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Scotland's 2nd Referendum

NAC4EV

NAC4EV

Golden Member
Scottish govt agrees to legislate for 2nd independence referendum

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon said her government started work on legislation for a new referendum on independence after the U.K. as a whole decided to quit the European Union while Scotland voted to remain.

By contrast Scotland voted to Remain, by 62% to 38%, with all 32 council areas backing continued EU membership on a turnout of 67%.
Ms Sturgeon said after the result Scotland had delivered an "unequivocal" vote to remain in the EU, and that a second referendum on Scottish independence was now "highly likely".
Speaking outside Bute House following today's meeting, Ms Sturgeon said a second referendum was now "very much on the table".

She added: "To ensure that option is a deliverable one in the required timescale, steps will be taken now to ensure the necessary legislation is in place. Cabinet this morning formally agreed that work."
 
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senseamp said:
UK is turning into UK-raine.
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Lol come you don't believe that, fact is plenty of Europeans have different opinions on remaining or leaving the EU, Wales for example voted mostly to leave, as you know so did England, so Scotland did not, you can't please everybody out there.

Also London in general voted highly to remain in EU.

End of the day it's not a big deal countries survive and move on.

There are pro's to leaving, sure I can argue pro's to staying, but then it's a case of bottle is half full or half empty scenario.
 
2014: Via referendum, Scotland decides that it should leave its laws and policies in the hands of England and Wales.
2016: England and Wales vote on something Scotland doesn't want. It's time to separate from them!

I find this whole situation to be highly amusing. Can anyone imagine Canada voting to become part of the US in 2014, and then in 2016 complain that it no longer has control of its own laws? Real life human behavior is dumber than anything a writer could dream of.
 
Spungo said:
I find this whole situation to be highly amusing. Can anyone imagine Canada voting to become part of the US in 2014, and then in 2016 complain that it no longer has control of its own laws? Real life human behavior is dumber than anything a writer could dream of.
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[FONT=&quot]In 1995 the Canadian Province of Quebec conducted a referendum to leave Canada and become [FONT=&quot]independent.[/FONT] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Parti Québécois was the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]provincial political party in power at the time.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] They just about won that vote.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Leave[/FONT] = 49[FONT=&quot].[/FONT]42%[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Stay [/FONT]= 50.58%

[/FONT] After the vote, many corporate head offices and financial institutions left the Province.🙁🙁

Canada won't join the USA.
 
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NAC4EV said:
[FONT=&quot]In 1995 the Canadian Province of Quebec conducted a referendum to leave Canada and become [FONT=&quot]independent.[/FONT] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Parti Québécois was the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]provincial political party in power at the time.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] They just about won that vote.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Leave[/FONT] = 49[FONT=&quot].[/FONT]42%[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Stay [/FONT]= 50.58%

[/FONT] After the vote, many corporate head offices and financial institutions left the Province.🙁🙁

Canada won't join the USA.
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Alberta might consider it given the right concessions and we'd gladly take them off your hands. Banff and tar sands, what's not to like?
 
glenn1 said:
Alberta might consider it given the right concessions and we'd gladly take them off your hands. Banff and tar sands, what's not to like?
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I don't see how anywhere would want to join the US with the way our politics are currently going here.
 
thraashman said:
I don't see how anywhere would want to join the US with the way our politics are currently going here.
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Never overestimate the intelligence of people.
If there were a vote where Canadians decided on whether or not the NSA should spy on them and listen in on all of their phone calls, it would probably be one of those 51% vs 49% referendums. At least 49% of people would bend over and get fisted by the NSA.

Back here in 'murica, we're still trying to decide if California's liberals should dictate the laws in Texas or if Texas conservatives should dictate the laws in California. The people who think states should have their own laws are considered crazy.
 
NAC4EV said:
[FONT=&quot]In 1995 the Canadian Province of Quebec conducted a referendum to leave Canada and become [FONT=&quot]independent.[/FONT] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Parti Québécois was the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]provincial political party in power at the time.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] They just about won that vote.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Leave[/FONT] = 49[FONT=&quot].[/FONT]42%[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]Stay [/FONT]= 50.58%

[/FONT] After the vote, many corporate head offices and financial institutions left the Province.🙁🙁

Canada won't join the USA.
Click to expand...

In 1995 many of the corporate offices that were left decided to pack up and leave. The biggest exodus of corporate head offices and business brain drain happened before the first referendum vote in 1980. Essentially everybody who was anybody left the province before 1980, that exodus contributed to jump starting Toronto as we see it today, as well as helping many US cities rise up.

Could something like that happen to the UK, and London in particular? Possibly, other EU countries would be the benefactors of such an exodus.
 
Yakk said:
Could something like that happen to the UK, and London in particular? Possibly, other EU countries would be the benefactors of such an exodus.
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I doubt it. The UK is one of the more business friendly parts of Europe. In contrast, Quebec is generally considered the least business friendly part of Canada.
 
It's not very clear that Scotland could get back into the EU if they won their Independence as Cameron has just hinted at in the commons, Spain especially has a history with Scotland are unlikely to allow them access, any 1 of the remaining 27 countries can veto countries joining, it has to be unanimous.

I think with such large uncertainty regarding re-joining the EU and a scottish referendum to leave the UK will likely fail (again), the polling on this show that it's pretty close but suggestive that scotts might not even support a 2nd referendum.
 
LONDON - Trading was suspended in shares of Barclays and Royal Bank of Scotland on Monday following heavy losses on the London Stock Exchange. Barclays share price was down 10.3 per cent and RBS was down 15 per cent, the Independent reported, triggering automatic circuit breakers that kick in when a share price falls more than 8 per cent.
Barclays and RBS shares were offline for about five minutes, a spokesperson for the London Stock Exchange said.
 
NAC4EV said:
Barclays and RBS shares were offline for about five minutes, a spokesperson for the London Stock Exchange said.
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I had to check these just to see what the graphs look like. Are European banks insolvent or something? They stopped paying dividends in 2008. Companies only do that when the financial situation is dire. The financials for RBS look horrible too. Even Barrick Gold continued paying tiny dividends when mining companies were being massacred in the past few years.

RBS graph

RBS Financials
Equity at the end of
2012: 68,678
2013: 58,742
2014: 55,763
2015: 53,431
The company pays no dividends and its equity is still shrinking? It looks like I'm reading the numbers for JC Penney or some other bankrupt company.

Barclays is a pile of shit too.
https://finance.yahoo.com/q/ks?s=BCS
Return on Assets (ttm): 0.05%
Return on Equity (ttm): 0.94%

Now contrast that with a bank that is actually solvent. Royal Bank of Canada (RY).
https://finance.yahoo.com/q/ks?s=RY
Return on Assets (ttm): 0.92% (18x better than Barclays)
Return on Equity (ttm): 15.97% (17x better than Barclays)
 
thraashman said:
I don't see how anywhere would want to join the US with the way our politics are currently going here.
Click to expand...

I would love to see the northern states secede and join Canada as a new country. Then we could build a big wall on our southern border.....
 
bshole said:
I would love to see the northern states secede and join Canada as a new country. Then we could build a big wall on our southern border.....
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Woah, woah, woah there. I live in Georgia and I do not want to get stuck in the Christianistan that gets left behind, but I also don't want to give up my relatively mild winters by moving to the cold, cold north.
 
Spungo said:
Never overestimate the intelligence of people.
If there were a vote where Canadians decided on whether or not the NSA should spy on them and listen in on all of their phone calls, it would probably be one of those 51% vs 49% referendums. At least 49% of people would bend over and get fisted by the NSA.

Back here in 'murica, we're still trying to decide if California's liberals should dictate the laws in Texas or if Texas conservatives should dictate the laws in California. The people who think states should have their own laws are considered crazy.
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Most state laws are actually more strongly enforced, or you would have Feds bustin people for Marijuana use in Colorado etc already, for starters.
 
Spungo said:
I doubt it. The UK is one of the more business friendly parts of Europe. In contrast, Quebec is generally considered the least business friendly part of Canada.
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I agree the UK is a lot more business friendly and oriented. However Quebec was not always so unfriendly towards business either. Prior to the first referendum Montreal was building towards being a major business hub in North America through the 60s and early 70s. All that came to a screeching halt mid-70s, with the election of a separatist and business unfriendly party with most major corporations of the time all exiting Montreal as fast as they could. Bringing all their experienced and highly educated personnel with them. That city and province never recouperated all they lost.

I really don't see the UK and London in particular going through the massive, massive corporate and brain drain Montreal did at the time, but keeping an eye on history never hurts.
 
PrincessFrosty said:
It's not very clear that Scotland could get back into the EU if they won their Independence as Cameron has just hinted at in the commons, Spain especially has a history with Scotland are unlikely to allow them access, any 1 of the remaining 27 countries can veto countries joining, it has to be unanimous.

I think with such large uncertainty regarding re-joining the EU and a scottish referendum to leave the UK will likely fail (again), the polling on this show that it's pretty close but suggestive that scotts might not even support a 2nd referendum.
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Polling is 60-40 Scotexit.
 
Spungo said:
2014: Via referendum, Scotland decides that it should leave its laws and policies in the hands of England and Wales.
2016: England and Wales vote on something Scotland doesn't want. It's time to separate from them!

I find this whole situation to be highly amusing. Can anyone imagine Canada voting to become part of the US in 2014, and then in 2016 complain that it no longer has control of its own laws? Real life human behavior is dumber than anything a writer could dream of.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I'm not remembering correctly, but I though one of the bigger reasons Scotland voted to remain with England was because of fears that their independence would mean they'd be automatically out of the EU with little chance of getting back in as an independent country. If so, now that England voted to leave the EU no reason to fear exclusion from the EU as reason to vote against independence.

Fern
 
Fern said:
Perhaps I'm not remembering correctly, but I though one of the bigger reasons Scotland voted to remain with England was because of fears that their independence would mean they'd be automatically out of the EU with little chance of getting back in as an independent country. If so, now that England voted to leave the EU no reason to fear exclusion from the EU as reason to vote against independence.

Fern
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Hell it probably improved an independent Scotland's chance at EU membership.

Apparently when England was voting to leave the EU they also got a shot at leaving the UK too.
 
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