Republicans losing their resolve on Obamacare, losing their votes, and losing face.

[Blackjack200]

Hayabusa Rider was talking about repeal and replace...not Booker.

Yeah, I don't think if they fail in repeal/replace they'll be voted out of office. I don't think they were voted in office to repeal/replace, so it doesn't follow that a failure there would swing congress.

 

[vi edit]

This is the one issue which above others makes or breaks the Republicans. If they fail then Congress will likely change hands.

Interesting times, eh?"

Will it though? I'm just continuously surprised at how self-hating a large percentage of voters are. Good grief I'm starting to sound like Moonbeam.

 

[Jhhnn]

Be interesting to see what happens. Obamacare didn't address healthcare itself, it couldn't as things stand and so eventually it needed to be replaced with something more intelligently derived. The Republicans now have that task and I don't see them doing much better, perhaps not as well, but it will be entertaining. I've stocked up on violins and popcorn to watch "Rome" burn. I hope I don't have to bring them out.

This is the one issue which above others makes or breaks the Republicans. If they fail then Congress will likely change hands. If they miraculously pull it off the Dems are in real trouble.

Interesting times, eh?

I think Repubs have painted themselves into a tight corner. Mere repeal throws ~20M people under the bus & the whole system into chaos. So they need to account for that with some sort of plan beyond the usual FYGM. OTOH, they're ideologically opposed to putting their name on anything socialistic, which is what the situation demands.

They hadn't planned on Trump winning the election but rather on keeping "Repeal Obamacare!" as another perma-issue like abortion. The fact that they have no plan tells us that. Expect witch doctors chanting, dancing & shaking their rattles around a very, very smoky fire.

 

[Blackjack200]

Will it though? I'm just continuously surprised at how self-hating a large percentage of voters are. Good grief I'm starting to sound like Moonbeam.

Did you have the sense that repeal of the ACA was a central campaign theme? I didn't. Seemed like immigration, jobs, "drain the swamp" etc.

I hate to say it, I just don't think Trump supporters will care.

 

[vi edit]

Yeah, I don't think if they fail in repeal/replace they'll be voted out of office. I don't think they were voted in office to repeal/replace, so it doesn't follow that a failure there would swing congress.

Did you have the sense that repeal of the ACA was a central campaign theme? I didn't. Seemed like immigration, jobs, "drain the swamp" etc.

I hate to say it, I just don't think Trump supporters will care.

From his own page:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/health-care/

#1 Repeal and Replace Obamacare. In the debates, particularly in the 2nd one he went on a giant rant about how awful it was and it needed to die. The GOP has been giddy with anticipation for years to have a stacked GOP government to do just this. YES. I did sense they would try and kill it. Guess it's time to really see how hard core party line some people really are. My faith in voting intelligently is at an all time low though.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

From his own page:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/health-care/

#1 Repeal and Replace Obamacare. In the debates, particularly in the 2nd one he went on a giant rant about how awful it was and it needed to die. The GOP has been giddy with anticipation for years to have a stacked GOP government to do just this. YES. I did sense they would try and kill it. Guess it's time to really see how hard core party line some people really are. My faith in voting intelligently is at an all time low though.

nevermind.....

 

[vi edit]

nevermind.....

I'm not sure The Donald is able to make it past a 2nd or 3rd point. Have to keep lists short for Toddler in Chief.

 

[Blackjack200]

From his own page:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/health-care/

#1 Repeal and Replace Obamacare. In the debates, particularly in the 2nd one he went on a giant rant about how awful it was and it needed to die. The GOP has been giddy with anticipation for years to have a stacked GOP government to do just this. YES. I did sense they would try and kill it. Guess it's time to really see how hard core party line some people really are. My faith in voting intelligently is at an all time low though.

Yeah, I didn't mean that it wasn't part of his platform, or something that the GOP wasn't talking about, but I just don't remember it was a driver the way immigration was. I mean, look at his cabinet appointments, look at how he all but told his supporters that "lock her up" was just a lie to get elected. They don't give a shit.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I'm not sure The Donald is able to make it past a 2nd or 3rd point. Have to keep lists short for Toddler in Chief.

I misread. For some reason I thought that was the entire platform with Repeal being first on the list. Then I sobered up. Still it's been central to the entire GOP for the last 7 years.

 

[PokerGuy]

So the title of the thread, losing their resolve, losing votes, losing face. Didn't the senate just vote last night? Doesn't look like anyone lost their resolve, they did what they set out to do, now it goes to the house, they'll definitely do their job as well. The real question is what they are doing to come up with a new plan.

 

[ivwshane]

So the title of the thread, losing their resolve, losing votes, losing face. Didn't the senate just vote last night? Doesn't look like anyone lost their resolve, they did what they set out to do, now it goes to the house, they'll definitely do their job as well. The real question is what they are doing to come up with a new plan.

All they've done is lay the ground work. They are still a long way from repeal and even farther from replace.
Have they lost their resolve? I don't think so.

 

[hal2kilo]

So the title of the thread, losing their resolve, losing votes, losing face. Didn't the senate just vote last night? Doesn't look like anyone lost their resolve, they did what they set out to do, now it goes to the house, they'll definitely do their job as well. The real question is what they are doing to come up with a new plan.

In the dead of the the night. So proud they are.

 

[boomerang]

There is no question in regards to if it will be repealed and replaced. There is no option. It must be done. It was extremely flawed right out of the gate.

 

[boomerang]

In the dead of the the night. So proud they are.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander applies. I see no reason why Republicans can't operate under the same rules as the Democrats.

 

[Jhhnn]

All they've done is lay the ground work. They are still a long way from repeal and even farther from replace.
Have they lost their resolve? I don't think so.

It's all posturing so far-

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/12/us/politics/health-care-congress-vote-a-rama.html?_r=0

 

[ivwshane]

There is no question in regards to if it will be repealed and replaced. There is no option. It must be done. It was extremely flawed right out of the gate.

I see you are expecting the Republican replacement to be perfect out of the gate. Great!

 

[Jhhnn]

There is no question in regards to if it will be repealed and replaced. There is no option. It must be done. It was extremely flawed right out of the gate.

Which is why 20M Americans now have coverage they lacked previously. Cuz it's so screwed up & all.

 

[PokerGuy]

In the dead of the the night. So proud they are.

The reason the vote went into the dead of the night is the attempted obstruction by the D's. It wasn't one of those where the R's tried to do something in the middle of the night and hope nobody would notice. The R's didn't want this to be a late night thing, they want very much to show their constituents that they are doing what the voters want them to do.

 

[PokerGuy]

There is no question in regards to if it will be repealed and replaced. There is no option. It must be done.

I'm not so sure about that. Sure, they are taking the right steps, but we'll see if congress has the stones to do what needs to be done and see it all the way through.

Generally, once something that massive takes hold in government, it's virtually impossible to get it back out. I'm quite frankly amazed that we might actually see such a rare instance.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

From his own page:
https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/health-care/

#1 Repeal and Replace Obamacare. In the debates, particularly in the 2nd one he went on a giant rant about how awful it was and it needed to die. The GOP has been giddy with anticipation for years to have a stacked GOP government to do just this. YES. I did sense they would try and kill it. Guess it's time to really see how hard core party line some people really are. My faith in voting intelligently is at an all time low though.

Problem is what little Trump has spoke about indicates the replacement will either be something very similar to ACA or a public Single payer to remove the issue from business

 

[Blackjack200]

So the title of the thread, losing their resolve, losing votes, losing face. Didn't the senate just vote last night? Doesn't look like anyone lost their resolve, they did what they set out to do, now it goes to the house, they'll definitely do their job as well. The real question is what they are doing to come up with a new plan.

When I created the thread, it was based on a NYMag article about some of the senators balking at moving forward with the repeal before a replacement is in hand. I admit, it didn't turn out that way.

 

[Blackjack200]

The reason the vote went into the dead of the night is the attempted obstruction by the D's.

I thought they just needed a simple majority on this one?

 

[boomerang]

I'm not so sure about that. Sure, they are taking the right steps, but we'll see if congress has the stones to do what needs to be done and see it all the way through.

Generally, once something that massive takes hold in government, it's virtually impossible to get it back out. I'm quite frankly amazed that we might actually see such a rare instance.

It isn't going to be a wham-bam thank you ma'am kind of deal. That's already been said by Republicans. It has to be unwound out of the system over time. Plus, it created numerous revenue streams that went who knows where but still must be dealt with. It is unsustainable as written. Everybody knows this even if they don't want to publicly admit it.

Democrats have a choice to fight it or work with Republicans to fix it. But first they have to decide if it's more important to save face with their constituents or if it's better to admit the failure and work to make it viable.

Republicans have to decide if they actually want to make it viable or if they would prefer to give the whole thing a lot of lip service. Their problem is that it's too huge of a problem to sweep under the rug with some stern wording and a smoke and mirror job.

 

[boomerang]

I see you are expecting the Republican replacement to be perfect out of the gate. Great!

I don't know what gave you that idea. It would be a fucking miracle if it was. I do know one thing, whatever they come up with will not be acceptable to the progressive left. That's pretty much a given.

 

[PokerGuy]

I thought they just needed a simple majority on this one?

They did, but the D's dragged things out because they were stomping their feet and throwing a tantrum.... as usual.

Democrats who opposed repealing Obamacare staged a protest during the vote, breaking with procedural rules by attempting to orally dedicate their votes to people they say would be harmed by repealing Obamacare.