RIAA lobbyist becomes federal judge, rules on file-sharing cases

[BoberFett]

This is in Belgium, not the US, but is endemic of the whole industry worldwide:

http://www.futureofcopyright.com/nc...pay-royalties-for-listening-to-the-radio.html

http://www.techeye.net/business/copyright-outfit-goes-nuts-in-the-netherlands

Modern copyright conglomerates are a bane on society, but because they're filled with people who lean more to the left, they're considered good while oil companies are bad because they're backed by evil right wingers.

LOL. Democrats.

 

[nonlnear]

Modern copyright conglomerates are a bane on society, but because they're filled with people who lean more to the left, they're considered good while oil companies are bad because they're backed by evil right wingers.

Except Citgo. Kennedys love Chavez.

 

[JSt0rm]

I guess I was caught a little off guard (in a good way). I'm just not sure how such a healthy view of the importance of a rich public domain plays into where (I thought) you were going with the file sharing comments. I suspect I misjudged the nature of your opinion of the content industry, but can't really say much more without knowing a little more about what you do...

I think that people should be able to re-work someone elses content at some point in the future. The Amen break was something like 20 years.

What can not be allowed is for consumers to be able to consume without paying. We must talk about scales here as a music album can be created by 2 guys over 6 months for a cost of 50k or less. When you steal this work you will still be giving these musicians money via public performance. However marketing suffers in this new environment so its hard to find the diamond in the rough. But thats where we are.

flip over to the movie side

A scifi channel original pos. You have seen them? 1 million dollars. No chance of recouping monies via public performance and hundreds of people working for 8 months to 5 years.

Now look at decent indie films. Around the same budgets 1 million to 4 millionish. They are dead. Almost every studio that made indie films in the united states went out of business.

As you can see it is impossible for the movie industry to exist if people steal the films.

And thanks to your industry, never will. Well done.

Without this "industry" there would be no film content and unlike most European nations the film industry in this country is completely commercialy viable ON ITS OWN. No hand outs from the government unless its via tax incentives by state because they recognize the importance this industry can have on their local economies.

I am not sure that I understand half of the laws that govern copyrighted material and file sharing. Correct me if I am wrong on what I am about to say.

I have a large screen HD television set. I also have a Blue-Ray DVD player. Suppose I go out and buy a DVD, invite some friends over, I pick up a couple cases of beer and order some pizzas, and we all watch the movie and have a good time. As far as I know, I am not doing anything illegal.

Now suppose that instead of just having friends over to watch a movie for free, I CHARGE them $5 to watch the movie. Now I am breaking the law, or at least I think I am.

But suppose I invite them over, and I let them watch the movie for free, but I charge them $5 for the beer and pizza. Am I breaking the law then?

I dont think anyone would care about this. Now if you scaled your operation up then you may have a problem.

 

[comptr6]

I think that people should be able to re-work someone elses content at some point in the future. The Amen break was something like 20 years.

What can not be allowed is for consumers to be able to consume without paying. We must talk about scales here as a music album can be created by 2 guys over 6 months for a cost of 50k or less. When you steal this work you will still be giving these musicians money via public performance. However marketing suffers in this new environment so its hard to find the diamond in the rough. But thats where we are.

Yup. Because people who risk breaking the law to pirate movies and music obviously are rolling in cash that they would be spending on entertainment products. Greedy bastards.

flip over to the movie side

A scifi channel original pos. You have seen them? 1 million dollars. No chance of recouping monies via public performance and hundreds of people working for 8 months to 5 years.

Great example. The entertainment industry has been forced by piracy to put out crappy products that no one wants to watch for decades. :|

Now look at decent indie films. Around the same budgets 1 million to 4 millionish. They are dead. Almost every studio that made indie films in the united states went out of business.

Even more proof of the impact of piracy. Almost all Indie Studios defunct = piracy. On the positive side I bet those bastards at Sun Dance will be crying when they show up and there aren't any movies to watch.

As you can see it is impossible for the movie industry to exist if people steal the films.

Considering how weak copyright laws are outside the US it's disturbing to know that the movie and music industries make zero profit outside America because nasty foreigners don't respect our copyright laws.

 

[BoberFett]

Wow, you've got comptr6 on your side Jstorm. Now I KNOW you're part of the winning team.

 

[JSt0rm]

Yup. Because people who risk breaking the law to pirate movies and music obviously are rolling in cash that they would be spending on entertainment products. Greedy bastards.

Well people should have a budget for entertainment and spend accordingly. The problem is by having unlimited content available for free means that they do not have a spending habit of purchasing content. To them they will never have enough money to spend on media as they have never budgeted it in the past.

 

[comptr6]

Well people should have a budget for entertainment and spend accordingly. The problem is by having unlimited content available for free means that they do not have a spending habit of purchasing content. To them they will never have enough money to spend on media as they have never budgeted it in the past.

Absolutely. It's the same reason we can't allow leftists to have socialized medicine in America. Instead of paying for healthcare themselves they'll leech of more responsible and hardworking Americans.

 

[BoberFett]

LMAO, I'm starting to think comptr6 is onto something, what do you think st0rmy?

 

[Jaepheth]

All I have to say is:

Copyrights should not last longer than Patents.

 

[JSt0rm]

All I have to say is:

Copyrights should not last longer than Patents.

So you should be allowed to repackage starwars and sell it?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

What if I e-mailed you a copyrighted .mp3 file? Is that public or private?

It would be private, as private as mailing a physical medium via the mail system.

In the US i understand that they have a right to check all packages and letters for whatever reason or none at all though?

But they are not going after those who are privately sharing music but rather the ones who distribute music on a grander scale.

I don't think it's strange at all, you wouldn't expect anyone doing that to get off free, would you?

If i start giving out free copies of Win7 in a square in some town i'll get arrested for it too.

Perhaps you think that i shouldn't be charged then?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

All I have to say is:

Copyrights should not last longer than Patents.

Software patents are fucking ridiculous and should be abolished right now.

So now what?

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Absolutely. It's the same reason we can't allow leftists to have socialized medicine in America. Instead of paying for healthcare themselves they'll leech of more responsible and hardworking Americans.

I'd pay to have you committed to the nearest psych ward.

 

[jhbball]

I'd pay to have you committed to the nearest psych ward.

Didn't we already determine he was a troll? As in, someone just playing the part? Just look at his sig haha.

 

[xj0hnx]

This isnt about job losses because of efficiency or changing trends in entertainment. These are job losses because huge groups of people are able to steal what they once purchased. Please tell me you see the difference?

Two things, first, it's your assumption they would have bought it in the first place, second there are still very many people that pay for their wares, whether software, music, or movies. Many of those get exposed to new stuff because people share it. If whatever you produce is useful enough people will buy it, provided it is a ware that requires some type of support, or updates. An example I'd give is Adobe products. There's probably thousands of people using it that downloaded it off the net, but most aren't using it to make anything, for their business, I have yet to meet anyone that does media production that pirates their software, either it's worth it to them to buy, they use a free alternative, or they just don't use it. The cost for their master suite is prohibitive to the end user that isn't using it to make a profit, and if there were no way to pirate it, they would just use something else, but they would never have paid the $2,000+ license to resize and crop family pics, or make silly 4chan gifs.

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Didn't we already determine he was a troll? As in, someone just playing the part? Just look at his sig haha.

I think i have a clue whos alter ego he is, i answered him and another poster replied....

I knew that before though but i kinda like arguing with one identity to get to the other, it's funny when he forgets...

 

[JohnOfSheffield]

Two things, first, it's your assumption they would have bought it in the first place, second there are still very many people that pay for their wares, whether software, music, or movies. Many of those get exposed to new stuff because people share it. If whatever you produce is useful enough people will buy it, provided it is a ware that requires some type of support, or updates. An example I'd give is Adobe products. There's probably thousands of people using it that downloaded it off the net, but most aren't using it to make anything, for their business, I have yet to meet anyone that does media production that pirates their software, either it's worth it to them to buy, they use a free alternative, or they just don't use it. The cost for their master suite is prohibitive to the end user that isn't using it to make a profit, and if there were no way to pirate it, they would just use something else, but they would never have paid the $2,000 license to resize and crop family pics, or make silly 4chan gifs.

If what you said was true, then the no cost or low cost products would have a chance, as it is, they don't, the piracy has taken that market too.

 

[jonks]

The digital medium has rewritten the game and as with Betamax the industry fought and is fighting tooth and nail against progress rather than embracing it. They could have gotten ahead of the whole mp3 thing, instead they dug in and whipped out the lawyers. Maybe they just can't charge the same thing anymore. Maybe they can't pay their execs tens of millions of dollars. Maybe they can't sign and package as many bands, most of whom suck crap anyway, and they'll have to reform their A&R departments. Maybe they can't finance as many awful $300M crapfests or pay shitty actors $20M per film. Many industries have had to go back to the drawing board on marketing, distribution and sales, manufacturing and business models after the internet hit. Something's seriously fucked up when a pirated version is not only free, but superior to the retail version which is crippled with intrusive protections, as many video games are. The entertainment industry thought it could keep doing business as usual. They were wrong. The adjustments are inevitable.

 

[bfdd]

Actually Jst0rm, people just don't want to pay to see shitty indie films. I've actually talked about this subject to one of the guys who heads up our movie group at work. It doesn't have a whole lot to do with pirating and has more to do with how Hollywood and the movie theaters structured the way they make money. It's more profitable, especially with Hollywood accounting, to make super big block busters, than tons of shitty little movies.

 

[JSt0rm]

people like indie film. Just not you and thats ok. There are lots of dogs made of course but there are lots of dog 70 million dollar films as well.

 

[bfdd]

yes people like indie films, but not enough people for them to make a profit so they aren't made as much. i'm not saying all indie films are shit(just the large majority of them) nor am i saying big block busters are always great(most of them are just as shitty as the indie films). i'm just giving you the real reason they aren't being made as much.

 

[xj0hnx]

If what you said was true, then the no cost or low cost products would have a chance, as it is, they don't, the piracy has taken that market too.

I've not seen very many "low cost" apps that would be worth it if they were free, some of the most useful I've used have been donation based.

 

[JSt0rm]

Something's seriously fucked up when a pirated version is not only free, but superior to the retail version which is crippled with intrusive protections, as many video games are. The entertainment industry thought it could keep doing business as usual. They were wrong. The adjustments are inevitable.

What pirated version of a movie is superior to a bought copy?

So basically your argument boils down to "We are gonna pirate and if these industries want to make any money then they need to figure out how to do it without making me pay for the actual movie" Do you at least see how this argument would make a industry lobby the government to have rules and laws changed in a way to stop this from happening? What needs to happen is the power to make that choice needs to be removed.

Unless you live like the unibomber I guarantee you will be buying movies and videogames again if you didnt have a choice between free and not free.

 

[JSt0rm]

yes people like indie films, but not enough people for them to make a profit so they aren't made as much. i'm not saying all indie films are shit(just the large majority of them) nor am i saying big block busters are always great(most of them are just as shitty as the indie films). i'm just giving you the real reason they aren't being made as much.

Thats not true. Films probably wont make their money back opening weekend, thats very rare but they make their money back over the course of a decade or so moving through different markets and rental/tv deals.

 

[comptr6]

I've not seen very many "low cost" apps that would be worth it if they were free, some of the most useful I've used have been donation based.

Nonsense. If what you said was true, then the no cost products would have a chance. They don't thanks to piracy, which has completely Gimped that market as well.