Romney says Ross Perot caused Clinton to win.

[Londo_Jowo]

I admit, I was one of the voters that voted for Ross Perot. That was the first and last time I voted for a 3rd party candidate. In hind sight I wished I had voted for GHW Bush like I did in 1988.

 

[fskimospy]

OK, Please Mr. Eskimospy you have twice cited exit polls in the discussion but didn't link them. Would you pretty, pretty please with sugar on top provide links to information you cite?

Was that better ninja?

You will need university access to get the actual exit polls from that long ago. There are quite a number of news stories about them however, at least one of which was already linked and I'm sure you've seen it. Are you for some reason of the belief that this news story was lying?

 

[yllus]

I remember reading some years later that Clinton led in pre-vote polls pretty consistently. Hard to look up details now, though.

The New York Times - Archives - THE 1992 CAMPAIGN; Bush's Gains From Convention Nearly Evaporate in Latest Poll

Published: August 26, 1992

President Bush's gains from four days in the spotlight at the Republican National Convention have almost completely evaporated, as the President failed to convince the public that he is committed to change and to reviving the economy, the latest New York Times/CBS News Poll shows.

Gov. Bill Clinton of Arkansas re-established a strong lead, holding a 51 percent to 36 percent edge in the poll, which was taken Sunday and Monday. That is about the same margin he held before last week's convention.

The poll showed the public had far more interest in hearing about Mr. Clinton's favorite issues, the economy and health care, than in topics featured at the convention, like family values and homosexuality.

The survey of 903 registered voters also provided fresh evidence of the loose allegiances of voters this year, showing that large numbers of men, young people, the poor and the financially comfortable all shifted back and forth in the last two weeks.

 

[dainthomas]

This

Bob Dole defeated Bob Dole, because Bob Dole should have realized that his time had passed and Bob Dole should have stepped asside. But Bob Dole was a typical republican and held fast that it was Bob Dole's rightful turn.

😀:thumbsup:

 

[Iron Wolf]

This topic actually surprised me. Like others, I had fallen victim to this popular misconception. It also was repeated in a recent program I watched (the American Experience Clinton biography?).

A relevant quote from the Washington Post which appeared in a Salon article last year:

Ross Perot’s presence on the 1992 presidential ballot did not change the outcome of the election, according to an analysis of the second choices of Perot supporters.


The analysis, based on exit polls conducted by Voter Research & Surveys (VRS) for the major news organizations, indicated that in Perot’s absence, only Ohio would have have shifted from the Clinton column to the Bush column. This would still have left Clinton with a healthy 349-to-189 majority in the electoral college.



And even in Ohio, the hypothetical Bush “margin” without Perot in the race was so small that given the normal margin of error in polls, the state still might have stuck with Clinton absent the Texas billionaire.


In most states, the second choices of Perot voters only reinforced the actual outcome. For example, California, New York, Illinois and Oregon went to Clinton by large margins, and Perot voters in those states strongly preferred Clinton to Bush.

 

[monovillage]

You will need university access to get the actual exit polls from that long ago. There are quite a number of news stories about them however, at least one of which was already linked and I'm sure you've seen it. Are you for some reason of the belief that this news story was lying?

Nope, just that I disagree with it.

 

[NeoV]

ok, well people a lot smarter than you or me - and a lot more objective than you, have analyzed it 100X times more than you have, and they are very confident with their conclusions.

The electoral results were a landslide - even if 4 of the 'swing' states had gone the other way, Clinton still wins, and in those states, Perot voters by and large favored Clinton anyway.

I know Rush doesn't agree, but try to get over that fact, and cross it off your bullet point list of excuses for GOP failure.

 

[fskimospy]

Nope, just that I disagree with it.

Based on what? The articles cite exit poll data in which 38% of Perot voters said their second choice was Clinton and 37% said their second choice was Bush. The group that administered these polls analyzed their data and came up with the fact that Clinton still would have trounced Bush.

On what basis are you disagreeing with this information other than what your gut tells you? H.W. Bush was going to lose to Clinton no matter what Perot did.

 

[dennilfloss]

Ross Perot caused SNL to be funnier for a while.

 

[fskimospy]

This topic actually surprised me. Like others, I had fallen victim to this popular misconception. It also was repeated in a recent program I watched (the American Experience Clinton biography?).

A relevant quote from the Washington Post which appeared in a Salon article last year:

​

It really is a fairly widespread myth. I used to think it myself until I read more about the topic.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Ross Perot caused SNL to be funnier for a while.

And made for a good Pinky and the Brain episode.

 

[monovillage]

The exit polls don't take into account the damage that the Perot run for the presidency did to the Bush presidency and his campaign. From my own experience with Perot supporters, the people that voted for him and the media bombardment of his message it's still my opinion the Bush would have been re-elected if Perot hadn't run.

 

[hal2kilo]

I have no idea why anyone in their right mind could think Perot took more votes from Bush 41 since Perot's platform was to the left of Clinton's.

🙄

 

[hal2kilo]

Ross Perot caused SNL to be funnier for a while.

The skit where they left his VP running mate (the retired general with signs of Altheimer's) by the side of the road had me in stitches.

 

[fskimospy]

The exit polls don't take into account the damage that the Perot run for the presidency did to the Bush presidency and his campaign. From my own experience with Perot supporters, the people that voted for him and the media bombardment of his message it's still my opinion the Bush would have been re-elected if Perot hadn't run.

If it's your decision to cling to an unshakable faith in Republican victory that's fine, but I encourage you to read this analysis of the 1992 election that encompasses a wide range of pre-election polling, presidential approval, etc.

http://www.pollingreport.com/hibbitts1202.htm

All the evidence points to a Bush defeat regardless. Using Perot as the cause is a right wing myth to excuse two consecutive widespread presidential defeats for conservatives.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

It really is a fairly widespread myth. I used to think it myself until I read more about the topic.

Yep I was there too until I looked into it some years back.

 

[monovillage]

If it's your decision to cling to an unshakable faith in Republican victory that's fine, but I encourage you to read this analysis of the 1992 election that encompasses a wide range of pre-election polling, presidential approval, etc.

http://www.pollingreport.com/hibbitts1202.htm

All the evidence points to a Bush defeat regardless. Using Perot as the cause is a right wing myth to excuse two consecutive widespread presidential defeats for conservatives.

Since Tim Hibbitts works for Fox news then maybe I should believe his take on the election, but my memory still disagrees, it was 20 years ago after all.

 

[fskimospy]

Since Tim Hibbitts works for Fox news then maybe I should believe his take on the election, but my memory still disagrees, it was 20 years ago after all.

He actually works for his own polling firm, but is occasionally contracted by a number of networks to provide coverage on election projections, etc.

 

[monovillage]

He actually works for his own polling firm, but is occasionally contracted by a number of networks to provide coverage on election projections, etc.

Including Fox, his favoritest network I think his mom said.

(I made that up)

 

[Ninjahedge]

OK, Please Mr. Eskimospy you have twice cited exit polls in the discussion but didn't link them. Would you pretty, pretty please with sugar on top provide links to information you cite?

Was that better ninja?

That was just plain mean.


/me runs to other thread sobbing.

 

[Ninjahedge]

Ross Perot caused SNL to be funnier for a while.

Now, ya see, ya see, ya see here?

This here's the deficit! Ya know what CAUSES the deficit??!?


MONEY!

Spending money......




/Chopping broccoli......

 

[chowderhead]

And fuck Romney for whining and being butthurt over an election from 20 years ago he wasn't even involved in.

Romney really is a bad candidate. 20 years ago, Romney was an "independent" during Reagan/Bush. He doesn't want to go back to Reagan/Bush. The ads just write themselves.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Romney really is a bad candidate. 20 years ago, Romney was an "independent" during Reagan/Bush. He doesn't want to go back to Reagan/Bush. The ads just write themselves.

Can't think of any outstanding ones myself. I suspect this will be yet another election largely based on the lesser of perceived evils.

 

[a777pilot]

If it had not been for H. Ross we would not have had an Oval Office BJ.

What fun would that have been?