Question RX6800 or RTX3070 for new build (Hogwarts Legacy discussion)

[In2Photos]

Looking to build my daughter a new computer for gaming and possibly some streaming. I found that I can get either an RX6800 or RTX3070 for roughly the same price in our budget. I'll be pairing this with a 7600X and 32gb of DDR5. Currently she has a gtx1660 and plays at 1080p with 144hz monitors. Looks like the 6800 has better raster performance in most titles, especially at higher resolution due to the 16gb of VRAM. 3070 is better at RT, but she's never used RT so I don't know if that's really a pro for the 3070. Any other thoughts?

 

[Hitman928]

RX 6800 is the better card for sure and the easy choice at roughly the same price. Even with ray tracing, it should at least match a 3070 and will definitely be faster in raster, plus it has twice the VRAM.

 

[amenx]

6800 vs 3070 raster performance summary (23 games)

AMD Radeon RX 6800 Review

The Radeon RX 6800 is the world's most power-efficient graphics card, better than anything NVIDIA Ampere has to offer. The smaller brother to the RX 6800 XT comes with a smaller heatsink, at more affordable pricing, but retains the lavish 16 GB VRAM memory buffer.

www.techpowerup.com

Ray tracing performance:

AMD Radeon RX 6800 Review

The Radeon RX 6800 is the world's most power-efficient graphics card, better than anything NVIDIA Ampere has to offer. The smaller brother to the RX 6800 XT comes with a smaller heatsink, at more affordable pricing, but retains the lavish 16 GB VRAM memory buffer.

www.techpowerup.com

 

[SteveGrabowski]

The 3070 destroys the 6800 in RT, so if she wants to run heavy RT games like Control or Cyberpunk with RT the 3070 will do it much better. I personally just bought a RX 6700 XT over a 3060 Ti since I don't trust the 8GB to age well at all for my targets of 1440p60 and 4k60 gaming, but for 1080p144 I don't know that the 8GB would be as much of a problem. Though I also don't trust Nvidia for driver optimization once a card becomes previous gen. IDK, it's a tougher call for 1080p while being a no-brainer in AMD's favor for 1440p and up if RT performance isn't a huge deal and being a no-brainer in Nvidia's favor if RT performance is a major concern.

 

[lobz]

The 3070 destroys the 6800 in RT, so if she wants to run heavy RT games like Control or Cyberpunk with RT the 3070 will do it much better. I personally just bought a RX 6700 XT over a 3060 Ti since I don't trust the 8GB to age well at all for my targets of 1440p60 and 4k60 gaming, but for 1080p144 I don't know that the 8GB would be as much of a problem. Though I also don't trust Nvidia for driver optimization once a card becomes previous gen. IDK, it's a tougher call for 1080p while being a no-brainer in AMD's favor for 1440p and up if RT performance isn't a huge deal and being a no-brainer in Nvidia's favor if RT performance is a major concern.

If only the OP would have provided an insight of his daughter's appetite for RT.

Oh wait...

 

[SteveGrabowski]

If only the OP would have provided an insight of his daughter's appetite for RT.

Oh wait...

All he said was she has never used RT, which of course she couldn't on a 1660.

 

[fleshconsumed]

3070 has better RT performance, however, even so 3070 RT performance is not all that great, depending on the game and resolution you may have to lower your settings and or run DLSS if you enable RT. As such it's a tough choice, 3070 is better for RT, but otherwise 6800 is much more futureproff with 16GB of RAM. To be honest, I would probably go with 6800.

 

[igor_kavinski]

My vote for the 6800 too, unless you want to get the 3080. 3070 will suffer when texture sizes increase, maybe 3 to 4 years later. 6800 should handle them with aplomb.



One word for 3070 above: atrocious.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

All he said was she has never used RT, which of course she couldn't on a 1660.

There are games where GTX can use ray tracing.

Unless there is a 6800 much less expensive than I have seen lately, it is too close in price to the 6800XT to make it worth buying. The XT is about 20% faster but only $20-$40 more everywhere I looked yesterday.

 

[Hitman928]

The 3070 destroys the 6800 in RT, so if she wants to run heavy RT games like Control or Cyberpunk with RT the 3070 will do it much better. I personally just bought a RX 6700 XT over a 3060 Ti since I don't trust the 8GB to age well at all for my targets of 1440p60 and 4k60 gaming, but for 1080p144 I don't know that the 8GB would be as much of a problem. Though I also don't trust Nvidia for driver optimization once a card becomes previous gen. IDK, it's a tougher call for 1080p while being a no-brainer in AMD's favor for 1440p and up if RT performance isn't a huge deal and being a no-brainer in Nvidia's favor if RT performance is a major concern.

The 3070 doesn't destroy the 6800 in every RT game, and the trend in the newer RT games is that the 6800 should match or beat the 3070 in several of them. A couple the 3070 (even Ti version) completely falls apart due to lack of VRAM.

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Founders Edition Review - Energy-Efficient Beast

GeForce RTX 4080 launches today and offers fantastic gaming performance at 4K, with highest details. In our RTX 4080 Founders Edition review, we confirm that NVIDIA's new $1200 card beats the last-generation flagship RTX 3090 Ti conclusively, both in performance and value.

www.techpowerup.com

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/nvidia-geforce-rtx-3070-ti-review

On average though, the 3070 probably still comes out on top due to a few games (mostly older ones before RDNA2 even came out or shortly after) running really poor on RDNA2 cards with RT on.

 

[In2Photos]

There are games where GTX can use ray tracing.

Unless there is a 6800 much less expensive than I have seen lately, it is too close in price to the 6800XT to make it worth buying. The XT is about 20% faster but only $20-$40 more everywhere I looked yesterday.

The 3070 was $459. 6800 is $479 and $499. Cheapest 6800XT is $540 that I've seen but that's only 1 model, an ASRock. Do you recall which models you saw?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

The 3070 was $459. 6800 is $479 and $499. Cheapest 6800XT is $540 that I've seen but that's only 1 model, an ASRock. Do you recall which models you saw?

If you are willing to mail the rebate the ASRock Phantom is $515 https://www.newegg.com/asrock-radeon-rx-6800-xt-rx6800xt-pgd-16go/p/N82E16814930049

The maths say it is a better value given its 20% performance advantage.

 

[In2Photos]

If you are willing to mail the rebate the ASRock Phantom is $515 https://www.newegg.com/asrock-radeon-rx-6800-xt-rx6800xt-pgd-16go/p/N82E16814930049

The maths say it is a better value given its 20% performance advantage.

That one is on back order. The taichi model is $5 more but no rebate. 650w PSU still ok for the 6800xt?

 

[DAPUNISHER]

That one is on back order. The taichi model is $5 more but no rebate. 650w PSU still ok for the 6800xt?

It went OOS while I was posting.

Yeah the Tai Chi will be fine with a quality 650W given you are using a 7600X

https://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-radeon-rx-6800-xt-review,5.html

 

[SteveGrabowski]

The 3070 doesn't destroy the 6800 in every RT game, and the trend in the newer RT games is that the 6800 should match or beat the 3070 in several of them. A couple the 3070 (even Ti version) completely falls apart due to lack of VRAM.

...

On average though, the 3070 probably still comes out on top due to a few games (mostly older ones before RDNA2 even came out or shortly after) running really poor on RDNA2 cards with RT on.

Interesting. I was pretty surprised seeing the 6800 not too far behind the 3070 in RT at 1440p on gamegpu.ru's Spiderman Miles Morales benchmarks considering Spiderman does RT reflections and RT shadows. I can understand Control not being prioritized in driver updates but a little surprised AMD isn't trying to bring the gap in RT performance down in Cyberpunk if it's really just a case of old RT games not doing well on AMD.

https://en.gamegpu.com/action-/-fps-/-tps/marvel-s-spider-man-miles-morales-test-gpu-cpu

Though Dying Light 2 is a game not too old where the 3070 strongly outperforms the 6800 in RT at 1440p.

Dying Light 2: Stay Human тест GPU/CPU | Action / FPS / TPS | Тест GPU

Dying Light 2 Stay Human – это экшен, который продолжает события первой части. Спустя 15 лет борьбы с вирусом болезнь вн

gamegpu.com

 

[DAPUNISHER]

I don't care which games RTX has a big lead in. My 3060ti frame buffer is nearly maxed out in new games, or even older ones with max settings at 4K. That means it won't be long before I have to make more and more compromises to settings. Hence, I am looking to replace it. No way I'd pay $400 or more for a 8GB card at the end of 2022.

 

[In2Photos]

I don't care which games RTX has a big lead in. My 3060ti frame buffer is nearly maxed out in new games, or even older ones with max settings at 4K. That means it won't be long before I have to make more and more compromises to settings. Hence, I am looking to replace it. No way I'd pay $400 or more for a 8GB card at the end of 2022.

This is my thoughts as well. She plays at 1080p right now, but that could change and the additional VRAM would go a long way with that. I went ahead and ordered the Taichi model, along with the 7600X, & 1TB NVME drive. The RAM I had planned was on backorder so I ordered that as well, hopefully it comes in as it was a pretty good deal, $130 for a 32GB kit @5600 that reviews said would easily do 6000. Newegg also had a deal on a Deepcool 750W Gold fully modular PSU for $50 so I snagged that as well over the 650W I had planned to buy. Holding out for some deals on a mobo and I need to figure out which case to get her, leaning towards the new Lian Li 216.

 

[lopri]

(Wrong thread, never mind)

 

[Hans Gruber]

I have a question about the 6800/6900. Has anybody with a 6800 done a comparison of the early drivers 2020/2021 vs. current 2022 latest AMD drivers. If you compared the 3070 old drivers to new drivers. The difference would be pretty insignificant. With AMD, they had terrible drivers (very functional but bad performance).

My thinking theory about the 6800/6900 is the drivers were not well optimized and the new drivers are much better optimized vs. the launch drivers. The Nvidia drivers are pretty consistent and the performance gains from launch are fairly negligible. Whereas the AMD drivers could see very significant performance gains.

With that said, I would hold off on graphics card purchases until probably April 2023. Especially a 6800/6800xt until the RDNA3 product is out for a few months.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

I have a question about the 6800/6900. Has anybody with a 6800 done a comparison of the early drivers 2020/2021 vs. current 2022 latest AMD drivers. If you compared the 3070 old drivers to new drivers. The difference would be pretty insignificant. With AMD, they had terrible drivers (very functional but bad performance).

My thinking theory about the 6800/6900 is the drivers were not well optimized and the new drivers are much better optimized vs. the launch drivers. The Nvidia drivers are pretty consistent and the performance gains from launch are fairly negligible. Whereas the AMD drivers could see very significant performance gains.

With that said, I would hold off on graphics card purchases until probably April 2023. Especially a 6800/6800xt until the RDNA3 product is out for a few months.

Techpowerup had the 3090 8% on the 6900 XT at 4k for the 6900 XT's launch, for the 6950 XT's launch they had the 3090 up 1% on the reference 6950 XT and 7% on the 6900 XT at 4k. For 1440p respective numbers are 3090 by 6% over 6900XT at 6900 XT launch vs 3090 by 1% over 6900 XT and down 4% to the 6950 XT at the 6950XT launch.

AMD Radeon RX 6900 XT Review - The Biggest Big Navi

AMD's Radeon RX 6900 XT offers convincing 4K gaming performance, yet stays below 300 W. Thanks to this impressive efficiency, the card is almost whisper-quiet, quieter than any RTX 3090 we've ever tested. In our review, we not only benchmark the RX 6900 XT on Intel, but also on Zen 3, with fast...

www.techpowerup.com

AMD Radeon RX 6950 XT Reference Design Review

The AMD Radeon RX 6950 XT Reference Design card not only looks great, but also achieves excellent performance, matching the GeForce RTX 3090, but at much better pricing. Because of good optimization and surprisingly good energy efficiency, AMD's thermal solution works very well, too.

www.techpowerup.com

 

[gk1951]

The type of monitor plays a great role.

I have a 5900x paired with a 6950xt with 32G DDR4-3600 running on a Samsung 49" 5120x1440 for MSFS2020.
I have a 5800x3D (sucker is fast) paired with a RX6800 with 32 G DDR4-3600 ram running on a BenQ 3501 (3440x1440 at 100Mhz) 35" monitor.
I have a 9900k OC'd to 5Ghz paired with a 2080TI with 32G DDR4-3200 running an Acer 43" 4k 60Hz monitor.
Finally I have an older Intel 5960 Oc'd to 4.3 with a 1080TI and 322G DDR3-2400 paired with a Dell 32" 2560x1440 monitor.

Most times I find the answer is what size and type of monitor you are using.

I moved the 6800 "down" to the 5800x3D rig when I bought the 6950xt.

The 6950xt is until December 13, the top AMD gpu. However the 6800 paired with the 5800x3D on an x570 mb with enough ram is a fast gaming system, especially at 1440p

The 6800 is a FAST efficient gpu.

As much as I love the 6800, I would not fault you if you get the RTX 3070.

From what I read, the performance is close with the 6800 slightly ahead in non RT games and the 3070 pulling ahead in RT games.

If you are sticking with a 1080p monitor the 6800, overall will be faster.

 

[gk1951]

Why do so many posters say this "destroys" that?

Right now the RTX 4090 "destroys" all other released cards because it is in a different class and costs so much.

The Nvidia RTX 3070 and AMD 6800 are close, thus my comment on your type of monitor.

 

[Tech Junky]

destroys

It's all preference. The thing is you can throw another card into the mix that's on par for the same results. The Intel A770 w/ 16GB @ $350.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

It's all preference. The thing is you can throw another card into the mix that's on par for the same results. The Intel A770 w/ 16GB @ $350.

ARC is still a hot mess. In some games it is very competitive at its price point. In others it performs well below it. Ray tracing performance is a real bright spot, yet overshadowed by the many issues.

Linus and Luke are presently doing a 30 day ARC challenge, and so far it ain't going so hot. Luke also had issues with it during the live stream a few weeks ago. And while Intel is doing a great job continuously releasing new drivers, they evidently introduce new problems while fixing others. ARC is not for the vast majority of gamers yet.

Tech deals lays it out well -

And before anyone shoots the messenger, or says he should have tried DXVK for AC Syndicate. The answer is, he shouldn't have to. The vast majority of gamers are not going to know how to do it, or want to go through the trouble to get their older games libraries working. As to only playing new games, even then there are QoL issues most will not tolerate. As he states, it is rare he gives a do not buy to anything, but he did with ARC.

 

[Tech Junky]

@DAPUNISHER

Considering Intel hasn't released a dGPU in decades they came out fighting on HW and price. There are always issues with new HW regardless of who's making it because the drivers are going to have issues. How Intel handles these issues though will be received on future releases.

Legacy vs New though I think they're aiming for the future rather than trying to cover the last decade of releases. Covering legacy titles is where AMD / Nvidia come into the mix since they have the backlog and bloated drivers to cover them.

For a modest $350 / 16GB setup though it will get the job done. Of course diehards will gravitate toward the status quo. If you want to pony up 2-3X the price or more then that's up to the individual. I would rather get an AMD than fork over money to Nvidia at this point. Most of the stuff I do that needs a dGPU is on a laptop so, this doesn't apply as an option to go with Intel at this point since they have a limited release of product options for laptops. Putting a dGPU into my linux box wouldn't make sense for the limited use it would see.

Just because the YT personalities spout their spiel doesn't make it bad hardware though if someone's not trying to use it for the things they're having issues with during testing. Not everyone is going to be using it for the titles they have issues with. The more time that passes and more refinements of the drivers will improve things.

Considering there are other uses for the dGPU like video editing, rendering, calculations, etc. There's still a place for it in the market besides gaming. As tot he OP application for gaming I mentioned it in the original thread / discussion as well.