Roger Clemens vs Greg Maddux

[raildogg]

I think they are very close in overrall achievements since they both have won 300 games. Clemens is clearly the more of a power pitcher while Maddux relies on off speed pitches to get the batters out. But what surprised me is that Maddux has a lot of strikeouts in his career as well and in 1995 he went 19-2 with an ERA of under 2.00. That is just unbelievable.

I think we all seem to forget how great of a pitcher Maddux was and Clemens seems to be getting all the headlines. I think Clemens may have had more years of dominance while Maddux has been brilliant through out his career. Also remember that Clemens has to face the DH while Maddux does not, so I think Clemens's slight higher ERA might be justified, if that is the right word to use.

Discuss.

 

[spanky]

close... i vote clemens

 

[brunswickite]

Well statistically Clemons wins.

Clemons has more, Wins, SO, and CGs. and 3 more cy young awards and an MVP
Wins = 329 - 306
SO = 4353 - 2932
CG = 17 - 105
He has also won cy young awards on every team he pitched for:
Red Sox = 3
Toronto = 2
Yanks = 1
Astros = 1

 

[anxi80]

voted clemens. guy has struck out 20 batters in a game twice.

 

[blurredvision]

I've gotta go with Maddux. Was definitely a silent assassin in the 90's. Unbelievable pitcher is his prime, hardly anyone could touch him.

 

[raildogg]

Originally posted by: brunswickite
Well statistically Clemons wins.

Clemons has more, Wins, SO, and CGs. and 3 more cy young awards and an MVP
Wins = 329 - 306
SO = 4353 - 2932
CG = 17 - 105
He has also won cy young awards on every team he pitched for:
Red Sox = 3
Toronto = 2
Yanks = 1
Astros = 1

Yes, but Clemens also has three years on Maddux, so that should be a factor. Maddux's greatness has mostly been in Atlanta and they did come close to winning the world series a few times and he contributed a lot to those teams. Also keep in mind that Maddux lost a lot of starts in 94 and 95 due to the strike and those were the one of the better years of his career. Just imagine how many more games he could have won. Maybe he would have more wins now than Clemens.

Clemens just goes wherever the big bucks are, sorry, but thats the way it is.

Many Yankee fans don't even consider him a true Yankee even after the world series rings and the years he spent in pinstripes.

 

[Shlong]

I'm biased but I'll say Maddux, 16 straight years of 15 or more wins, better ERA (pitched in NL all his career though), and 14 gold gloves.

 

[brunswickite]

Originally posted by: raildogg

Originally posted by: brunswickite
Well statistically Clemons wins.

Clemons has more, Wins, SO, and CGs. and 3 more cy young awards and an MVP
Wins = 329 - 306
SO = 4353 - 2932
CG = 17 - 105
He has also won cy young awards on every team he pitched for:
Red Sox = 3
Toronto = 2
Yanks = 1
Astros = 1

Yes, but Clemens also has three years on Maddux, so that should be a factor. Maddux's greatness has mostly been in Atlanta and they did come close to winning the world series a few times and he contributed a lot to those teams. Also keep in mind that Maddux lost a lot of starts in 94 and 95 due to the strike and those were the one of the better years of his career. Just imagine how many more games he could have won. Maybe he would have more wins now than Clemens even though hes 3 years younger.

Clemens just goes wherever the big bucks are, sorry, but thats the way it is.

Many Yankee fans don't even consider him a true Yankee even after the world series rings and the years he spent in pinstripes.

good point, but in 3 more years do you think Maddux will still be pitching at a high level? Also I agree that he lost starts in 94 due to a shortened season, but thats only 10 starts... 1995 was a complete season.

 

[Ophir]

Clemens, though he had more talent to work with.

I really respect Maddux and the way he's been able to think his way to victory with underwhelming stuff. His success has been built on brains and changing speeds and movement on a sub-92 mph fastball. There was a point in time that he was basically unhittable - from 1994 -95 seasons he averaged 1.60ERA and 0.85WHIP.

 

[surreal1221]

Maddux x 2. . . huge cub fan here, and loved him when he played with the braves as well. So my opinion may not matter.

 

[Otaking]

I may be biased, but Roger for sure.

I grew up in Houston (go Astros!), and I go to UT-Austin (go Horns!), so alma mater is a commonality for me and Roger.

 

[cliftonite]

Clemens.

 

[Rickten]

away away away inside for the strike out.... away away away away away.... away again. Pinpoint accuracy. Maddux is the reason I wanted to play baseball so bad. Would watch him on the braves freezing people left and right with his accuracy.

 

[PlatinumGold]

i think those two are tough to compare. 2 of the best of all time. both are first ballot HOFers. both have made lasting impressions on the game.

very very different type pitchers tho. like trying to compare Charles Barkley and John Stocton.

 

[Ophir]

Originally posted by: Rickten
away away away inside for the strike out.... away away away away away.... away again. Pinpoint accuracy. Maddux is the reason I wanted to play baseball so bad. Would watch him on the braves freezing people left and right with his accuracy.

:thumbsup:

The look on left handed hitters' faces after that cut fastball catches the inside corner, especially with a full count and they start their trot to first, is priceless. Even better is when they bail out for fear of getting beaned. To this day that is my favorite pitch.

 

[MDE]

Maddux. I'm a die-hard Cub hater too.

 

[darkswordsman17]

I was a huge Braves fan in the 90s (and have since lost most of my interest in baseball and sports in general), so I gotta go Maddux. He's a classy guy as well.

The Braves pitching staff in the 90s is kinda similar to the USAF fighters. You've got Smoltz, Maddux, Avery, and oh crap I can't think of anybody else, but anyways, you've got several that are super pitchers, but none that are really what you'd call #1.

 

[3chordcharlie]

I have to go with Maddux.

Batman may not be a scientist, but Greg sure is.

 

[Shlong]

darkswordsman you're forgetting Glavine. But it's easy to forget his miserable pitching for the Mets thus far for sure.

 

[BigJ]

Maddux is the reason I started pitching in Little League, and throughout the rest of the time I played baseball.

The control that man had was absolutely unbelievable.

So Maddux gets my nod.

 

[mpitts]

Clemens x 2

 

[hdeck]

no contest. clemens.

 

[shilala]

Maddux is the quintessential placement pitcher. He's smart, moves the ball around, throws a mess of ground balls, and keeps his head.
He's a study in pitching. I love watching him, he's amazing. I don't think I've ever seen him serve up the wrong pitch in the wrong situation.
The Rocket is sheer brute force. If he can't strike you out, he'll simply throw a ball through your ears. Dig in and Die.
They're total opposites.
It's a tough call, but I take Maddux in both categories.

 

[madogvt]

Who has had the better career is a tough one. They're close, but I'd say Clemens is better now.

 

[Xenon]

Here are their 162 game averages. It's pointless to compare their normal era's and whips to each other since they played nearly their whole career in different leagues. Looking at the era+ though it's clear that both were great pitchers. Clemens has the slight edge over Maddux, though based on his better winning percentage.

Clemens

17-8 era+ 141


Maddux

17-9 era+ 141