really allowing our hate and disgust to flow out like vomit without hurting somebody, which in some small way you can do a bit of here, but not too bad, I hope, can be the first step to a cure. You seem to have an honesty about you, first to say something that will get you in trouble, and secondly to admit that you wouldn't act like that to a gay in his face. If you continue down the path of total dedication to personal integrity, and at the same time ask yourself what possible justification you can have for such vitriolic hate of the gay, you may begin to see that you are irrational. This may lead to the conclusion that you would rather be sane. My uncle used to beat gays up and brag about it. He had two gay daughters and managed to love them. People change. I hope you do.

I heard a story about a white reporter in Japan who was at the zoo watching some gorillas. A little Japanese boy watching them looked up at him and began to scream. He was freaked out by the Caucasian face. I'm in The SF Bay Area. Lots of gays and no big deal.

 

[blueghost75]

well said moonbeam.

this place is great for venting anger, etc, then thinking about it rationally.

after a little more thought, i would like to make this statement:

although I still have a problem with homosexuality, I still think that people should be able to live their lives as they please. If you choose to be homosexual, you are also choosing to accept the conseqeneces, such as discrimination, etc. If would be much better if you did not go around telling people that you are gay. A don't ask don't tell pollicy is the best solution, if you ask me.

i do not support depriving people of the right to live their lives as they choose, as long as it does not affect others. i do not support homosexuals either.

i still support the boy scouts 100%. if a school will not help out the boy scouts by providing building space to use on weekends, etc, then the school should not support any other private programs that use the school.

they specifically hold that religion and heterosexuality are absolutely essential to good citizenship

i support that statement, for the most part. Religion is a good thing, and it is necessary for the masses. I do not beleive in god myself, but I also consider myself to be a good citizen. I do volunteer work, I have good morals. I think heterosexuality is necessary for good citizenship. I support the traditional family values. You need a mom and dad, etc.......

 

[brennan]

Blueghost:

If you don't believe in God and about to become Eagle Scout, I suggest you tell your troop about this. If they follow the Scouts' bylaws, they will kick you out immediately. According to them, you *cannot* be a good citizen without believing in God. If you become an Eagle Scout without telling anyone, you've lied to them and violated their bylaws.

Look, I don't support this. But this is the organization you are a part of and are defending - an organization that, if they knew what you believed (or didn't), and if they adhered to their own laws, would kick you right the fsck out. Good luck with that.

-brennan

 

[uncouth]

I second that part about the Boy Scouts being anti-atheist like brennan said.

Being born to parents of different religions had put me in a bit of hot water when I was going for my Eagle because I am not actively affiliated with any religion. My troop is pretty accepting however and basicly limited to as long as someone believed in souls and that kind of thing they were in the clear. But upon reflection of my trail I would have to name homosexuality and atheism as the two big no-no's in scouting.

Good luck on getting your Eagle, blue. I won't think any less of you if you don't believe in God

More On Topic
The point of the article is that Schools cannot deny any given group access to their PUBLIC buildings. This issue being mentioned this time is whether schools should be able to limit their users to only those who are accepting of others. The answer is no. At present US Schools are legally binded to accept everyone and not discrimiinate. The Nazi's are allowed to march through Skokie, Illinois and the Boy Scouts are allowed to meet on public land and, if they desire, public buildings.

 

[RedFox1]

I'm an Eagle Scout and an Assistant Scoutmaster with a troop in Massachusetts. In the time I've worked with them, I'm pretty sure that we've had some gay scouts and gay leaders; they say that around 1 of every 10 people is homosexual. On the other hand, I have no way of knowing -- that sort of topic never really comes up. It's never really seemed important, either. On the other hand, if some leader was making a big display of their sexuality -- be it homo or hetero -- they'd probably be dismissed.

I think it's important to remember that most of the people the kids interact with in Scouting aren't professionals, they're just volunteers. They're parents of other kids in town, church leaders, and other people who do their best to give the kids a good experience.

Young people interact with sketchy characters every day, most of whom don't think twice about the impression they'll leave on the kids. Scouting on the other hand, right or wrong, does it's best to promote a set of healthy values that will help them grow. Even if you don't agree with all the values that Scouting promotes, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. For some kids, scouting is one of the few positive influences in their lives.

-RedFox1