San Francisco tries get tough approach with homeless

[Steeplerot]

Kind of odd isn't it that he claims to be a business owner but is advocating ideas which if taken to through their full course would sink any business, including his own.

Which is why the last person to get business advice from is a conservative. Funny how reality seems to always work against the rw ideologues.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Which is why the last person to get business advice from is a conservative. Funny how reality seems to always work against the rw ideologues.

What type of business are you running?

 

[Steeplerot]

LOL, only here in P&N can somebody think that a country where nearly half of GDP ends up in the hands of government at some level is being defunded.

Also, LOL at the idiot complaining about unregulated media as he astroturfs for his team right here in an unregulated forum where he's allowed to spew all the garbage he wants with no repercussions. Yeah, damn the first amendment.

Anyhow, thanks for the advice, but an unemployed loser self admitted conservative/libertarian collecting welfare like a hypocrite is the last person who should be casting stones bubba.

Are you really this stupid or do you like the pain? Well, I could use a lil bitch then. Go sweep up. Have a beer to drown your sorrows of being a failure on me, share the wealth and all that comrade. 😉

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Anyhow, thanks for the advice, but an unemployed loser self admitted conservative/libertarian collecting welfare like a hypocrite is the last person who should be casting stones bubba.

Gottcha! Your just running your mouth as par for the course.

 

[Steeplerot]

Gottcha! Your just running your mouth as par for the course.

Actually he is unemployed and on the dole ironically offering business/self-responsibility advice on the internet. In case you missed out on that tidbit of irony in this forum.

He is either too stupid and full of himself to realize what a idiot he looks like or enjoys getting abuse heaped on him for his own irresponsibility. personally imo S&M is best left in the bedroom instead of a public forum.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Actually he is unemployed and on the dole ironically offering business/self-responsibility advice on the internet. In case you missed out on that tidbit of irony in this forum.

He is either too stupid and full of himself to realize what a idiot he looks like or enjoys getting abuse heaped on him for his own irresponsibility. I dunno, S&M was never really my thing.

Okay but what type of business are you running?

 

[Steeplerot]

Okay but what type of business are you running?

Tell you what, how about I come over to your "pad in the city" and we can discuss it over a beer. ()🙂

Heh, that is if you are not lying and really live here instead of in walnut creek like you said a week or so ago. 😉

Anyhow
I run a largish nightclub and live music events in SF's SOMA district. If you read the SF Weekly/Guardian EBayExpress you would know which one. (or myself as I have been in it a few times in interviews and such about nightlife)

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Tell you what, how about I come over to your "pad in the city" and we can discuss it over a beer. ()🙂

I run a nightclub and live music events in SF. If you read the SF Weekly you would know which one. (or myself as I have been in it a few times in interviews and such about nightlife)

So you can't employ the homeless people around your area to do menial work at your night club or at these music events? Instead you believe its best to give out money to them so they can continue being homeless.

Oh and what are your thoughts/views on the Entertainment Commission and the issues around them in SF?

 

[Steeplerot]

Oh and what your thoughts/views on the Entertainment Commission and the issue around them in SF?

Don't get me started on the fucking ABC (alcohol beverage control). That needs a whole other thread. But probably a bit too local of an issue for here.

I have actually argued with Newsom in person about this stuff in city hall and meetings.

ABC's newest clusterfuck
http://blogs.sfweekly.com/shookdown/2011/03/slims_noise_complaints_an_open.php

 

[_GTech]

So you can't employ the homeless people around your area to do menial work at your night club or at these music events? Instead you believe its best to give out money to them so they can continue being homeless.

Oh and what your thoughts/views on the Entertainment Commission and the issue around them in SF?

I find it entertaining that you ask those posting their thoughts to take in and help the homeless and not just rant on about the travesty, which to me is a great way to be an activist, albeit a non-productive one.

I don't live near SF, so I can't really afford to help them from way over here, though my heart goes out to them being bashed by legislation which is clearly immoral.

So tell me, what do you see as a real solution to the problem?

 

[Steeplerot]

So you can't employ the homeless people around your area to do menial work at your night club or at these music events?

The homeless are always hanging out, why not put them to work? They sweep up the cig butts off my sidewalk get their beer and piss off elsewhere happy.

Most are friendly enough sorts down on their luck, you treat people with respect regardless of their lot in life and its amazing how people treat/look out for you.

It's a philosophy of life that works well enough for me. But the tricky part is knowing when people are taking advantage that is the key to making it in the hustle the world. and goes for everyone not just homeless.

 

[_GTech]

The homeless are always hanging out, why not put them to work, they get their beer and piss off. Most are friendly enough sorts down on their luck, you treat people with respect regardless of their lot in life and its amazing how people treat/look out for you.

It's a philosophy of life that works well enough for me.

You know after reading that article you gotta just love freedom of speech huh? Maybe the woman just needs to be dealt with, she is clearly not getting the message...

I know if I had a $100,000 I would have had her dealt with a long time ago, I just love all these crack heads & drunks in our neighborhood, it's quite comical what they are willing to do for a fist full of cash.. 😀

Sounds like you could put these homeless people to work indeed! 😀 I can just visualize the congregation outsider her house, lol...

 

[Steeplerot]

You know after reading that article you gotta just love freedom of speech huh? Maybe the woman should be just dealt with huh?

I know if I had a $100,000 I would have had her dealt with a long time ago, I just love all these crack heads in our neighborhood, it's quite comical what they will do for a fist full of cash.. 😀

Sounds like you could put these homeless people to work indeed! 😀

That woman is obviously a disturbed person, Slims may have got shut down for a week (they are still open actually -they cant serve though!) but this should draw some attention to her craziness and the stupidity of killing the goose that lays the city very golden eggs in terms of liquor taxes etc.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

The homeless are always hanging out, why not put them to work, they get their beer and piss off.

That's not the issue being address though by the city via prop L. Those who want to work or who want to change their lives around have plenty of ways (even if it takes time and handwork on their part) to do so in the city.

Most are friendly enough sorts down on their luck, you treat people with respect regardless of their lot in life and its amazing how people treat/look out for you.

Yet those aren't the ones prop L is addressing.

Again those who are truly down and out on their luck are the ones who find a ways out and aren't sitting around in their own filth, passed out on alcohol or handing around in front of store front with their friends living the "homeless" lifestyles because they think its "Cool bro! I ain't gonna let the man tell me what to do! Give me your change cuzz you can afford it!".

It's a philosophy of life that works well enough for me.

Unless you are blindly feeding people who view being out on the street as a lifestyle choice. Of which it is eventually done at the expense of those of use who work for living and pay taxes because eventually someone has to clean up their mess.Or worse helping to contribute to the alcoholism and drug addiction of others also on the street.

 

[Steeplerot]

And as for the accusation that I am selfish in my choices in employees both of my rsident DJs -WERE- on SSI probably for their lifetimes. Neither collect ANY assistance now and are full-time employed and awesome hardworking people. (if you are patient sometimes) the whole deal is a co-op worker owned establishment from bottom up. I am the "boss" but we collectively plan our courses of action democratically styled. It has worked well for us, regardless of this economy we have grown unlike a good part of the USA that is shuttering, we are growing still. *knock on wood*

 

[_GTech]

It doesn't matter who it addresses, it's a matter of the bill just being wrong.

Abuse will ensue, other bills like it will pop up, stating that you can't do this or that, more fines will be levied and more frivolous laws will get passed.

Come one these people have nowhere to go, so if they sit down on a curb because they are tired, that gives you the right to throw mud at them & even fine these poor people?

There is already what is called Loitering laws, they know they can't stand in front of businesses and beg, they can't panhandle either, their are laws against that too. So, what I'm saying is, this law is unnecessary, heartless, and unethical.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

I have actually argued with Newsom in person about this stuff in city hall and meetings.

When was this? Newsom had a horrible attendance record at BoS meetings mostly because their relationship between each other was antagonistic.

ABC's newest clusterfuck
http://blogs.sfweekly.com/shookdown/2011/03/slims_noise_complaints_an_open.php[/QUOTE]

The Slims issue appears to be a knee jerk reaction to the past criticism of very valid and real problems with the EC's handling of lack over sufficient oversight and licensing past events and/or night clubs, etc in which people have been beaten, stabbed and/or killed. Mainly to do with events that feature a "hip-hop" theme. Like the one which had a German tourist end up being shot due to gang fight outside a event held for teens.

 

[Steeplerot]

Unless you are blindly feeding people who view being out on the street as a lifestyle choice.

This is a temporary choice people make thanks to problems they are going through, I am not one to give up on my fellow man. Plenty of my friends have gone through drug addictions and alcoholism and homelessness and are doing fine now as people did not give up on them.

I feed the pigeons also, sure, why bother, but why not help another living creature? What else is there to do but try to be a good person with the small time we have on the planet? A drunk lying in the alleyway is a lot less of a problem to me then ohhh..wall st gangsters. They are the real problem affecting me and the economy, not some dude hitting bottom at that point in their lives.

 

[Steeplerot]

in which people have been beaten, stabbed and/or killed. Mainly to do with events that feature a "hip-hop" theme. Like the one which had a German tourist end up being shot due to gang fight outside a event held for teens.

I am a city promoter, I have nothing to do with hip hop gangster shit, those are east bay promoters and their crowds coming to the city to act like asses with no respect. Being a hip hop promoter is a fast money scam really until someone gets shot. Then all clubs/promoters look like shit.

We are known for having 500 people and one bored doorpserson. I dont put up with any of those kinds of crowds, I was hosting dubstep parties for a bit for extra cash and had to stop after 2 events, I broke up more fights in those 2 nights then 20 years of being a bouncer at my usual events.

 

[Steeplerot]

When was this? Newsom had a horrible attendance record at BoS meetings mostly because their relationship between each other was antagonistic.

Back when ABC shut down DNA Lounge for a month when a undercover ABC inspector saw some guy dancer's nad hanging out the side of his g-string on a gay-themed night. "Harmful to SOMA's moral fabric"
Like a dudes ball is a big deal in a city where 10 blocks down in the castro people are having gay sex on dance floors. :sneaky:

I know SF is the most awesome place to live in the USA, but social conservatives can piss off if they don't like our "values" back to the middle-west. Probably got turned down trying to make a pass at another dude or something, pretty typical lulz

 

[DucatiMonster696]

It doesn't matter who it addresses, it's a matter of the bill just being wrong.

Abuse will ensue, other bills like it will pop up, stating that you can't do this or that, more fines will be levied and more frivolous laws will get passed.

Abuse? Really can you point to case in which this is being abused? Can you cite the loop holes in this law that will lead to abuse and the sort of abuse that would ensue?

Come one these people have nowhere to go, so if they sit down on a curb because they are tired, that gives you the right to throw mud at them & even fine these poor people?

Why are you pleading here?

This had nothing to do with "tired" people. It had everything to do with groups of people (passed out drunks or addicts) camping out at a store front, harassing. intimidating and in some cases physically assaulting customers, or in the some cases home owners for change.

There is already what is called Loitering laws, they know they can't stand in front of businesses and beg, they can't panhandle either, their are laws against that too.

These laws you are mentioning were part of the cause of the creation of prop L. Issue with loitering laws in SF not being effective stemmed from the fact that a compliant has to be made by a citizen before police could actually act. Given the past events of reprisals by those who did not take well to having the cops called on them this measure was created. In other words it was created to allow police to intervene and prevent home owners and business owners from feeling threatened or attacked in reprisal of police action.
In the end this law was brought up (Gavin pushed the measure through) and is based of a similar law in Seattle.

So, what I'm saying is, this law is unnecessary, heartless, and unethical.

Heartless is allowing a habitual drunk to continue destroying their lives and effecting the quality of life in a neighborhood. Heartless is allowing store owners to be continually intimidated and held hostage by a swarm of young and aggressive homeless people. This law isn't heartless or unethical by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Steeplerot]

Heartless is allowing store owners to be continually intimidated and held hostage by a swarm of young and aggressive homeless people. This law isn't heartless or unethical by any stretch of the imagination.

This is sensationalist crap, I live in the hood and I rarely get bothered except for a bit of change now and again. Maybe folks should learn to say NO instead of feeling guilty about letting their fellow Americans wallow in their own shit and making knee jerk laws to get the problem "out of sight". People will be drunks and fuckups wherever they are regardless of where you shuffle them to this week to feel better about yourselves.

Plenty of people probably think you are a fuckup too for various reasons also I am sure.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

This is a temporary choice people make thanks to problems they are going through, I am not one to give up on my fellow man. Plenty of my friends have gone through drug addictions and alcoholism and homelessness and are doing fine now as people did not give up on them.

Even if that is a choice they make that is it shouldn't be a choice others are forced to deal with in life. Sorry but this is not a good argument.

I feed the pigeons also, sure, why bother, but why not help another living creature? What else is there to do but try to be a good person with the small time we have on the planet?

Great and when you stop feeding those birds some of them will die because you'll have made them dependent on your continual feeding which has cause them to breed beyond what their native habitat could possibly provide. In the end you've done more harm then good.

A drunk lying in the alleyway is a lot less of a problem to me then ohhh..wall st gangsters.

He is part of the problem in that he is contributing to the downfall of the quality of life in the neighborhood he is inhabiting. When he passes out drunk and a ambulance is called out he is further sucking up limited resources and time.

They are the real problem affecting me and the economy, not some dude hitting bottom at that point in their lives.

Great but because it is not an issue for you specifically it does not preclude it from being a problem for someone else. That "harmless" drunk just maybe some other business persons problem because he drives away customers from their place of business.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

This is sensationalist crap, I live in the hood and I rarely get bothered except for a bit of change now and again.

Anecdotal view points again do not make the case because even it YOU have not had a problem in the past it does not mean others have not had problems. Do you believe those crime stats and reports in the "hood" just generate themselves and that there were no real people involved because "I was not effected"?

Maybe folks should learn to say NO instead of feeling guilty about letting their fellow Americans wallow in their own shit and making knee jerk laws.

The problem isn't saying NO is the after effects of doing so and then confronting an aggressive person who doesn't quite care for the answer "NO".

People will be drunks and fuckups wherever they are regardless of where you shuffle them to this week to feel better about yourselves. Plenty of people probably think you are a fuckup also for various reasons. Shit happens.

This is a ridicules rational that isn't even worth addressing.

 

[Steeplerot]

Even if that is a choice they make that is it shouldn't be a choice others are forced to deal with in life.

I don't like suburbanites cars polluting the city and running people over, so should we ban cars? No, we all are in the same boat together, you seem more interested in blaming other people instead of looking at your own flaws and the big picture, this is a lesson in life we all have to learn. Life is what it is, some good some annoying. But that is what keeps it diverse and interesting. We all are on our own path in life, some are better at it then others.


But then what is "good"? Having money? Living the rat race? Money does not make someone a smarter or more capable or better person. It means they have money. Simple as that.