Revisiting XP Activation and Selling Your Soul

[buckmasterson]

The problem with activation is that it's more difficult to get a free operating system. I pay for mine, and have no problem with activation. If a person is out to steal Windows, they can hack or lie to Microsoft then post their b!tches here for sympathy. They get none from me.

 

[cowdog]

OK, here's a question. Does anyone here honestly think that a Linux distro is a viable alternative for the average computer user or a gamer? I don't see it. I work with some very bright people (climatatologists and ecologists), and many of them would be overwhelmed trying to use Linux. Mac is really the only viable alternative, but then that excludes building one's computer. Plus Mac is not cheap, and there are real software limitations. I just don't see how you all can say that "there are alternatives." Microsoft has most of us under its thumb and is doing everything possible to keep it that way (e.g., assisting SCO's nonsense). I think some of you need to get out more.

Even for some professional applications, there aren't real alternatives. To use workstation ArcInfo one has to use Windows 2000 or XP. There is no option for Linux (or Mac), which is somewhat humerous since it used to the opposite with Windows and Unix (I used to run ArcInfo on Solaris because it wasn't available for Windows).

I pay for all my software and OS licenses. This isn't about wanting something for free. It is about having to pay for something without having a viable alternative. Activation is just a minor pain on top of a mountain of crap, and that's what makes activation suck -- it is rubbing salt in the wound.

Disclaimer: WinXP runs just fine for a lot of my needs. Sure there is room for improvement and security can be a crap shoot, but it really is a good product overall. That's not an issue, for me at least.

 

[n0cmonkey]

People saying that there are no alternatives is why there are no alternatives. See my sig 🙂

 

[Sideswipe001]

Microsoft cares mostly about large corporations pirating their software. Activation keeps those big buisnesses from getting away with buying one copy for the office, and installing it on 100 machines.

If you *do* work in a big buisness, you buy your licences en mass anyway, and then you can get a copy of XP without activation. So while the end user is the one to feel it, Microsoft isn't concerned about you pirating your OS off to your friends or your 2nd computer. They care about the person who buys one copy for 1000 computers.

 

[rbV5]

First of all, most people buy their computers from a large reseller. They buy the hardware and the OS together. In fact, I have known people who thought that Office was a part of Windows. Right out of the gates, most computers with Microsoft Windows are legit.

They "were" legit to begin with perhaps. Everytime a new OS came out, everyone borrowed the CD and installed it on all their machines, at home and at work. Even the office would let the employees take the OS and any software home and install it for personal use in every organisation I've worked at in the past, that was a common everywhere, now its not.

Activation isn't a big deal if you're the legit owner of the license.

 

[rbV5]

OK, here's a question. Does anyone here honestly think that a Linux distro is a viable alternative for the average computer user or a gamer?

Its more viable than MSDOS was, and we seemed to manage back then.

 

[EeyoreX]

So while the end user is the one to feel it, Microsoft isn't concerned about you pirating your OS off to your friends or your 2nd computer. They care about the person who buys one copy for 1000 computers.

No. They do, in fact, care a great deal about the end-user pirating their software. When my family and friends the OS, and then their families and friends share the OS and this happens hundreds of thousands of time, that is huge money. Microsoft cares about all their money. As was said, businesses who are buying licenses in bulk aren't activating their versions of Windows, they are using their corporate versions that do not require activation as part of the agreement with Microsoft. It is the end users that must activate precisely because Microsoft is worried about the OS you paid for ending up on "your friends or your 2nd computer".

Its more viable than MSDOS was, and we seemed to manage back then.

Back when? In the DOS days, DOS was the better and more viable alternative to Windows for gaming. Most games, even well into the era of Windows 95, ran in DOS or DOS mode, not natively in Windows.

\Dan

 

[cowdog]

OK, I haven't been back to this thread for a few days.

I've never really seen the whole illegal Windows stuff going on. Maybe Montanans are just more honest and law abiding? 😉

Using Microsoft Windows anymore is like having one choice for an automobile, the $20,000 Microbumper XX. And when you replace your oil filter, you then need to call Microbumper to get your car "activated" again. I personally don't like having to ask permission to use something I bought. And oh yeah, the Microbumper XX requires weekly updates or it autmatically turns on and opens the door for anyone who walks by. Anyway, then you get a little peeved, so you look harder to see if there really are alternatives. Well it turns out you can buy a $60,000 Camry-like car or get a build it yourself Mars exploration vehicle for "free." And much of the reason you have those two great alternatives is because Microbumper is a giant and a wee bit overly "competitive."

Just wait until every piece of software has an activation. That will be interesting. I'm sure it won't be a hassle at all. (rolls eyes...) I am also sure we will see it happen.


Anyway, on a more serious note, Linux really is making strides. Just going from Redhat 8 to Fedora Core 1 x86_64 is a very nice improvement. All I need are a few highly specialized pieces of software to run on Linux, and I'm there. An ATI driver that doesn't crash and burn would help too. Then when I'm Microsoft-free, I can complain about the tyranny of Linux!!!!!

 

[X14]

XP has a 50-time activation limit...I know I've reached it twice. When you reach it you must call MSFT to reset it and the don't give you any hassle over it. The only thing is you need to manually enter about a 50 digit code (different from the serial# you have) to reset and activate.

 

[stash]

Originally posted by: X14
XP has a 50-time activation limit...I know I've reached it twice. When you reach it you must call MSFT to reset it and the don't give you any hassle over it. The only thing is you need to manually enter about a 50 digit code (different from the serial# you have) to reset and activate.

That is absolutely not true. Please read the Product Activation FAQ

"Re-installation and re-activation on the same PC can be done an unlimited number of times."

"If the hard disk is reformatted and the software is reinstalled, reactivation will be required. The same grace periods for activation apply in this situation. Reactivation on the same PC can be completed as many times as required."

Also, SP1 introduced a grace period after a significant hardware change. You now have three days to reactivate after making a hardware change that requires a reactivation.

 

[X14]

Dude don't waste your time trying to tell me it's not true. I'm not even going to bother reading the FAQ because I have loaded XP over 100 times on my computers. I've called MSFT 2x to reset my activiation limit...you probably have never done it right? The last time I called I wrote down the insane 50 digit number so that the next time it happens I won't have to call unless this 50-digit number changes everytime you have to reset.

 

[stash]

I don't know a better way to explain this to you, but there is no activation limit when you install on identical hardware. None, nada, zero, it does not exist.

We also don't collect personal information (unless you choose to register) nor can we tell what hardware you are running. For some reason the tin-foil hats out there think we care enough about what is in your computer to dedicate some crack squad to poring over the information that is sent during every activation.

Something caused your hardware hash value to change enough to require reactivation. Remember that hardware changes are culmulative, so multiple "small" hardware changes that are not enough to prompt a reactivation alone will eventually get you over the limit and require you to reactivate.

 

[sharq]

You're the consumer, you don't like something, and the business isn't willing to work with you, then take your business elsewhere. To list a few OS's off the top of my head:
Linux
BSD
FreeDos
Mac OSX
Solaris

EDIT: Was being redundant, Linux is considered an alternative to windows.

 

[KF]

Linux is not bad. If you sold the machine with Linux and the needed programs installed, it should be pretty easily useable by average people. The first time the average user needs to install something new, he is going to have a hard time. Now if the new things just had a fool-proof installer, that would not be a problem. Of course, expecting an OS to run programs tailored to an alien OS (such as Windows games) is unrealistic.

> it is a subtle way of selling your soul... seems innocent, and not a big deal,
>but it is a total debasement... think about it...

Possibly you're problem is that you have bought into the "law equals morality" concept, or what some call statism. Marrying your soul to the "state" is a formula for neurosis. You can take pills for it, or maybe you are ready to get a divorce...

See:
one liberty-oriented email list. economics and liberty
Ever hear of Ludwig von Mises? Agree or not, it's a trip.

The governments roll in this is the enforcement of contracts of this type, and the enforcement of copyrights. They have also made evasion of protection schemes illegal in the DMCA. A copyright is a government enforced monopoly. For some reason people get upset about monopolies obtained through cut-throat competition (which are maintained by low prices), but not government enforced monopolies (the effect of which is to raise prices.)

The extent to which MS might appear to be a monopoly is primarily the result of MS selling its product so cheap (in comparison to Unix, for instance.) The problem with enforcing anti-monopoly laws is that the types of remedies the govenment always wants to use involve indirectly raising prices. Anti-monopoly laws are designed to protect competitors, that is: some other corporation, rather than consumers. It is very hard to protect a competitor, if not impossible, without forcing prices higher. If you are willing to pay much higher prices, then the government can arrange synthetic competition, more of sham than the real thing. It introduces simulated competition at the expense of the consumer.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: X14
Dude don't waste your time trying to tell me it's not true. I'm not even going to bother reading the FAQ because I have loaded XP over 100 times on my computers. I've called MSFT 2x to reset my activiation limit...you probably have never done it right? The last time I called I wrote down the insane 50 digit number so that the next time it happens I won't have to call unless this 50-digit number changes everytime you have to reset.

Why did you have to reinstall it that many times?

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: sharq
You're the consumer, you don't like something, and the business isn't willing to work with you, then take your business elsewhere. To list a few OS's off the top of my head:
Linux
BSD
FreeDos
Mac OSX
Solaris

EDIT: Was being redundant, Linux is considered an alternative to windows.

BSD includes:
FreeBSD
NetBSD
OpenBSD
ekkoBSD
DragonflyBSD
MirOS

 

[sharq]

n0cmonkey: I just said BSD cause aren't they all really similar? I mean the BSD part of them. There are a million and one Linux distro's that would give me a headache to try and list. 🙂

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: sharq
n0cmonkey: I just said BSD cause aren't they all really similar? I mean the BSD part of them. There are a million and one Linux distro's that would give me a headache to try and list. 🙂

All Linux distributions are one operating system. Each BSD is a different operating system. 😉

Although the smaller ones are based on existing BSD projects:
DragonflyBSD is based on FreeBSD 4.something.
EkkoBSD and MirOS are based on OpenBSD.

And I forgot to mention BSD/OS. 😛

EDIT: I guess it's MirBSD, not MirOS... Or not. Can't figure it out 😛