Scarborough criticizes McCain over Iran, others on the right finally seeing the light

[Phokus]

It's quite obvious McCain and others on the right are using the protests to gain political advantage. They don't give a crap about the Iranian people (as evidenced by some of them previously wishing the US bomb Iran and some even wishing A-Jad remain in power to provide a boogeyman for both America and Israel to attack Iran).

However, to be fair, some on the right are waking up to this and understand Obama's measured approach is the most wise one. And this is why Israel's recent remarks hoping for the regime to fall actually hurts the protestor's movement.


Here's Joe Scarborough:

SCARBOROUGH: All we would do is undermine those people in the street, who the second that they are attached to the United States of America, the country after all that?s been known in Iran as the great Satan since 1979, we will undermine their cause ? It?s so shortsighted I find it stunning. [?]

What would John McCain and Lindsey Graham specifically have the president say? All of those people that are emailing in and telling me that I?m being liberal? Oh really? I?m being liberal? No I think it?s called restraint. Showing a little bit of restraint. Looking at the battlefield in front of you and not just running up Pickett?s Charge and getting gunned down. If you want to feel good about yourself ? and you can only feel good about yourself by screaming about the evils of Iran ? fine do that. But our leaders in Washington don?t need to do that because people will be routed in the street the second they are identified with the United States of America.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6_SylWmonk

Here's Lugar:

HARRY SMITH: Beyond watching?beyond supporting the idea that these disputed votes should be recounted, is there anything the United States can do?

LUGAR: No. I think for the moment our position is to allow the Iranians to work out their situation. When popular revolutions occur, they come really from the people. They?re generated by people power within the country. For us to become heavily involved in the election at this point is to give the clergy an opportunity to have an enemy?and to use us, really, to retain their power.

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/...disagrees-mccain-iran/

Here's George Will:

WILL: The president is being roundly criticized for insufficient, rhetorical support for what?s going on over there. It seems to me foolish criticism. The people on the streets know full well what the American attitude toward the regime is. And they don?t need that reinforced.

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/...ran-foolish-criticism/

Here's Peggy Noonan:

?To insist the American president, in the first days of the rebellion, insert the American government into the drama was shortsighted and mischievous,? she wrote, adding that ?the ayatollahs were only too eager to demonize the demonstrators as mindless lackeys of the Great Satan Cowboy Uncle Sam, or whatever they call us this week.?

 

[BarrySotero]

I've been reading Twitter, YouTube, Facebook for last 4 days - the people are definitely let down by Obama. This idea that Obama lending some moral support contaminates the struggle is stupid. Obama is right along with China and Russia which is where you expect him to be after abandoning Israel.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: BarrySotero
I've been reading Twitter, YouTube, Facebook for last 4 days - the people are definitely let down by Obama. This idea that Obama lending some moral support contaminates the struggle is stupid. Obama is right along with China and Russia which is where you expect him to be after abandoning Israel.

Please, i've been following twitter as well, and notice those 'disapointed' twitters are coming from partisan rightwingers. Someone mentioned over at SA that freepers have infiltrated twitter trying to convince iranians that Obama isn't on their side, which would certain explain some of the tweets. That would be the ultimate evil if true.

Actually fuck it, it probably is, after seeing this freep thread blaming obama for neda's death:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2276493/posts

Of course the regime will try to use 'the great satan' to deflect attention and try to hold onto power, that's what they've ALWAYS done. You'd have to be naive to think that isn't the case,.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

 

[Jaskalas]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

Maybe that is why this topic exists. To explain it away as a good idea.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

you don't give a shit that the theocrats in iran would use those words against the protestors. you don't give a shit about the iranians at all, just politics.

You should also read what obama said before you post.

"The Iranian government must understand that the world is watching. We mourn each and every innocent life that is lost. We call on the Iranian government to stop all violent and unjust actions against its own people. The universal rights to assembly and free speech must be respected, and the United States stands with all who seek to exercise those rights.

As I said in Cairo, suppressing ideas never succeeds in making them go away. The Iranian people will ultimately judge the actions of their own government. If the Iranian government seeks the respect of the international community, it must respect the dignity of its own people and govern through consent, not coercion.

Martin Luther King once said - "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice." I believe that. The international community believes that. And right now, we are bearing witness to the Iranian peoples' belief in that truth, and we will continue to bear witness."

 

[nageov3t]

wow, different people have different views on specific issues?

this news is earth shattering.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

Iran has already stated that the elections were free and fair.

Should the US start challenging the results, it would be viewed as meddling.

if there is to be a revolution, it will be considered legitamte only if the US hands are considered to be clean.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: loki8481
wow, different people have different views on specific issues?

this news is earth shattering.

What's not earth shattering is the partisans in the (R) camp who don't give a shit about the Iranian people and who are seeing a political opportunity to try to hurt Obama. You all roundly dismissed the notion that publicly supporting the protest too much would backfire. Just wanted to show some in your own camp think you're foolish.

 

[piasabird]

The Ayatola said God told him the elections were fair. That settles it. All hail their Corrupt Fake Religious Leaders!

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: loki8481
wow, different people have different views on specific issues?

this news is earth shattering.

What's not earth shattering is the partisans in the (R) camp who don't give a shit about the Iranian people and who are seeing a political opportunity to try to hurt Obama. You all roundly dismissed the notion that publicly supporting the protest too much would backfire. Just wanted to show some in your own camp think you're foolish.

Politicians are political?!?!?!?!?!? Call the press!

There are valid opinions on both sides of this issue. Reaching out to the opposition could embolden the protestors that a major world player is establishing diplomatic relations with a leader in waiting. Or it could solidfy the base of the country. Either way the regime is going to use the great satan line of logic regardless of what Obama says or does. So I wouldnt use that as a valid excuse to sit on ones hands.

We and the world would prefer regime change than a nuclear confrontation in the next decade. This tainted election may be a golden opportunity to make this happen with relatively little loss of life.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

Iran has already stated that the elections were free and fair.

Should the US start challenging the results, it would be viewed as meddling.

if there is to be a revolution, it will be considered legitamte only if the US hands are considered to be clean.

Thats just silly. Obama needs to stop being so timid with Iran. He is AFRAID to come out and support these people. He is showing WEAKNESS. The Iranian people should know we are behind them 100%. Biden and Hillary apparently both feel the same way according to some reports. His lack of action is only emboldening the Mullah's because they believe we won't get involved.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

No he's not a coward, nothing he could say would help them only hurt them.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: loki8481
wow, different people have different views on specific issues?

this news is earth shattering.

What's not earth shattering is the partisans in the (R) camp who don't give a shit about the Iranian people and who are seeing a political opportunity to try to hurt Obama. You all roundly dismissed the notion that publicly supporting the protest too much would backfire. Just wanted to show some in your own camp think you're foolish.

You mean like democrats did with 9/11/Iraq/Afghanistan/Katrina/etc? Welcome to the real world.

 

[Fear No Evil]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

No he's not a coward, nothing he could say would help them only hurt them.

I love it how you are trying to set this up as if he does nothing and the revolution fails, Obama was brilliant for not getting involved.. if it succeeds he will get the credit for it working. He is showing his weakness and lack of leadership here. Even Hillary and Biden think he needs to be less timid in his response.

 

[BarrySotero]

Originally posted by: Phokus
you don't give a shit that the theocrats in iran would use those words against the protestors. you don't give a shit about the iranians at all, just politics.

[/quote]

The holy rollers are about to blast the protesters big time and the idea they have another gear they aren't using yet because Obama is invisible is silly.

Keep in mind the most lethal enforcers in Iran now are not the police or the army but the goons more loyal to "Islam" than Iran or Iranians. This is why they bring in killers from
Lebanon and other places. Obama making Hallmark Card statements on the way to getting ice cream cones makes a violent slamdown easier. Obama has creepy habit of winking off the worst leaders and pissing on allies. Something is terribly wrong here

 

[techs]

The real traitors are here in this thread and in Congress.
You sicken me.

It should be obvious to even a mental retard that the US is looked at in Iran by many people the same way Americans look at Osama.

It should also be obvious to even a mental retard that any overt support the US gives the moderates in Iran would have the same effect as Bin Laden supporting a US candidate.
100 percent negative.

Of course, the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain are traitors to the moderates and democracy loving segment of Iran.
But we have seen the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain call Americans "terrorist lovers" just to score some political points.

There used to be a saying that politics ended at the oceans edge.
Since the Republican Neo-Cons and their propaganda outlet Fox News took control NOTHING is to low or mean or dangerous or anti-american, etc to use for political gain.
It really is a screw America and the world if it helps us mentality.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

Iran has already stated that the elections were free and fair.

Should the US start challenging the results, it would be viewed as meddling.

if there is to be a revolution, it will be considered legitamte only if the US hands are considered to be clean.

Thats just silly. Obama needs to stop being so timid with Iran. He is AFRAID to come out and support these people. He is showing WEAKNESS. The Iranian people should know we are behind them 100%. Biden and Hillary apparently both feel the same way according to some reports. His lack of action is only emboldening the Mullah's because they believe we won't get involved.

How is it weakness? The EASIEST thing for Obama to do would be to act like an irresponsible cowboy that you want him to be. Iran is not popular here or abroad. It's much harder for Obama to show restraint :roll:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6_SylWmonk

As Scaroborugh said, if a-jad is able to successfully tie the 'great satan' to the protestors, they'll REALLY get routed in the street.

 

[BarrySotero]

Actually a lot of Iranians like America and are a bit smitten with it. America is more popular in Iran and any other ME state. Back to class Techs.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: techs
The real traitors are here in this thread and in Congress.
You sicken me.

It should be obvious to even a mental retard that the US is looked at in Iran by many people the same way Americans look at Osama.

It should also be obvious to even a mental retard that any overt support the US gives the moderates in Iran would have the same effect as Bin Laden supporting a US candidate.
100 percent negative.

Of course, the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain are traitors to the moderates and democracy loving segment of Iran.
But we have seen the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain call Americans "terrorist lovers" just to score some political points.

There used to be a saying that politics ended at the oceans edge.
Since the Republican Neo-Cons and their propaganda outlet Fox News took control NOTHING is to low or mean or dangerous or anti-american, etc to use for political gain.
It really is a screw America and the world if it helps us mentality.

They're not traitors, just political opportunists.

 

[techs]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: techs
The real traitors are here in this thread and in Congress.
You sicken me.

It should be obvious to even a mental retard that the US is looked at in Iran by many people the same way Americans look at Osama.

It should also be obvious to even a mental retard that any overt support the US gives the moderates in Iran would have the same effect as Bin Laden supporting a US candidate.
100 percent negative.

Of course, the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain are traitors to the moderates and democracy loving segment of Iran.
But we have seen the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain call Americans "terrorist lovers" just to score some political points.

There used to be a saying that politics ended at the oceans edge.
Since the Republican Neo-Cons and their propaganda outlet Fox News took control NOTHING is to low or mean or dangerous or anti-american, etc to use for political gain.
It really is a screw America and the world if it helps us mentality.

They're not traitors, just political opportunists.

No. They are traitors to America, American ideals, the Iranian people and just plain decent human beings.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: techs
The real traitors are here in this thread and in Congress.
You sicken me.

It should be obvious to even a mental retard that the US is looked at in Iran by many people the same way Americans look at Osama.

It should also be obvious to even a mental retard that any overt support the US gives the moderates in Iran would have the same effect as Bin Laden supporting a US candidate.
100 percent negative.

Of course, the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain are traitors to the moderates and democracy loving segment of Iran.
But we have seen the Republicans and asshats like Grampa McCain call Americans "terrorist lovers" just to score some political points.

There used to be a saying that politics ended at the oceans edge.
Since the Republican Neo-Cons and their propaganda outlet Fox News took control NOTHING is to low or mean or dangerous or anti-american, etc to use for political gain.
It really is a screw America and the world if it helps us mentality.

Seek help and stop using bold for an entire post nitwit.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil
Obama needs to come out in support of freedom of speech and the right of the people to hold free and fair elections in Iran without fear of being beaten down by a thug regime. Its absolutely stunning he refuses to do this. Reports are that even Biden and Clinton disagree with Obama's lack of support to the Iranian people.

Obama is a coward.

No he's not a coward, nothing he could say would help them only hurt them.

I love it how you are trying to set this up as if he does nothing and the revolution fails, Obama was brilliant for not getting involved.. if it succeeds he will get the credit for it working. He is showing his weakness and lack of leadership here. Even Hillary and Biden think he needs to be less timid in his response.

No you are showing your astounding ignorance. Get involved? You mean like his NeoCon predecessors? Yeah look how badly they fucked up when they "Got involved"

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: Fear No Evil

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: loki8481
wow, different people have different views on specific issues?

this news is earth shattering.

What's not earth shattering is the partisans in the (R) camp who don't give a shit about the Iranian people and who are seeing a political opportunity to try to hurt Obama. You all roundly dismissed the notion that publicly supporting the protest too much would backfire. Just wanted to show some in your own camp think you're foolish.

You mean like democrats did with 9/11/Iraq/Afghanistan/Katrina/etc? Welcome to the real world.

uh 9/11? (R)'s are the one's who abused 9/11, everything from the Iraq war to Rudy Giuliani's 2008 run (as joe biden said, the only thing that comes out of rudy's mouth is a noun, a verb, and 9/11)

Katrina? Please, that was one of the biggest blunders of the Bush administration, you think he doesn't deserve blame? are you nuts? He hired a crony that was completely unqualified to be head of FEMA (and it later turns out he warned bush of the floods on video!).

Afghanistan, yeah right, that was heavily politicized :roll:

Iraq? Having thousands of Americans killed and god knows how many iraqis over nonexistant wmd's isn't cause for criticism? Boy, give me some of that stuff you're smoking, i want some.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Common Courtesy
Iran has already stated that the elections were free and fair.

Should the US start challenging the results, it would be viewed as meddling.

if there is to be a revolution, it will be considered legitamte only if the US hands are considered to be clean.

yup


there is probably nothing iranis hate more than foreign interference. UK is number 1 on that list, with the US a close second. and they have long memories. mossadegh once remarked, 'it all started with that greek alexander.'