Sandy Bridge or Ivy Bridge [new build question] [need help]

[ttechf]

Hi,

I asked a similar question before but I've been doing a lot of research on my own too and it seems Ivy Bridge gets very hot very quick which if I had a huge case with tons of room and fans to cool it off with along with water cooling, I wouldn't worry about, but I don't and won't have that due to what my aim is and what Im trying to build.

I want to build a HTPC system.

This is the case I want - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811280022

I like it, it's slim. I know it's most likely not the best case for cooling but Im sure there can be a compromise here.

Some information

- This is a system I don't want to have to replace for many of years
- The max height of the heatsink in this case can be 85mm

- I will NOT be doing heavy gaming.

Okay, so with that said, I'm wondering if it's more of a viable option for me to just go with a Sandy Bridge i7-2600k or 2700k processor rather than a Ivy Bridge ANYTHING due to the heat in that case building up.

There aren't too many heatsinks that can fit inside that case due to all I got to work with is 85mm but there are a few good ones.

Perhaps someone can see and make sure these are good ones and if they would keep an overclocked Ivy Bridge down since I know already they'd work on a Sandy Bridge

- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835103177
[really like this one since the heat pipes have direct contact]

- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16835185097

Note - I don't need to overclock to something crazy like 5Ghz, but something like 4.2Ghz - 4.5Ghz would be nice and I'm not sure if I can do this with Ivy Bridge considering the case.

Here is the motherboard I want as well - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813157294


So, IF I DO go Sandy Bridge, am I really missing THAT much if I don't go Ivy Bridge? Graphics maybe?

So again, not sure if Ivy or Sandy is the right fit for me. Any comments or suggestions are welcome! Thanks! : )

 

[cmdrdredd]

Ivy has a much better iGPU. So you might not even need a PCIe video card if you just use the GPU integrated into the Ivy Bridge CPU. It's also faster for quicksync (video transcoding).

Ivy bridge only shows high temps when you are overclocking to levels that need over 1.3v. People assumed they could get 5Ghz and 1.4v like they might have on Sandy but it's not possible without as you have read, high temps. You can get 4.5Ghz at near stock voltage pretty easily and that doesn't take a massive heatsink.

 

[borisvodofsky]

If you really want to have a NICE htpc w/ good OC. Look for a case with 2x120mm fans right next to each other.

This way you can mount a Corsair H100 on the outside of the case. It'll be freaking amazing looking on the Outside IMHO.

And you can overclock the shit out of it.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811204042

This case is perfect.

Asus gene v, $200 Micro-atx
3770 i7, for battlefield, cuz you can
Corsair H100,

 

[ttechf]

Ivy has a much better iGPU. So you might not even need a PCIe video card if you just use the GPU integrated into the Ivy Bridge CPU. It's also faster for quicksync (video transcoding).

Ivy bridge only shows high temps when you are overclocking to levels that need over 1.3v. People assumed they could get 5Ghz and 1.4v like they might have on Sandy but it's not possible without as you have read, high temps. You can get 4.5Ghz at near stock voltage pretty easily and that doesn't take a massive heatsink.

Ah I see. So you think I will be okay with the newer architecture Ivy Bridge processor with all considered in my post? I never assumed I could get 5Ghz. Also, will that cooler master heatsink I linked in my post be good enough to get 4.5Ghz in that case?


Thanks! : )

 

[Phynaz]

If you really want to have a NICE htpc w/ good OC. Look for a case with 2x120mm fans right next to each other.

This way you can mount a Corsair H100 on the outside of the case. It'll be freaking amazing looking on the Outside IMHO.

And you can overclock the shit out of it.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811204042

This case is perfect.

Why would you overclock a HTPC, and put it in a huge case?

HTPC = small and quiet.

And Boris, you really need to watch your language.

 

[ttechf]

If you really want to have a NICE htpc w/ good OC. Look for a case with 2x120mm fans right next to each other.

This way you can mount a Corsair H100 on the outside of the case. It'll be freaking amazing looking on the Outside IMHO.

And you can overclock the shit out of it.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811204042

This case is perfect.

Asus gene v, $200 Micro-atx
3770 i7, for battlefield, cuz you can
Corsair H100,

Gotta admit, it's a nice case BUT it's a little big and I've never heard of that brand to be honest. I'm also not a big gamer. I also didnt really want to pay more than $150 for the micro ATX motherboard, lol.

Thank you though, I will save that case incase I change my mind. : )

 

[ttechf]

Why would you overclock a HTPC, and put it in a huge case?

HTPC = small and quiet.

And Boris, you really need to watch your language.

If you are asking ME why I would want to overclock a HTPC, because it will be my main computer as well. It will be my "daily driver", everything I do. So I want to be able to have a powerful processor that will last me years to come. And why overclock? Because why not try? I never said I needed 4.5Ghz or whatnot, but even if I can overclock a little over the stock speed of 3.4Ghz or 3.5Ghz, to 3.9Ghz or 4Ghz, I find it worth it.


Thanks : )

 

[cmdrdredd]

Ah I see. So you think I will be okay with the newer architecture Ivy Bridge processor with all considered in my post? I never assumed I could get 5Ghz. Also, will that cooler master heatsink I linked in my post be good enough to get 4.5Ghz in that case?


Thanks! : )

4.5Ghz maybe, but you will probably get 4.2-4.3 Ghz almost guaranteed. It's hard to say.

Are you looking to go with a PCIe card for this or will you be using the iGPU?

 

[borisvodofsky]

Gotta admit, it's a nice case BUT it's a little big and I've never heard of that brand to be honest. I'm also not a big gamer. I also didnt really want to pay more than $150 for the micro ATX motherboard, lol.

Thank you though, I will save that case incase I change my mind. : )

Asus also makes the Z77 Mini-Itx board. it's also $200 but check it's got 8+2 phase vrm. Overclocks just like the desktop versions.

AND you can put this thing inside a tiny asian girl.


Also if you like cube cases, Check out this AMAZING build using the mini-itx. It fits together so well it's shocking. packing so much power in such a small box.


http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1922/1/

 

[ttechf]

4.5Ghz maybe, but you will probably get 4.2-4.3 Ghz almost guaranteed. It's hard to say.

Are you looking to go with a PCIe card for this or will you be using the iGPU?

Well, I had a huge topic on this weeks ago here and I think the ending result for the dollar budget to performance ratio was I go with the HD 7770.



Thanks again. : )

 

[borisvodofsky]

7850 is the best bang for buck, you won't regret it. because on the 7770 it struggles on modern games @ 1080p.

While the 7850 does very well at 1080p, perfect for htpc.

 

[cmdrdredd]

Well, if you are using a PCIe card to handle all your video output tasks then I'd go with sandy bridge. For what I think you'll need and be doing, you wouldn't need PCIe 3.0 and the iGPU. You could benefit from higher clock speeds on the CPU itself.

 

[ttechf]

Well, if you are using a PCIe card to handle all your video output tasks then I'd go with sandy bridge. For what I think you'll need and be doing, you wouldn't need PCIe 3.0 and the iGPU. You could benefit from higher clock speeds on the CPU itself.

Yeah, I thought the same myself actually. I just a tiny bit weird about buying "old" architecture when there is newer out, you know? lol. I'd love to go Ivy Bridge because it's further future proofing myself but if it's not right for me, it's not right.

So if I have my HD 7770 in and running Sandy Bridge, the IGPU doesn't matter anymore one bit, right?

Also, that case I really love, it's sleek, but I'm not sure if this is considered 'wimpy' but it "only" has 3 40mm fans in the back. Is that bad or should I be fine?

Thanks!

 

[cmdrdredd]

Right, you are going to use the HD 7770 for your video output and video acceleration. The iGPU will remain unused.

As for the case, if you are overclocking you probably want a little more in the way of air circulation.

 

[dma0991]

If you are asking ME why I would want to overclock a HTPC, because it will be my main computer as well. It will be my "daily driver", everything I do. So I want to be able to have a powerful processor that will last me years to come. And why overclock? Because why not try? I never said I needed 4.5Ghz or whatnot, but even if I can overclock a little over the stock speed of 3.4Ghz or 3.5Ghz, to 3.9Ghz or 4Ghz, I find it worth it.


Thanks : )

You don't have to overclock from the get-go, you can still leave it at stock and should you need the performance down the road, bump it a couple of MHz. Honestly, you won't feel a tremendous amount of difference going from stock to 4.5GHz unless you're running programs that would utilize 100% load on every cores. For a day to day use scenario and gaming thrown into it, a stock SB/IB performance is plenty.

Don't expect too much from a closed loop watercooling unit, it will be cool enough but you're running it in a cramped case, don't push your luck. Have a look at cases like the Bitfenix Prodigy.

 

[ttechf]

You don't have to overclock from the get-go, you can still leave it at stock and should you need the performance down the road, bump it a couple of MHz. Honestly, you won't feel a tremendous amount of difference going from stock to 4.5GHz unless you're running programs that would utilize 100% load on every cores. For a day to day use scenario and gaming thrown into it, a stock SB/IB performance is plenty.

Don't expect too much from a closed loop watercooling unit, it will be cool enough but you're running it in a cramped case, don't push your luck. Have a look at cases like the Bitfenix Prodigy.

Hey, thanks for the honest answer, appreciate it. I will remember this.

 

[ttechf]

Right, you are going to use the HD 7770 for your video output and video acceleration. The iGPU will remain unused.

As for the case, if you are overclocking you probably want a little more in the way of air circulation.

Yeah, blah. I really like that case. I wish there was something more I could do to make the ventilation better.

I know I don't even need an i7, not for what I use a computer for, but I figure, why not buy the best since I can afford it and since I want it to last me a bunch of years, know what I mean?

This is what I use my computer for and maybe WOULD like to use it for when I do build.

- Internet - having 20 tabs open
- Music
- Movies
- File conversions - [FLAC to mp3] / [AVI to MP4]
- Playing flash games
- Itunes

- MODERATE Gaming [in the future]
- Photoshop / Illustrator [in the future]

And really, I don't want TO LAG, lol. So if it takes $300 to not lag and to have a swift computer experience, so be it. lol. : )

 

[cmdrdredd]

Why not just upgrade to a normal tower?

 

[Yuriman]

This is what I use my computer for and maybe WOULD like to use it for when I do build.

- Internet - having 20 tabs open
- Music
- Movies
- File conversions - [FLAC to mp3] / [AVI to MP4]
- Playing flash games
- Itunes

- MODERATE Gaming [in the future]
- Photoshop / Illustrator [in the future]

And really, I don't want TO LAG, lol. So if it takes $300 to not lag and to have a swift computer experience, so be it. lol. : )

The i7 is unnecessary to achieve what you want but it can't hurt. An i5 will still impress and save you $150, for what it's worth.

I'm voting for Ivy over Sandy here. 4.3-4.4ghz is easily obtainable on your typical chip and Ivy performs in the range of 1-300mhz better than SB. At this time you'll probably spend a little more for an Ivy chip, but you can get away with a slightly smaller power supply and it'll save you a few dollars on your electric bill - both from using less power and dumping less heat into your room.

Sandy has the potential to slightly outperform Ivy in most setups due to more overclocking headroom but it has its drawbacks too and is not the obviously better choice.

 

[ttechf]

Why not just upgrade to a normal tower?

Because I don't want a big bulky computer anymore. lol.


I wanted to put it on my glass shelf where my tv is. It has 3 glass shelves. The top where my tv is, my playstation 3 is on the 2nd and nothing is on the bottom third shelf. It would just save so much room for me and look great too. : )

 

[ttechf]

The i7 is unnecessary to achieve what you want but it can't hurt. An i5 will still impress and save you $150, for what it's worth.

I'm voting for Ivy over Sandy here. 4.3-4.4ghz is easily obtainable on your typical chip and Ivy performs in the range of 1-300mhz better than SB. At this time you'll probably spend a little more for an Ivy chip, but you can get away with a slightly smaller power supply and it'll save you a few dollars on your electric bill - both from using less power and dumping less heat into your room.

Sandy has the potential to slightly outperform Ivy in most setups due to more overclocking headroom but it has its drawbacks too and is not the obviously better choice.

Hey, thanks for your views and such but will 4.3-4.4Ghz be "easily obtainable" given my case and situation for Ivy Bridge and heat sink I picked out?

 

[Yuriman]

I would expect so, yes. Ivy is overclocking-limited more by thermals than Sandy is, but it puts out less heat. It's a matter of thermal density - Ivy is a smaller chip than Sandy is and getting the heat out of the core and into the heatsink is the issue, so increasing the size of your heatsink doesn't help much past a certain point. Most find that Ivy caps at around 4.5ghz without unusual cooling solutions. Any higher and you'll be hitting tjmax under heavy loads and causing throttling.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

I would wait for Haswell

 

[ttechf]

I would expect so, yes. Ivy is overclocking-limited more by thermals than Sandy is, but it puts out less heat. It's a matter of thermal density - Ivy is a smaller chip than Sandy is and getting the heat out of the core and into the heatsink is the issue, so increasing the size of your heatsink doesn't help much past a certain point. Most find that Ivy caps at around 4.5ghz without unusual cooling solutions. Any higher and you'll be hitting tjmax under heavy loads and causing throttling.

Thanks, just making sure Im safe before I buy anything. Dont want to buy the processor and case and heatsink and find out the processor gets WAY too hot.

 

[Yuriman]

Thanks, just making sure Im safe before I buy anything. Dont want to buy the processor and case and heatsink and find out the processor gets WAY too hot.

I run 4.5ghz on my Ivy and my chip gets up to around 95-98c running LinX. However in real-world usage patterns it rarely gets above the 70's. Plus, Ivy seems perfectly happy to run at 90c+ all day, and it's not dumping a bunch of heat into your room even so.