Republicans unveil new ObamaCare replacement plan

[theeedude]

I agree, but the single payer should be the patient and not the government.

Do you even understand what single payer means? Unless there is only one patient insured in the whole country, it's not going to be single payer.

 

[Blanky]

You know what other treatments are cheap and getting cheaper all the time? Ones not covered under insurance like laser vision correction where people need to pay out of pocket. How could that possibly be since it's not universally covered by government?

You just said why. Insurance is not messing it up, which is exactly my point.

 

[fskimospy]

You know what other treatments are cheap and getting cheaper all the time? Ones not covered under insurance like laser vision correction where people need to pay out of pocket. How could that possibly be since it's not universally covered by government?

FYI, a quick google search says that the cost of LASIK increased about 7% last year, which was far above overall medical cost inflation.

 

[theeedude]

LASIC is elective. That's why it's not rising as fast. Not because of insurance.
Dental often is insured, but it's not rising as fast either because it's usually elective.
Consumer is not under duress or threat to health when deciding to purchase it or not.

 

[brycejones]

according to the libs here, Europe is falling apart and the USA is doing better economically, so I guess if we want to copy failure we should do what Europe is doing right?

According to liberals we should look for things that regardless of their source.
Tell you what since you are basically linking Europe's recent economic performance to healthcare, how about you provide some evidence of that.

 

[First]

FYI, a quick google search says that the cost of LASIK increased about 7% last year, which was far above overall medical cost inflation.

LASIC is elective. That's why it's not rising as fast. Not because of insurance.
Dental often is insured, but it's not rising as fast either because it's usually elective.
Consumer is not under duress or threat to health when deciding to purchase it or not.

To say nothing of the fact that laser eye surgery isn't particular complicated nor does anyone make end of life decisions about whether to have lasik, lol.

 

[piasabird]

Instead of changing a lot just change a couple of things like the 30 hour rule as a work week. That should be 40 hours. Then subsidies should be based on last year's income tax form. Also just let people pay the penalty on a payment plan, not all at once. A lot of these people are unable to work due to physical limitations or they were laid off by an evil corporation. So if a company lays you off make them pay part of your insurance till the end of the year.

Try finding a job when you are 60, a diabetic that cant walk, and limited mobility in a bad shoulder. My wife applied for disability and they told her it takes 6 months to do the application and get an answer back.

 

[chucky2]

It is unreal how F'd up Congress is, both sides. If we ran Org's like this even our multi-$B Co would eventually go out of business. Unreal...

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

So you don`t like who is in control - change it. Shit, for a country that was founded because it won a war of independence, you guys are a bunch of whiners. Boo freakin hoo. Change the damn system.

Personally I`d still prefer the government to deliver my healthcare than to think some asshole was profiting off of my sickness.

I'd love to change the system so we realize the independence we believed we were going to have. Once that's done I'll gladly talk about handing your health coverage over to someone like Dick Cheney.

 

[cbrunny]

I'm Canadian.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

I'm Canadian.

Good. You have Dick Cheney running your health care then get back and tell us how it's improved. The system needs reform in a significant way, but handing it to fools who make delivering diabetic test strips under Medicare illegal even though it doesn't cost the government or patient one cent isn't the way to go. Yes that's the law now.

 

[Mxylplyx]

The Republicans put out this proposal only to give themselves political cover, and would shit themselves if it ever came to the point where they might have to implement it. While Obamacare is a shitty detour to the inevitable destination of single payer healthcare, it is light years better than what we had, and I'd bet many of the politicians railing against it would agree in private. It's too bad so many healthcare dollars have to be needlessly sucked out of the system for insurance companies who add absolutely no value to the process. I guess making sure ample profit exists in it is the American way.

 

[dank69]

Instead of changing a lot just change a couple of things like the 30 hour rule as a work week. That should be 40 hours. Then subsidies should be based on last year's income tax form. Also just let people pay the penalty on a payment plan, not all at once. A lot of these people are unable to work due to physical limitations or they were laid off by an evil corporation. So if a company lays you off make them pay part of your insurance till the end of the year.

Try finding a job when you are 60, a diabetic that cant walk, and limited mobility in a bad shoulder. My wife applied for disability and they told her it takes 6 months to do the application and get an answer back.

Changing the "30 hour rule" to 40 would be an unmitigated disaster. Businesses would literally cut everyone's hours to 39 and not have to provide benefits for anyone.

 

[theeedude]

Good. You have Dick Cheney running your health care then get back and tell us how it's improved. The system needs reform in a significant way, but handing it to fools who make delivering diabetic test strips under Medicare illegal even though it doesn't cost the government or patient one cent isn't the way to go. Yes that's the law now.

So don't elect Dick Cheney to run health care. It's a choice.

 

[Slew Foot]

I have never understood the obsession with tort 'reform'. The idea that if someone paralyzes you for life or whatever that your award should be capped at some arbitrary (and generally quite low) level seems nuts.

You know how the VA, Kaiser, and the NHS in England keep costs down? This is one way.

 

[MovingTarget]

So remove the mandate and people who refuse coverage can still show up @hospital and be treated?

This. The mandate is the only thing that really makes the ACA work overall, numbers-wise, especially when you consider all the other benefits it guarantees over what we previously had.

When Republicans originally came up with the idea for the system that became the ACA, this was billed as making sure that people took "personal responsibility" for the health care costs they create for hospitals.

 

[fskimospy]

You know how the VA, Kaiser, and the NHS in England keep costs down? This is one way.

A very very small way.

 

[First]

You know how the VA, Kaiser, and the NHS in England keep costs down? This is one way.

Tort reform actually doesn't do shit. It has been tried at the state level, specifically in TX. The results weren't good. Fact is it does very little good from a cost perspective, and immeasurably more harm from a consumer perspective. Let's incompetent docs off the hook.

 

[Victorian Gray]

So you support the model where patients go to doctors every time they have a hangnail since it's "free" as their premiums are already a sunk cost? Works the same if you substitute "taxes" instead of premiums. Why you purposely want to create a Tragedy of the Commons situation completely baffles me.

Nice strawman. I think it needs a hat though. I'm not sure that it's fooling the crows.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Good. You have Dick Cheney running your health care then get back and tell us how it's improved. The system needs reform in a significant way, but handing it to fools who make delivering diabetic test strips under Medicare illegal even though it doesn't cost the government or patient one cent isn't the way to go. Yes that's the law now.

Umm, that's the point. We *didn't* elect Dick Cheney, you guys did. Change your system or, I guess, stop complaining about it.

In Canada, in the '90s, the general populace became extremely upset with one of the primary political parties. A party that had been there at the founding of Canada. That party no longer exists on the federal level and barely exists in a couple of provinces.

 

[Slew Foot]

Tort reform actually doesn't do shit. It has been tried at the state level, specifically in TX. The results weren't good. Fact is it does very little good from a cost perspective, and immeasurably more harm from a consumer perspective. Let's incompetent docs off the hook.

CA has tight limits on malpractice rewards and as a result, malpractice costs for physicians are lower, and as such, reimbursements from insurers are lower to make up the difference. The fact that the insurer doesnt pass the costs savings to the consumer, is a part of capitalism.

 

[cbrunny]

Umm, that's the point. We *didn't* elect Dick Cheney, you guys did. Change your system or, I guess, stop complaining about it.

In Canada, in the '90s, the general populace became extremely upset with one of the primary political parties. A party that had been there at the founding of Canada. That party no longer exists on the federal level and barely exists in a couple of provinces.

True. Parliament FTW. Throw the bums out - we can actually do that.

I don't understand the necessity for such rigidity in the US system. In my opinion, that's it's biggest flaw, and will ultimately be its undoing.

 

[cbrunny]

Good. You have Dick Cheney running your health care then get back and tell us how it's improved. The system needs reform in a significant way, but handing it to fools who make delivering diabetic test strips under Medicare illegal even though it doesn't cost the government or patient one cent isn't the way to go. Yes that's the law now.

In Canada healthcare is delivered by the Provinces. So, even if we had elected Dick Cheney, which we didn't, he wouldn't have any control or authority over our healthcare. Right now we have a Conservative majority government that has a primary plank in its platform of eliminating the deficit. The only way it could leverage healthcare to balance the books (assuming it was even politically possible, and I can say with certainty that Canada would lose its shit and burn Parliament down if somehow the feds 'took away' healthcare) is by dramatically reducing transfer payments to the provinces (with probable promises of major tax cuts at the federal level when the books are balanced, or something like that). Even then, I'd assume that provinces would simply increase taxes, and the vast majority of people would be perfectly fine with this trade-off in that context. But, really, this has no chance of happening because Canadians value healthcare that is fair and equitable and is not profit-driven.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Umm, that's the point. We *didn't* elect Dick Cheney, you guys did. Change your system or, I guess, stop complaining about it.

In Canada, in the '90s, the general populace became extremely upset with one of the primary political parties. A party that had been there at the founding of Canada. That party no longer exists on the federal level and barely exists in a couple of provinces.

Neither Democrat nor Republican party will allow change. We're an oligarchy and changing the Constitution can't happen without their approval. The Democrats want to fight the Republicans and vice versa. Since I have to live with the foolishness of others without my consent I certainly can and will complain. Since you couldn't vote here to elect Cheney, or a Democrat who doesn't know the first thing for that matter you have no business telling me to accept something from those idiots.

To quote Mr Horse, "No sir, I didn't like it".

 

[dphantom]

I like many things about ACA as well and this particular proposal addresses several of the most popular features. But the devil is in the details, so I'm going to withhold judgment for now.

I as well. ACA has its problems but also addresses a number of things that were broken or needed to be addressed such as preexisting conditions.