Ridley Scott vs Peter Jackson

[BudAshes]

Also, another reminder that Prometheus was awesome. You guys suck.

(Seriously, watch Alien again, because I bet it's been a long time for most of you--because in that "perfect" film, all the dumb people do all the same dumb things that all of you bitch about the characters in Prometheus doing when encountering that strange lifeform(s))

 

[mikeymikec]

RS was good once, but now he is a complete and utter sellout.

Bladerunner is a work of fucking art though.

Prometheus was not. So fucking awful.

Maybe Peter Jackson can do a touchy-feely version of Bladerunner that ticks every box to put as many bums on seats as possible.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Aliens was James Cameron. That's why it's more "actiony"

Yeah you're right, my brain wasn't working when I posted that. I still give Ridley half credit for it as source creator though

 

[mikeymikec]

(Seriously, watch Alien again, because I bet it's been a long time for most of you--because in that "perfect" film, all the dumb people do all the same dumb things that all of you bitch about the characters in Prometheus doing when encountering that strange lifeform(s))

Nope.

The crew of the Prometheus had the best that humanity (well, Weyland Corporation) could send, with some idea of what they were going to do/find. What ensued was pretty much every fucking expert fucking up in ways that boggle the mind.

The crew of the Nostromo had no idea of what they were walking into (apart from Ash). They ran a mining ship. Their captain was a yes man, which is why he was unknowingly picked for Operation Fuck These Guys. Ash was obviously only interested in getting a sample home, and apart from the highly strung lady, the rest were doing the best they could given a shitty situation involving something that none of the humans had any relevant experience of whatsoever. The outcome would have been somewhat better if the captain hadn't been a dick.

 

[LikeLinus]

RS was good once, but now he is a complete and utter sellout.

Scott is 83 years old. Jackson is 59.

Jackson is a bit of a one trick pony. LOTR is really the only set of movies he did that are good. Problem is, as good as they are, they are still a bunch of 3hr same story movies.

Scott is more diverse and has films that are overall better. Looking through his IMDB page, I had no clue he directed the Apple Mac: 1984 commercial, lol.

 

[ondma]

Lord of the Rings Trilogy FTW.

 

[ponyo]

How this even a comparison? One made one good trilogy. Another made lifetime of great movies.

 

[Spacehead]

I voted for Scott based on a wider variety of films & really, more movies i would rank high.

LOTR was excellent & Heavenly Creatures was really good too.
The Lovely Bones was pretty good & i think i liked The Frighteners at the time but it's been too long. Kong & Hobbit were ok

 

[dasherHampton]

Ridley Scott was not the problem with Prometheus. The movie looks fantastic and is competently directed.

The problem was that hack Lindelof. Scott did what he could with that turd of a screenplay.

 

[Sonikku]

I thought Prometheus was a lot better than the hobbit trilogy. Scott and Peter seem to have similar highs but Scott's lows aren't as low as Jackson's.

 

[mikeymikec]

I think PJ could have made a name for himself as a director (ie. potentially elevating himself to the likes of historically notable directors like RS, Hitchcock, Tarantino, Kubrick, etc), if he could have handled going from LOTR as a more adult-oriented movie and then made a Hobbit movie (maybe two) that was obviously aimed at kids while bringing the production values that made LOTR a remarkable* trilogy. AFAIK it's an uncommon skill to make a film aimed at kids to appeal greatly to adults in general (usually kids' films are made not to completely bore parents): The original Star Wars trilogy is one example.

* - that's the most positive adjective I can honestly use for those films. I can't bring myself to watch them ever again, they ruined LOTR for me.

 

[pmv]

Also, another reminder that Prometheus was awesome. You guys suck.

(Seriously, watch Alien again, because I bet it's been a long time for most of you--because in that "perfect" film, all the dumb people do all the same dumb things that all of you bitch about the characters in Prometheus doing when encountering that strange lifeform(s))

I can't even remember now, but that wasn't my problem with Prometheus. It was more about the overly-portentious and reverential 'tone' of the thing. And the story, such as it was, was extremely unclear. It was just disappointing, is all. They were striving too hard for that 'ultimate secret of the universe' feel, compared to Alien that never got ideas above its station and did what it did extremely well (ordinary working stiffs encounter something terrifying). A bit like the first Half Life compared to the rest of the franchise (that clearly got _so_ bogged down in it's own mythology that they couldnt' figure out how to finish it at all).

 

[BarkingGhostar]

I actually didn't see Alien in the theater, but I did see Blade Runner. It is probably the one movie I have watched the most. Shit, I watched it again last night! I prefer the original theatrical release with the embedded narratives. Its like a bedtime story to me, in that I've watched it many times before going to bed happy. Besides Ford's acting, and Syd Mead's direction on the vehicles, the whole dark atmosphere is one of RS' trademarks that I fell in love with. I always look forward to his high-contrast, low black level visualizations. I am very much a visual person and he brings the eye candy for my entertainment.

 

[zinfamous]

I can't even remember now, but that wasn't my problem with Prometheus. It was more about the overly-portentious and reverential 'tone' of the thing. And the story, such as it was, was extremely unclear. It was just disappointing, is all. They were striving too hard for that 'ultimate secret of the universe' feel, compared to Alien that never got ideas above its station and did what it did extremely well (ordinary working stiffs encounter something terrifying). A bit like the first Half Life compared to the rest of the franchise (that clearly got _so_ bogged down in it's own mythology that they couldnt' figure out how to finish it at all).

I thought it was fairly simple:

--advanced life forms spend generations seeding life on planets with their brilliant life-generating RNA technology. They dosed the "primordial soup" with what we already understand to be the RNA world of early earth. They leave some rando maps in case their little science experiments ever get smart enough to seek them out.
--Turns out, their little laboratory base that holds their vast knowledge, as well as their active experiments (yes, this is already a bad idea. Us humans already know that you put real barriers between dangerous active experiments) gets overrun by their worst, most ambitious, most perfect attempt at generating life.
--They trap the critters as best they can and hibernate themselves (it's what all the humans have been doing in these movies, anyway), but when that dude realizes that humans have arrived, it activates their emergency safety protocol: These things can't escape, so wipe out all humans....uh, with these things, or something. lol.

When the Nostromo finds the crashed Founder ship in Alien, so much of that crazy architecture and gothic insanity is begging for some sort of explanation. These aren't "just some terrifying creatures." ...how the hell did that thing get there? We're already given the premise that those dumb miners are dealing with an extremely advanced, vastly ancient alien civilization. It's all already there, and I don't think Prometheus is at all far outside of what Scott wanted to do with that lore. Remember, he produced, directed Prometheus. If he didn't like Lindeloff's treatment of the story, then he wouldn't have supported it. All of the design and plot of Prometheus is literally plucked straight out of Alien. (and into Covenant....not that I think Covenant is that great or anything, but it's good enough).

I think people just bitch that it's not what they wanted the story to be.

You guys want to bitch about one of these movies? Focus on Alien Resurrection.

 

[zinfamous]

I actually didn't see Alien in the theater, but I did see Blade Runner. It is probably the one movie I have watched the most. Shit, I watched it again last night! I prefer the original theatrical release with the embedded narratives. Its like a bedtime story to me, in that I've watched it many times before going to bed happy. Besides Ford's acting, and Syd Mead's direction on the vehicles, the whole dark atmosphere is one of RS' trademarks that I fell in love with. I always look forward to his high-contrast, low black level visualizations. I am very much a visual person and he brings the eye candy for my entertainment.

You mean the voice-over? ughhhhh I mean, it's not bad....it's just one of those tools that you avoid at all costs in film. Only when there is no other way, and very, very limited.

 

[pmv]

I thought it was fairly simple:

--advanced life forms spend generations seeding life on planets with their brilliant life-generating RNA technology. They dosed the "primordial soup" with what we already understand to be the RNA world of early earth. They leave some rando maps in case their little science experiments ever get smart enough to seek them out.
--Turns out, their little laboratory base that holds their vast knowledge, as well as their active experiments (yes, this is already a bad idea. Us humans already know that you put real barriers between dangerous active experiments) gets overrun by their worst, most ambitious, most perfect attempt at generating life.
--They trap the critters as best they can and hibernate themselves (it's what all the humans have been doing in these movies, anyway), but when that dude realizes that humans have arrived, it activates their emergency safety protocol: These things can't escape, so wipe out all humans....uh, with these things, or something. lol.

When the Nostromo finds the crashed Founder ship in Alien, so much of that crazy architecture and gothic insanity is begging for some sort of explanation. These aren't "just some terrifying creatures." ...how the hell did that thing get there? We're already given the premise that those dumb miners are dealing with an extremely advanced, vastly ancient alien civilization. It's all already there, and I don't think Prometheus is at all far outside of what Scott wanted to do with that lore. Remember, he produced, directed Prometheus. If he didn't like Lindeloff's treatment of the story, then he wouldn't have supported it. All of the design and plot of Prometheus is literally plucked straight out of Alien. (and into Covenant....not that I think Covenant is that great or anything, but it's good enough).

I think people just bitch that it's not what they wanted the story to be.

You guys want to bitch about one of these movies? Focus on Alien Resurrection.

Trouble is I just can't remember now the details of my problems with the movie. Too long ago. Even tried searching my email to look for the discussions I had after seeing it, but can't find them ("No results found: Showing search results for processes"). But I'm sure I felt at the time that lots of things in the movie didn't make sense in terms of story logic. Impossible to argue about it now given I can't remember anything.

 

[sdifox]

I thought it was fairly simple:

--advanced life forms spend generations seeding life on planets with their brilliant life-generating RNA technology. They dosed the "primordial soup" with what we already understand to be the RNA world of early earth. They leave some rando maps in case their little science experiments ever get smart enough to seek them out.
--Turns out, their little laboratory base that holds their vast knowledge, as well as their active experiments (yes, this is already a bad idea. Us humans already know that you put real barriers between dangerous active experiments) gets overrun by their worst, most ambitious, most perfect attempt at generating life.
--They trap the critters as best they can and hibernate themselves (it's what all the humans have been doing in these movies, anyway), but when that dude realizes that humans have arrived, it activates their emergency safety protocol: These things can't escape, so wipe out all humans....uh, with these things, or something. lol.

When the Nostromo finds the crashed Founder ship in Alien, so much of that crazy architecture and gothic insanity is begging for some sort of explanation. These aren't "just some terrifying creatures." ...how the hell did that thing get there? We're already given the premise that those dumb miners are dealing with an extremely advanced, vastly ancient alien civilization. It's all already there, and I don't think Prometheus is at all far outside of what Scott wanted to do with that lore. Remember, he produced, directed Prometheus. If he didn't like Lindeloff's treatment of the story, then he wouldn't have supported it. All of the design and plot of Prometheus is literally plucked straight out of Alien. (and into Covenant....not that I think Covenant is that great or anything, but it's good enough).

I think people just bitch that it's not what they wanted the story to be.

You guys want to bitch about one of these movies? Focus on Alien Resurrection.

It was not the setup, it was the breaking of disbelief. The same people that were extremely cautious at the beginning all go yolo at the worst possible time. Just completely out of character, you wreck a movie that way.

 

[Ajay]

You guys want to bitch about one of these movies? Focus on Alien Resurrection.

Yeah, but did you know that Ripley's one handed over the head swish was real! One take, IIRC. Game, set, match

 

[Ajay]

I thought it was fairly simple:

--advanced life forms spend generations seeding life on planets with their brilliant life-generating RNA technology. They dosed the "primordial soup" with what we already understand to be the RNA world of early earth. They leave some rando maps in case their little science experiments ever get smart enough to seek them out.
--Turns out, their little laboratory base that holds their vast knowledge, as well as their active experiments (yes, this is already a bad idea. Us humans already know that you put real barriers between dangerous active experiments) gets overrun by their worst, most ambitious, most perfect attempt at generating life.
--They trap the critters as best they can and hibernate themselves (it's what all the humans have been doing in these movies, anyway), but when that dude realizes that humans have arrived, it activates their emergency safety protocol: These things can't escape, so wipe out all humans....uh, with these things, or something. lol.

When the Nostromo finds the crashed Founder ship in Alien, so much of that crazy architecture and gothic insanity is begging for some sort of explanation. These aren't "just some terrifying creatures." ...how the hell did that thing get there? We're already given the premise that those dumb miners are dealing with an extremely advanced, vastly ancient alien civilization. It's all already there, and I don't think Prometheus is at all far outside of what Scott wanted to do with that lore. Remember, he produced, directed Prometheus. If he didn't like Lindeloff's treatment of the story, then he wouldn't have supported it. All of the design and plot of Prometheus is literally plucked straight out of Alien. (and into Covenant....not that I think Covenant is that great or anything, but it's good enough).

I think people just bitch that it's not what they wanted the story to be.

You guys want to bitch about one of these movies? Focus on Alien Resurrection.

Yes, but the last 20sih minutes (can't remember) sucked so hard it erased all the good stuff. Was a shame.

 

[Muse]

granted, ridley scott had some good stuff

but peter jackson's LotR trilogy automatically trumps anything else IMHO

i went to see each of those things 5 or 6 times in theaters when they came out

so i vote peter

IMO, Scott made some awful movies. I don't remember anything awful by Jackson.

Alien, Thelma and Louise, The Martian = Really good movies. The rest, nah, anyway I'm not aware of any. I liked Blade Runner at the time. Doesn't work for me at all anymore.

Edit: Jackson's LOTR, King Kong, that doc about WW I were pretty damn great.

 

[Mr.IncrediblyBored]

A better question is who else has had the career of Ridley Scott. He's done everything from sci-fi to chick-flicks, and done them well. Spielberg probably.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

You mean the voice-over? ughhhhh I mean, it's not bad....it's just one of those tools that you avoid at all costs in film. Only when there is no other way, and very, very limited.

It wasn't really an essential thing but to me it explained things that the movie otherwise loses. Its been way too long since I read the book, but something makes me think some things would be interpreted or just downright not understood. For instance, we Deckard is eating his noodles at the bar he explains the gutter-speak as a combination of yadda, yadda, yadda. Without the voiceover you are left to consciously ignore it and not question it as you are not going to get the answer any other way.

But maybe I am just predisposed to the original theatrical version as I had probably seen it 20-30 times before I watched the Director's Non-Director's Cut, which removed it.

 

[DigDog]

Ridley Scott was not the problem with Prometheus. The movie looks fantastic and is competently directed.

The problem was that hack Lindelof. Scott did what he could with that turd of a screenplay.

... didn't Scott write the story ?

 

[MrSquished]

I'm in the middle of the second remastered extended LOTR movie and it's amazing. After I'm done with the 3rd I'll watch Ridley scott's best 5 movies and figure this whole thing out