Requirements for IT positions or jobs similar.

[AreaCode707]

I have a friend that hit MS in its' heyday straight out of high school and so he never went to college. Fast forward a few years and he's still doing grunt work; eventually his MS department was cut and he found that he couldn't get past grunt level jobs because of his lack of college degree. He gets by ok because he was responsible with his MS salary back in the day, but I know it's a constant frustration for him.

 

[ShawnD1]

Community college degrees are held in high regard, and traditional 4 year degrees perhaps passed over as overqualified.

So true. Guys with 2 year certificates often work right next to the guys with 4 year certificates. My sister in law has some 2 year water treatment certificate and she manages the water treatment plant at night. You won't find regular high school graduates in a position like that.

If you won't attend a 4 year university, at least go to community college for a 2 year ticket in something. 2 is not as good as 4, but it's infinitely better than 0.

 

[chusteczka]

Our economy is no longer recovering from WWII with numerous uneducated but good quality young men returning from the war. Everyone is now going to school. The competition is at a higher level.

With our prolonged recession, fewer immigrants are entering this country. It is getting harder and harder to find good quality maids and janitors. Your unqualified status will be perfectly suited to clean the dirt off my floor. I have a place for you, give me a call.


Seriously now, I was also "lazy" and thought I knew the world when in high school. 6 years in the military as a ship's mechanic taught me that I would rather live the rest of my life working in an atmosphere controlled office in a comfortable chair with student debt than as a blue-collar worker. Not only did the military motivate me to achieve a solid education but it paid my way through veteran's benefits after my honorable discharge. If you "know" and like computers, consider joining the military as a computer technician. You will either enjoy the experience and stay for a career or hate it but receive the motivation to achieve an education.

Stop being lazy and realize your view on the world is wrong.

 

[AreaCode707]

Stop being lazy and realize your view on the world is wrong.

Them's the fightin' words of our generation. How DARE you tell someone that they are wrong! That's like asserting that there are absolutes in the world, and nobody could possibly be THAT bigoted!

😉

 

[vi edit]

If you want to work...around...computers without a degree then you can pick up some trade labor skills doing network runs and maybe some data center construction for electric companies. If you want to program then look at doing little apps on the side like stuff on the Apple store. Use that to build a resume/cash.

At this point in the game as has been pretty much beat to a pulp...not having a degree in the IT field is a major uphill battle.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I would at least get a 2 or 3 year Comp sci program. Though, if you think you can pull it off, just start your own business. It's a risk but if you think you can do it, go for it. Then you are your own boss and you don't have to worry about silly school/college/university. IMO school did not do much for me in the real world. I just did it because I had to, to get a decent job. I always hated the concept of school. Try to memorize a bunch of stuff, then write a test, then be graded on how well you could remember all that stuff. It's pointless in the real world. Still has to be done though.

 

[vi edit]

I would at least get a 2 or 3 year Comp sci program. Though, if you think you can pull it off, just start your own business. It's a risk but if you think you can do it, go for it. Then you are your own boss and you don't have to worry about silly school/college/university. IMO school did not do much for me in the real world. I just did it because I had to, to get a decent job. I always hated the concept of school. Try to memorize a bunch of stuff, then write a test, then be graded on how well you could remember all that stuff. It's pointless in the real world. Still has to be done though.

I could make the argument that a lot of the shit my boss wants done is pointless too...but I have to do it.

 

[chusteczka]

Them's the fightin' words of our generation. How DARE you tell someone that they are wrong! That's like asserting that there are absolutes in the world, and nobody could possibly be THAT bigoted!

😉

Seriously? You are correct, going through life is not absolutely wrong. However, I solidly recommend achieving an education due to the way it has empowered my life and changed the way I see the world. I am no longer at anyone's whim, whether it be a company gracious enough to employ my unqualified self or by people attempting to take advantage of me.

With 6 years military experience, 9 years of school, and 4 years of related experience, I am finally at a place in my life where I can call the shots. I co-own patents and am starting a business to leverage those patents. Without my education, I would still be a ship's mechanic in the Navy, working 90 hour weeks for just enough money to get by, with my life in danger on a daily basis.

If I had gone straight to school, I would have achieved such a self-actualized state earlier in my life.

 

[Tristicus]

I could make the argument that a lot of the shit my boss wants done is pointless too...but I have to do it.

I'll do pointless shit if I'm getting paid for it.

 

[chusteczka]

Education is similar to evolution. The higher educated a person is, the more evolved that person is. This reality is impossible to understand until that education is achieved and levels of mental competence are realized.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I could make the argument that a lot of the shit my boss wants done is pointless too...but I have to do it.

Yeah that is true, though a good percentage of your job has some use. If it does not, then time to look for another because if the company realizes this, they'll probably illiminate the job. :biggrin:

But yeah I see what you're saying, and it is true. Even where I work, our crazy IT manager is always asking us pointless things like status reports and other time wasters that stop us from doing actual work. Me and my co worker have spent days just putting together his stupid status reports. Then there's the hours on end we get soap boxed by him... it's hard to get any work done overthere!

 

[vi edit]

Or like my day today. Hospital emails my boss screaming that they need a workstation up and running and converted from a test environment to production around 8:00. So I hop on there and by 9:00 AM I get it converted and up and running.

And I leave the remote admin window up and running to make sure that everything looks good.

And they don't sign on to the freaking thing all day.

Yeh...real emergency there people.

 

[Red Squirrel]

Or like my day today. Hospital emails my boss screaming that they need a workstation up and running and converted from a test environment to production around 8:00. So I hop on there and by 9:00 AM I get it converted and up and running.

And I leave the remote admin window up and running to make sure that everything looks good.

And they don't sign on to the freaking thing all day.

Yeh...real emergency there people.

lol I see that all the time. People will freak out that something needs to be done NOW but when it's done they don't even have time or care about it.

 

[Imdmn04]

Times have changed. Do not compare your father's days to the present.

Even college grads is having a tough time finding jobs these days, what make you think you can stay ahead of them? Here is the pecking order when you hire someone:

People with both degree+experiences > people with just experiences > people with just a degree > people without either (you).

You can be the next Einstein and no one would notice simply because you get automatically filtered out if you don't have a degree. Without a degree, your resume won't even make it past the database filter, much less getting into the HR/hiring manager's hands.

 

[AreaCode707]

Seriously? You are correct, going through life is not absolutely wrong. However, I solidly recommend achieving an education due to the way it has empowered my life and changed the way I see the world. I am no longer at anyone's whim, whether it be a company gracious enough to employ my unqualified self or by people attempting to take advantage of me.

With 6 years military experience, 9 years of school, and 4 years of related experience, I am finally at a place in my life where I can call the shots. I co-own patents and am starting a business to leverage those patents. Without my education, I would still be a ship's mechanic in the Navy, working 90 hour weeks for just enough money to get by, with my life in danger on a daily basis.

If I had gone straight to school, I would have achieved such a self-actualized state earlier in my life.

No, not seriously. 🙂 Check your sarcasm metre. I very much agreed with your original post.

 

[ShawnD1]

But yeah I see what you're saying, and it is true. Even where I work, our crazy IT manager is always asking us pointless things like status reports and other time wasters that stop us from doing actual work. Me and my co worker have spent days just putting together his stupid status reports. Then there's the hours on end we get soap boxed by him... it's hard to get any work done overthere!

I hate those jobs so much. At one job, the managers wanted us to record how many hours we spent doing things because they wanted to synergize our efficiency for maximum proactiveness. There would sometimes be entire days where there was nothing to do because all of the reactors were up and running, but of course we couldn't write that we did nothing all day because then we might get fired. We'd put random stuff like "housekeeping" so it sounded like we were at least getting something done. What was our next meeting about? We're spending too much time doing housekeeping. We need one person who's 100% dedicated to housekeeping for the day then we'll alternate days.

Managers are retarded. Every single one of them.

 

[Tristicus]

Oh, and I'm not set on IT jobs specifically. I do however want to work with computers.

 

[ShawnD1]

police officers have computers. you should be a police officer.

 

[Tristicus]

As long as I can shoot people in the face.

 

[duragezic]

At the least, if you want to be in IT or similar technical field, you should at least get an Associates degree and work towards some certs. With that you could probably get an entry level helpdesk or similar job making $30k/yr.

2 yrs of school goes by very quick and it is very cheap at a community college. Also you can easily get grants if you're not dependent and have low income.

I think not going would have you looking back when you are 28 thinking "man this sucks, why didn't I just get my degree when I was 20?". Sure there are stories of people even this day who are successful without, but it's not the norm.

If not set on IT, look into the trades. You don't need a 4 year degree but I do suggest some college or vocational training.

 

[theevilsharpie]

What are usually the prerequisites for these types of jobs?

For IT jobs? Although there are some exceptions, most employers just want someone that's willing and able to do the job they're advertising at a rate they can afford to pay.

The question you need to ask yourself is how you can convince an employer that you're capable of doing the job. Enough people exaggerate or outright lie on their resume that an employer isn't going to take your word for it; they want to see verifiable experience and/or certification by a trusted party (an educational institute, a vendor, etc.) that you have the knowledge needed to be successful on the job.

If you resume is good enough to get an interview, you then need to convince the employer that you know what you're talking about and that you can solve their problems.

Based on your post, it doesn't look like you have any relevant experience or degrees/certificates, and it doesn't look like you know anybody that can put in a good word for you. Employers, especially in this economy, get so many resumes from candidates as equally (un)qualified as you that they'll look at your resume for a few seconds and then just throw it in the trash. In the unlikely event that you do get an interview, phrases like "I'm good with computers" or "I want to work with computers" won't inspire much confidence in your skills.

If you don't want to go into debt for a bachelor's degree, I strongly recommended going to a community college and getting an associate's degree, or at least going through their computer science program. It's not expensive, and the credentials you'll receive from the college will help establish your credibility in the field. You may even have an opportunity to gain some experience with an internship. In addition, many community college professors that teach vocational subjects actually work in the industry, and they may be able to get your foot in the door if you impress them.

Once you've broken into the industry, you can move up quite quickly if you kick ass and impress your employer. You'll probably reach a point where you can't really advance without more education, but by that time, you'll have a better idea of whether pursuing said education is worthwhile.

Edit: BTW, many of the courses that you take at a community college will count towards course requirements for a four-year university. If you get an associate's degree and then later decide to pursue further education, you won't have to start at the bottom.

 

[chusteczka]

No, not seriously. 🙂 Check your sarcasm metre. I very much agreed with your original post.

🙂

Oh, and I'm not set on IT jobs specifically. I do however want to work with computers.

A computer is a tool. Saying you want to work with computers is like saying you really like table saws and want to work with a table saw. The three ways to work with a table saw is to:

1. repair them (E.g. computer technician),
2. setup tablesaws and other woodworking equipment for others to work with (E.g. network technician or system administrator), or
3. work with them as a carpenter, artist, or generic woodworker (E.g. computer programmer)

Little education is required to repair tablesaws or computers, merely experience. Such work will provide just enough to get by in life. Certifications are necessary.

Setting up a woodworking shop or computer center can provide enough to happily live with but is in a middle, grey area. Certifications are necessary. Some people will succeed, others will not.

The real payoff is through creating assets with educated knowledge such as a skilled woodworker or computer programmer.

Education is necessary but a person may get by with the right certifications. This still requires school.

Attending schools to earn certifications will teach a student methods to accomplish tasks that are created by other people. Attending school to earn a degree can teach theory that will provide the ability to create the system that other people operate or setup.

Without an education, a person may get by in life but will definitely be lower in the food chain. Simply put, life is easier with an education.

 

[AreaCode707]

Let's give this a try. I work for a major tech corporation and we're hiring at all levels. Convince me, right now, that you've got the chops to work for us and I will refer you in to an appropriate position.

This is true, and it's a real offer. Tell me what you've got.

 

[Tristicus]

I don't have enough to work my way in a major tech corporation. I still need to do work, nobody is debating that.

 

[AreaCode707]

I don't have enough to work my way in a major tech corporation. I still need to do work, nobody is debating that.

Major tech corporations need everything a smaller company would have and more. There are help desk and deskside support jobs, there are entry level roles all over the place.

So sell me on your computer work and get yourself in the door. Give it a shot. It's the same thing you'll have to do with anyone else.

By contrast, I've referred people straight out of college directly in before, folks from the forums who've sent their resumes. I know their degree means that they've got a shot. Convince me that you could compete with those folks for the same entry level positions and I'll refer you.