Sandorski's Wager v Paskel's Wager

[Dr. Zaus]

: Why waste time preparing for an afterlife, when the only Life you absolutely know you have may be the only chance you get to affect the Universe positively?

This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe.

Given the rewiring of the mind('preparing for an afterlife' is more enjoyable than any other earthly behavior) of those who have true faith in Christ(and will there for rely on his teachings in the bible, no war, selfishness or exploitation) there is no cost to a pious life, only benefit for themselves and society.

So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: DixyCrat

: Why waste time preparing for an afterlife, when the only Life you absolutely know you have may be the only chance you get to affect the Universe positively?

This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe.

Given the rewiring of the mind('preparing for an afterlife' is more enjoyable than any other earthly behavior) of those who have true faith in Christ(and will there for rely on his teachings in the bible, no war, selfishness or exploitation) there is no cost to a pious life, only benefit for themselves and society.

So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?

==============

"This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe."

That is True. The reason I wrote it was due to having Observed so many who have embraced an Afterlife, yet not embracing a positive Life. By "positive" I don't mean "Righteous" or "Holy", but one where the Person seeks to improve things around them.

"So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?"

Self-Righteousness. The act of looking down upon Others, coming to think of Oneself as superior. This happens all too often and seems to be the Majority of certain segments of the Religious.

These are the people more interested in Conversion and get defensive regarding the Works vs Grace debate. They got theirs and don't Need to do anything positive, so they don't. This Life has become for them something which stands in the way of their ultimate goal, the Afterlife. This manifests itself in many self-destructive ways, including Violence.

 

[Dr. Zaus]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: DixyCrat

: Why waste time preparing for an afterlife, when the only Life you absolutely know you have may be the only chance you get to affect the Universe positively?

This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe.

Given the rewiring of the mind('preparing for an afterlife' is more enjoyable than any other earthly behavior) of those who have true faith in Christ(and will there for rely on his teachings in the bible, no war, selfishness or exploitation) there is no cost to a pious life, only benefit for themselves and society.

So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?

==============

"This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe."

That is True. The reason I wrote it was due to having Observed so many who have embraced an Afterlife, yet not embracing a positive Life. By "positive" I don't mean "Righteous" or "Holy", but one where the Person seeks to improve things around them.

I think you are totally right here and its why I quoted your 'wager' as best as possible without trying to interject my own pov into the title/subtitle.

"So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?"

Self-Righteousness. The act of looking down upon Others, coming to think of Oneself as superior. This happens all too often and seems to be the Majority of certain segments of the Religious.

These are the people more interested in Conversion and get defensive regarding the Works vs Grace debate. They got theirs and don't Need to do anything positive, so they don't. This Life has become for them something which stands in the way of their ultimate goal, the Afterlife. This manifests itself in many self-destructive ways, including Violence.

No doubt.

The fact that no christian is any better than someone else simply because they believe is something I have heard often in church but seems not to get very far among the parishioners.

Do you think it's our human nature to simply do as little as possible to make it so that we can brush our teeth in the morning?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: DixyCrat

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: DixyCrat

: Why waste time preparing for an afterlife, when the only Life you absolutely know you have may be the only chance you get to affect the Universe positively?

This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe.

Given the rewiring of the mind('preparing for an afterlife' is more enjoyable than any other earthly behavior) of those who have true faith in Christ(and will there for rely on his teachings in the bible, no war, selfishness or exploitation) there is no cost to a pious life, only benefit for themselves and society.

So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?

==============

"This assumes that preparing for an afterlife does not have positive effects on the universe."

That is True. The reason I wrote it was due to having Observed so many who have embraced an Afterlife, yet not embracing a positive Life. By "positive" I don't mean "Righteous" or "Holy", but one where the Person seeks to improve things around them.

I think you are totally right here and its why I quoted your 'wager' as best as possible without trying to interject my own pov into the title/subtitle.

"So how do unmitigated benefits in the present and a promise of eternal benefits in the future come to conflict with positively affecting the universe?"

Self-Righteousness. The act of looking down upon Others, coming to think of Oneself as superior. This happens all too often and seems to be the Majority of certain segments of the Religious.

These are the people more interested in Conversion and get defensive regarding the Works vs Grace debate. They got theirs and don't Need to do anything positive, so they don't. This Life has become for them something which stands in the way of their ultimate goal, the Afterlife. This manifests itself in many self-destructive ways, including Violence.

No doubt.

The fact that no christian is any better than someone else simply because they believe is something I have heard often in church but seems not to get very far among the parishioners.

Do you think it's our human nature to simply do as little as possible to make it so that we can brush our teeth in the morning?

It certainly is Human Nature. However, that doesn't mean all Humans do the same, it means that all Humans have the potential of doing the same. It's rather complicated and I am having difficulty in putting it into words, but it seems to me that Humans tend to already have a natural Humility when on their own. Other natural tendencies tend to draw individuals into groups and groups change the Individuals in turn. The Group is an entity(for lack of better term) of its' own and can lead Individuals toward something beneficial or non-beneficial. Despite attempts to moderate Group influences from afar, a Group primarily consists of the Individuals in the local sense and that's why on occasion something bizarre occurs in some location and not another. Or put in another way, 1 Church in a Denomination does something the denomination has to Condemn(usually) or possibly Praise.

Although the original "Wager" is Religious centered, it could be reworded to address many more things. Politics, of course, but also something as mundane as Automobile(just as one example) enthusiast groups which tend to breed certain traits at times that are downright annoying and often bear little resemblance to the intended purpose of the Group.

I suppose I'm drifting away from the topic of the "Wager". However, I think it and your points both apply to the heart of it.