Rick Perry and his "pastor problem"

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
39,303
32,818
136
The GOP and all the famous GOP shills, Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, O’Reilly, Spidey07 and FNE have insisted that the pastor with whom you associate is a direct reflection on you. There was a lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth at Rev Jeramiah Wright’s “God damn America” sermon. The quote in the context of the sermon wasn’t even bad. It essentially said if America doesn’t start doing right by its people God will curse America instead of bless it. This was the same thing uttered by Michelle Bachman in a speech to a Jewish group, but it didn’t seem to bother anyone.

These are the pastors/groups sponsoring and speaking at The Response, the prayer-a-palooza created by Rick Perry. Here are some of their greatest hits. Remember Perry invited them knowing what they have already said.
Does this mean Rick Perry is now unfit for POTUS?

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/conte...-intolerant-hateful-vile-spiteful-pawns-devil

The American Family Association
The American Family Association is the driving force behind The Response. Founded by the Rev. Don Wildmon in 1977, the organization is based is best known for its various boycott campaigns, promotion of art censorship, and political advocacy against women’s rights and LGBT equality. The organization also controls the vast American Family Radio and an online news service, in addition to sponsoring various conferences frequented by Republican leaders, including the Values Voter Summit and Rediscovering God in America. The AFA today is led by Tim Wildmon, Don’s son, and its chief spokesperson is Bryan Fischer, the Director of Issues Analysis for Government and Public Policy and host of its flagship radio show Focal Point.
Fischer routinely expresses support for some of the most bigoted and shocking ideas found in the Religious Right today. He has:
• held gays responsible for the Holocaust and likened them to domestic terrorists and Nazis who are intent on committing “virtual genocide” against the military, and asserts that “homosexuals should be disqualified from public office”;
• said “we have feminized the Medal of Honor” by awarding it to a soldier who saved his fellow combatants rather than killing enemies;
• demanded all immigrants “convert to Christianity” and renounce their religions;
• asserted that Muslims have “no fundamental First Amendment claims” and should be banned from building mosques and deported from the US, adding that Muslims are inherently stupid as a result of inbreeding;
• claimed African American women “rut like rabbits” due to welfare and that Native Americans are “morally disqualified” from living in America because they didn’t convert to Christianity and were consequently cursed by God with alcoholism and poverty;
• said that the anti-Muslim manifesto of the right-wing Christian terrorist who killed dozens in Norway was “accurate.”
Other AFA leaders and activists are just as radical:
• AFA President Tim Wildmon claims that by repealing Don’t Ask Don’t Tell President Obama shows he “doesn’t give a rip about the Marines or the Army” and “just wants to force homosexuality into every place that he can.”
• AFA Vice President Buddy Smith, who is on the leadership council of The Response, said that gays and lesbians are “in the clasp of Satan.”
• The head of the AFA’s women’s group led a boycott against Glee because she accused it of indoctrinating children in homosexuality and idolatry.The editor of AFA Journal Ed Vitagliano said that gay pride months are an affront to the Founding Fathers and will usher in “a return to pagan sexuality.”
• A columnist for the AFA demanded Christians stop practicing yoga because it was inspired by the “evil” religions of Buddhism and Hinduism.

International House of Prayer
The Response’s leadership team includes five senior staff members of the International House of Prayer (IHOP), a large, highly political Pentecostal organization built on preparing participants for the return of Jesus Christ. In a recent video, IHOP encouraged supporters to pray for Jews to convert to Christianity in order to bring about the Second Coming. IHOP is closely associated with Lou Engle, a Religious Right leader whose anti-gay, anti-choice extremism hasn’t stopped him from hobnobbing with Republican leaders including Newt Gingrich, Michele Bachmann and Mike Huckabee. Engle is the founder of The Call, day-long rallies against abortion rights and gay marriage, which Engle says are meant to break Satan’s control over the U.S. government. One recent Call event featured “prophet” Cindy Jacobs calling for repentance for the “girl-on-girl kissing” of Britney Spears and Madonna. Perry's The Response event is clearly built upon Engle's The Call model.
Engle has a long history of pushing extreme right-wing views and advocating for a conservative theocracy in America. Engle:
• is a proponent of “Seven Mountains” dominionism, a movement that seeks to have Christians take control of all aspects of American life, including government, business, entertainment and the media;supports the criminalization of homosexuality;
• claimed that universities with LGBT anti-discrimination measures are teaching students to “accept the mark of the beast”;
• is waging a “spiritual war” on the Supreme Court to get abortion outlawed in America;
• prayed that Ellen Degeneres will be “converted” from homosexuality.
• led a prayer rally in Jerusalem to lead one of the "greatest awakenings in the earth" to bring the Jews of Israel to Christianity.
• claimed that the devastating tornado in Joplin, Missouri was God’s judgment for abortion.
IHOP’s founder and executive director, Mike Bickle, who is an official endorser of The Response, like Engle pushes radical End Times prophesies. In one sermon, he declared that Oprah Winfrey is a precursor to the Antichrist.

Tony Perkins
Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council, is a co-chairman of The Response. At the FRC, Perkins has been a vocal opponent of LGBT equality, often relying on false claims about gay people to push his agenda. He:
• called gay rights activists “intolerant,” “hateful,” “vile,” “spiteful” and “pawns” of Satan;
• denied that there was a correlation between anti-gay bullying and depression and suicide, saying instead that gay and lesbian teens know they are “abnormal” and “have a higher propensity to depression or suicide because of that internal conflict";
• wrote that Senators would have "the blood of innocent soldiers on their hands" if they vote to repeal Don't Ask, Don't Tell and allow gays to serve openly in the military;
• likened President Obama to a Middle East dictator when the president refused to defend the unconstitutional Defense of Marriage Act in court;
• said “I don’t know if the country can survive” another Obama term;
• said that armies that allow gays and lesbians to serve openly – including several U.S. allies in Iraq and Afghanistan –“participate in parades, they don’t fight wars to keep the world free.”

John Hagee
While Senator John McCain rejected John Hagee’s endorsement during the 2008 presidential campaign for his “deeply offensive and indefensible” remarks, Perry invited Hagee to join The Response. Hagee leads a megachurch in San Antonio, Texas, and is a purveyor of End Times prophesies. Like members of the International House of Prayer, Hagee utilizes language of spiritual warfare and says he is part of “the army of the living God.” He runs the prominent group Christians United For Israel, which believes that eventually a cataclysmic war in the Middle East will bring about the Rapture.
John McCain was forced to disavow Hagee for a reason as the Texas pastor:
• claimed that God sent Hitler to be a “hunter” of Jews to usher in the establishment of Israel and “do God’s work,” lamenting that Jews are no longer “spiritually alive.”
• referred to the Catholic Church as ‘The Great Whore,’ an ‘apostate church,’ the ‘anti-Christ,’ and a ‘false cult system.’
• believes that Hurricane Katrina “looked like the curse of God” and ravaged New Orleans in order to stop a “homosexual rally” and punish the city’s high “level of sin.”
• said that if gay marriage becomes legal “you can kiss this country goodbye,” alleged that the US is “rebirthing Sodom and Gomorrah,” and demanded that the government stop funding AIDS research and treatment to stop benefiting a “sinful lifestyle.”
• demands that “wives submit yourselves to your husbands” and said that the “husband has a God-given role as leader of your home.”
• said that God won’t allow the United States to win wars anymore because “we have allowed the worship of Satanism in the U.S. military.”

Other Allies
Among the other far-right figures who have signed on to work with Gov. Perry on The Response are:
• Cindy Jacobs, self-proclaimed “prophet” and endorser of The Response, who famously insisted that birds were dying in Arkansas earlier this year because of the repeal of Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell.
• C. Peter Wagner, an official endorser of The Response, is one of the most prominent leaders of the New Apostolic Reformation, a controversial movement whose followers believe they are prophets and apostles on par with Christ himself (other adherents include Engle, Jacobs and Anh). Wagner has advocated burning Catholic, Mormon and non-Christian religious objects. He blamed the Japanese stock market crash and later the devastating earthquake and tsunami in the country on a traditional ritual in which the emperor supposedly has “sexual intercourse” with the pagan Sun Goddess.
• John Benefiel, a self-proclaimed "apostle" and official endorser of The Response, who claims the Statue of Liberty is a "demonic idol" and that homosexuality is a plot cooked up by the Illuminati to control the world's population, and that he renamed the District of Columbia the “District of Christ” because he has “more authority than the U.S. Congress does.”
• Willie Wooten, a self-proclaimed “apostle” who claims that God is punishing the African American community for supporting gay rights, reproductive freedom and the Democratic Party.
• Pastor Stephen Broden – Broden, an endorser of The Response, has repeatedly insisted that a violent overthrow of the U.S. government must remain “on the table.”
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
The GOP and all the famous GOP shills, Limbaugh, Hannity, Beck, O’Reilly, Spidey07 and FNE have insisted that the pastor with whom you associate is a direct reflection on you. There was a lot of weeping and gnashing of teeth at Rev Jeramiah Wright’s “God damn America” sermon. The quote in the context of the sermon wasn’t even bad. It essentially said if America doesn’t start doing right by its people God will curse America instead of bless it. This was the same thing uttered by Michelle Bachman in a speech to a Jewish group, but it didn’t seem to bother anyone.

These are the pastors/groups sponsoring and speaking at The Response, the prayer-a-palooza created by Rick Perry. Here are some of their greatest hits. Remember Perry invited them knowing what they have already said.
Does this mean Rick Perry is now unfit for POTUS?

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/conte...-intolerant-hateful-vile-spiteful-pawns-devil

The only correction is you saying 'now unfit'. That was proven long ago.

The Bachmann quote would be nice to have for repeating a la Wright.
 

Drako

Lifer
Jun 9, 2007
10,697
161
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Didn't seem to hurt Obama, why would it hurt Perry?

Oh yeah, that's right, it won't :)
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
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Here i'll address this using your answer to the Obama/Wright question.
Why is this religeous thing even relevant?? Who cares if Obama is a Christian or not? Who cares if Christine O'Donnel "dabbled in witchcraft" or not? Ronald Reagan snookered the religeous right pretending to be one of them but he never went to church.

Three of the qualifications I want for someone running for national office are intelligence, competence, and the ability to get things done.
 
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ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
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7
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BTW Obama is failing on all three things you care about, and that is according to the left.
 
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mchammer187

Diamond Member
Nov 26, 2000
9,114
0
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Here i'll address this using your answer to the Obama/Wright question.

So you are admitting Homer JS was right and it doesn't matter (Perry's or Obama's association with the words of there pastors) that is fine as long as you are withdrawing any criticism toward Barack Obama regarding Reverend Wright.
 

Lemon law

Lifer
Nov 6, 2005
20,984
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Its all well and fine for Rick Perry to only pander to one religion as a private citizen, but as a sitting governor of a State that believes in separation between church and State, there are certain constitutional questions that may leave Rick Perry on the wrong side of the US and Texas Constitution and mandate his impeachment as Texas Governor.

All it will take is one filed lawsuit and Perry will be in deep doo doo. The Turkey has done and hung himself beyond all redemption with his own big fat mouth.
 

Drako

Lifer
Jun 9, 2007
10,697
161
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I stand by what I said. I'm asking you guys to answer for your own standards.

Why would it mean that he is unfit for POTUS?

Do you deny people their choice of religions, and their freedom to express such beliefs?
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
So you are admitting Homer JS was right and it doesn't matter (Perry's or Obama's association with the words of there pastors) that is fine as long as you are withdrawing any criticism toward Barack Obama regarding Reverend Wright.
No, I am pointing out that Homer is a hack.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
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I am sure Rick Perry will have to address these questions sooner or later. Will be interesting to hear what he says.


But it amazing how much of stretch some of the stuff in the OP is.
AFA is helping with The Response.
AFA was founded by Wildmon
Wildmon has a son
the AFA has a spokesman
the spokesman said bad things...

And because of that Rick Perry is automatically guilty?

Meanwhile Obama sits in Rev Wright's church for 20 years and claims that he never heard anything racists, and you accept his answer?
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,783
6,340
126
I am sure Rick Perry will have to address these questions sooner or later. Will be interesting to hear what he says.


But it amazing how much of stretch some of the stuff in the OP is.
AFA is helping with The Response.
AFA was founded by Wildmon
Wildmon has a son
the AFA has a spokesman
the spokesman said bad things...

And because of that Rick Perry is automatically guilty?

Meanwhile Obama sits in Rev Wright's church for 20 years and claims that he never heard anything racists, and you accept his answer?

There was nothing "Racist" said.
 

Drako

Lifer
Jun 9, 2007
10,697
161
106
It's clear that from this time forward, only an secular humanist is fit for the office of POTUS. That is obvious to HJS.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
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I stand by what I said. I'm asking you guys to answer for your own standards.

I don't know "who you guys are", and I don't claim to speak for other people.

I'm a conservative, which is not necessarily the same as a Republican.

However, because I do feel that sitting in a church, or any other forum for that matter, listening to the kind of stuff the Rev Wright was spouting year-in and year-out for many years DOES mean something, so I'll responds.

First of all I don't know much about Rick Perry, but I think it incorrect, in the least if not downright disengenuous, to equate being at a speech and being at constant meetings for years-on-end. The two things are simply much different. FFS, all politicians, Dems & Repubs alike, campaign at events where there are many others in attendance with whom they do not agree with. To just attend the same event at some campaign rally is much different than spending every Sunday with them for years and having them as your personal advisor (only to throw them under the bus when they become buredensome).

so, IMO you're really reaching here. And you're badly mixing apple & oranges.

However, if R Perry attended this sort of stuff for years, leading me to believe he supported this sort of stuff, as Obama did with with his continued support of, and close relationship with Rev Wright, I'll never vote for him either.

But so far, I see nothing of the sort.

The Left claimed Obama was subject to assasination by association, not only wrt Wright but Mr. X (can't now recall the name of the anti-war bombing guy who is now a professor), so let us see how Perry is judged on this given the merits, or lack of.

Fern
 
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jackschmittusa

Diamond Member
Apr 16, 2003
5,972
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Sitting in a congregation is one thing. Staging a media event is another. there is no comparison.

When you stage a media event the implication is that the people that get invited to speak have a message that you think people need to hear. If you invite bigots, crackpots, and idiots to speak, it is at least a casual endorsement of what they represent.

I am perfectly comfortable believing that Perry has demonstrated that he is quite satisfied to be affiliated with the lunatic fringe. Perhaps he even embraces them and their absurd ideas.

If he believes their crap, he's just as much of a social and cultural freak as they are. If he is doing it for perceived political gain, he's an ordinary asshole.

Since I think it's a little of both, I guess I'd classify him as a freaky asshole.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
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Sitting in a congregation is one thing. Staging a media event is another. there is no comparison.
Yea, people stage media events all the time with people they may not 100% agree with.

It is part of politics.

BTW notice how most of the 'hate' against these types comes from their stance against gays and gay marriage and yet the event they held probably had nothing at all to do with gays.

The only question that really matters is what is Rick Perry's stance and gays and how would that effect his presidency.


Also, the conclusion you have to jump to with these people is crazy:
Rick Perry hangs out with gay haters thus Rick Perry hates gays.
Obama hangs out with American hating terrorists thus Obama hates America??
Obama hangs out in anti-American race baiting church thus Obama is anti-American?

Everything that the left bitched about when it came to Obama we are now going to see done with Perry. Dontcha just love American politics.
 

sportage

Lifer
Feb 1, 2008
11,492
3,163
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THere is a big difference between attending a church (as Obama had done) and organizing a church (as Perry has done). Besides, blacks have not exactly been treated as equals throughout our history, where as Perry is just plain F-in crazy.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
Perry didn't organize a church.

He attended a prayer gather with a bunch of church leaders.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Sitting in a congregation is one thing. Staging a media event is another. there is no comparison.

When you stage a media event the implication is that the people that get invited to speak have a message that you think people need to hear. If you invite bigots, crackpots, and idiots to speak, it is at least a casual endorsement of what they represent.
-snip-

Riiiiight!!!!!!!

That's why when MSNBC or CNN has Ron Paul at an event/debate they are really endorsing his views.

You can't be fuggin serious?

FFS people. :rolleyes:

Fern