Rumsfeld says he won't resign

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: Pens1566

Originally posted by: Pabster
As well he shouldn't.

He's being made a scapegoat for liberals who can't get anything on Bush and are now desperate for election time tactics.

Rumsfeld isn't elected, he's appointed by the President and serves at his request.

You mean liberals like all the generals that have said he should be removed, Andy Card the former chief of staff, and the most liberal of all the liberals Laura Bush????

Laur bush is in fact (at least was) a democract.

 

[shurato]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
I know it is irrelevant to most of you, but Rumsfeld has more experience than any Defense Secretary has had in years.
He was a pilot in the Navy and was a reservist from 1957 to 1975
After being in congress he was Ambassador to NATO
Was Chief of Staff to Ford and Sec of Defense from 1975-77

While the situation in Iraq is certainly a mess. A lot of the "fire" Rumsfeld movement comes from within the Pentagon where he is not very popular because of a lot of his programs to transform the military.
On top of that as Nixon said "He's a ruthless little bastard. You can be sure of that."

I would not be surprised to find that one of the reasons Bush has not gotten rid of him is the political hit he would take in doing so.

BTW: Cheney was also Secretary of Defense, for a Presidency with two former Secretaries of Defense this one sure seems to have some major issues.

Do you work in the real world? Experience means nothing if you can't perform on the job. Why can't our public servants be accountable to the same notion we normal folks have to face.

Yep it's irrelevant to most of us.

 

[Moonbeam]

George Bush puts a lot of stock into allegiance to people, unlike Bill Clinton who would dump his mother if she stood in the way of re-election. It is especially difficult for him now to deal effectively with Rumsfeld who has badly let Bush down. But because Bush is a Christian and a good man at heart eventually he will fire him and adopt a more realistic attitude toward Iraq. It's just a matter of time.

 

[shadow9d9]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
I know it is irrelevant to most of you, but Rumsfeld has more experience than any Defense Secretary has had in years.
He was a pilot in the Navy and was a reservist from 1957 to 1975
After being in congress he was Ambassador to NATO
Was Chief of Staff to Ford and Sec of Defense from 1975-77

While the situation in Iraq is certainly a mess. A lot of the "fire" Rumsfeld movement comes from within the Pentagon where he is not very popular because of a lot of his programs to transform the military.
On top of that as Nixon said "He's a ruthless little bastard. You can be sure of that."

I would not be surprised to find that one of the reasons Bush has not gotten rid of him is the political hit he would take in doing so.

BTW: Cheney was also Secretary of Defense, for a Presidency with two former Secretaries of Defense this one sure seems to have some major issues.

His experience led us to where we are in Iraq... some people, no matter how much experience they get, it doesn't matter...

For example, take anyone with a natural skill in something and have them train and compare them to someone with no natural skill in that same thing and have them train the same amount of time... BIG difference.

In other words, if you trained in tennis for years and years, the chances are, you still won't be the next Sampras.

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
George Bush puts a lot of stock into allegiance to people, unlike Bill Clinton who would dump his mother if she stood in the way of re-election. It is especially difficult for him now to deal effectively with Rumsfeld who has badly let Bush down. But because Bush is a Christian and a good man at heart eventually he will fire him and adopt a more realistic attitude toward Iraq. It's just a matter of time.

Wow something nice about Bush, didn't think you had it in your moon.

 

[ProfJohn]

Post election Bush needs to sit down with Rummy and the leaders of congress and develop a last ditch plan to solve this Iraq thing. Do what ever it takes for a year to make it work, if that means another 50-100k troops over there then do it.
If we still can't make it work then maybe we need to look at pulling back our troops off the streets and adopt a policy of disruption of terror cells. Just bomb them where ever we can find them.

BTW: saw something today about terror training camps in Somalia, I hope Bush learned Clinton's lesson and starts to bomb these sites before they amount to anything.

If Clinton had started bombing the terror camps in Afghanistan in 1998 after the Embassy bombing there is a chance 9-11 would have never happened because the terrorists would have been so off balance it would have been hard for any sort of long term planning.

 

[conehead433]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
George Bush puts a lot of stock into allegiance to people, unlike Bill Clinton who would dump his mother if she stood in the way of re-election. It is especially difficult for him now to deal effectively with Rumsfeld who has badly let Bush down. But because Bush is a Christian and a good man at heart eventually he will fire him and adopt a more realistic attitude toward Iraq. It's just a matter of time.

Too funny. Glad I read this in regard to your post: "The above is probably just my usual sarcasm and in no way reflects my real opinion (and,or) may include subtleties of sufficient rarity as to appear to the unsuspecting like total gibberish."

 

[Tom]

nt

 

[conehead433]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Post election Bush needs to sit down with Rummy and the leaders of congress and develop a last ditch plan to solve this Iraq thing. Do what ever it takes for a year to make it work, if that means another 50-100k troops over there then do it.
If we still can't make it work then maybe we need to look at pulling back our troops off the streets and adopt a policy of disruption of terror cells. Just bomb them where ever we can find them.

BTW: saw something today about terror training camps in Somalia, I hope Bush learned Clinton's lesson and starts to bomb these sites before they amount to anything.

If Clinton had started bombing the terror camps in Afghanistan in 1998 after the Embassy bombing there is a chance 9-11 would have never happened because the terrorists would have been so off balance it would have been hard for any sort of long term planning.

If we had completely destroyed the poppy fields in Afghanistan after taking on the Taliban there, then the terrorists' ability to fund themselves would have been reduced to a trickle. Of course that point is moot when governments like Iran, Saudia Arabia are glad to give the terrorsits some money.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: conehead433

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Post election Bush needs to sit down with Rummy and the leaders of congress and develop a last ditch plan to solve this Iraq thing. Do what ever it takes for a year to make it work, if that means another 50-100k troops over there then do it.
If we still can't make it work then maybe we need to look at pulling back our troops off the streets and adopt a policy of disruption of terror cells. Just bomb them where ever we can find them.

BTW: saw something today about terror training camps in Somalia, I hope Bush learned Clinton's lesson and starts to bomb these sites before they amount to anything.

If Clinton had started bombing the terror camps in Afghanistan in 1998 after the Embassy bombing there is a chance 9-11 would have never happened because the terrorists would have been so off balance it would have been hard for any sort of long term planning.

If we had completely destroyed the poppy fields in Afghanistan after taking on the Taliban there, then the terrorists' ability to fund themselves would have been reduced to a trickle. Of course that point is moot when governments like Iran, Saudia Arabia are glad to give the terrorsits some money.

Nobody was eliminating the poppy fields like the Taliban. Drugs and Islam don't go together.

 

[Lemon law]

In some ways Rumsfeld and McNamera--Johnsons secretary of defense are similar---both were smart, arrogant, lacking people skills, and convinced that they were the only ones smart enough to get it. Funny thing---Nixons defense secretary fared no better---but at least Mcnamera did write a kiss and tell book and accepted the blame for flawed assumtions.

But McNamera came from private industry and was somewhat of a whiz kid---and of the two---McNamera has been the connsummate government insider---and in my personal opinion, totally morally bankrupt---he was our point man to sell Saddam on WMD and poison gas when Saddam was our man in the Mid-east--see pictires of Saddam and Rummy shaking hands.---and the author of countless bad ideas.

Rummy also was the idiot who overruled our senior generals when they told him he was going in 100,000 troops light---and even fired one for his honesty--and as a result lost the peace when looting began.

The latest rumors are that Rummy is terrified he will be tried for war crimes---and is shredding papers like a madman.

But now that election time is near---GWB is calling all the morally bankrupt to his busom---Rumsfeld---Cheney---Rice---and god forbid---Kissinger is back and spreading his poisonous ideas again---and on this or another thread---we get news Newt divorce your dying wife Gingrich is even back.

But at least two Bush team members have tangled with Rumsfeld---and both Colin Powell and Andy card had to go---so its not Bush team loyality---Rummy has to have something on Bush---or they are joined at the hip---and the other worry seems to be---according to Woodward---that if Rumsfeld goes the next target will be Cheney.

 

[straightalker]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Post election Bush needs to sit down with Rummy and the leaders of congress and develop a last ditch plan to solve this Iraq thing. Do what ever it takes for a year to make it work, if that means another 50-100k troops over there then do it.
If we still can't make it work then maybe we need to look at pulling back our troops off the streets and adopt a policy of disruption of terror cells. Just bomb them where ever we can find them.

BTW: saw something today about terror training camps in Somalia, I hope Bush learned Clinton's lesson and starts to bomb these sites before they amount to anything.

If Clinton had started bombing the terror camps in Afghanistan in 1998 after the Embassy bombing there is a chance 9-11 would have never happened because the terrorists would have been so off balance it would have been hard for any sort of long term planning.

So when are you suiting up in desert fatigues and going over to help "make it work" ProfJohn?

"Just bomb them" terrorists aye? What about securing that ground then afterwards. Because it's all got to be secured. And that's done by American foot soldiers who have wives and kids and a real life back home.

This is a civil war meat grinder and anyhow it's not our business to play world cop. The worst place in the world to play that cop is right there Iraq, sandwiched in between 3 seperate factions of suicide jihadists who are each trying to annihilate each other and all Americans there.

//////////////////////////////////

On another note. Rummy will stay where he is because he's needed to hold the corrupt Bush Junta's power structure intact.

Sensible leaders would recognize our forces are being worn down at this stage. Everything is backed up in the repair shops. Tanks, trucks jeeps planes etc. The stuff is running is gritty sand and busting down. The men are fatigued after multiple forced tours of duty.

All America needs now is a real serious attack from Russia and China and we're screwed with our pants down around our ankles. Due to fools chasing oil.

 

[mc00]

why should rumsfeld resign if having great time playing command and conquer with Mr bushie.

 

[trenchfoot]

the only thing rummy is good for is exactly what bush is using him for at this time: the proverbial sacrificial whipping boy that royalty once used in place of whiipping their own misbehaving children.

also, bush will not let rummy go as this act would be tantamount to admitting that he too needs to be replaced, as this gang that can't shoot straight by default signed a pact that chained them together at the neck for all eternity. their legacy is an exclusive one, which is exactly the way they've preferred to run their government and exactly the way they'll be percieved and evaluated.

they know full well the adage IIRC:" the victor writes what is enshrined in the history books." these guys desperately want their version of "historical fact" to be scribed in stone and definetly not the version that hindsight will expose.