Reid Leads Democrats In Carving Out Favors for States on Health

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
0
Despite all of the hokum from Candidate Obama and the One Party Congress about transparency in government and the promise to broadcast negotiations and hearings on health legislation on CSPAN (in HD, no less!) the deals are being cut in secret and what is finally coming out is nothing less than some of the worst special interest dealing in recent memory.

What, you expected something different?

The rush to get health care/health insurance/whatever passed (The sky is falling! The sky is falling! Again and again and again!) is political payback at its worst. The aim is simple - cut massive breaks for favored voting blocks and the massive bill will be paid by everyone else.

While Harry Reid is using his leadership position to garner the best breaks for his supporters (he is 5-10% behind likely Republican opponents in the polling for the 2010 election and desperately NEEDS to bring the pork home!) he is not alone in playing this game.

While we await more detailed analyses from the Congressional Budget Office on the proposed legislation, the independent analyses that are being made show some might fancy dancing on the numbers -

Budget tricks rife in health reform effort - Health care overhaul bill has been front-loaded with revenue and backloaded with spending to make it look $250 billion less expensive that it actually is

Courting doctors in health care battle - $247 billion measure making its way to the Senate floor, aims to wipe out a scheduled 21 percent rate cut for doctors treating Medicare patients

If you are a voter and a taxpayer, Democrat or Republican or independent, isn't it about time that you contacted your elected representative and let them know that they need to cut out the special dealing?

Reid Leads Democrats In Carving Out Favors for States on Health

Reid Leads Democrats In Carving Out Favors for States on Health

By Brian Faler

Oct. 20 (Bloomberg) -- Nevada would get help with its Medicaid bills. The elderly in Florida and New York would receive additional Medicare benefits. And workers in so-called high-risk professions such as firefighting and construction would get a break on a new insurance tax.

Those are provisions that Senate Democrats, including Majority Leader Harry Reid, put in an $829 billion health-care bill to shield constituents from measures intended to pay for the biggest overhaul of the medical system in four decades.

The result is the new policies may be unevenly administered, with some U.S. states getting preferential treatment, a possibility that has given Republican lawmakers ammunition to attack the legislation.

?It?s going to hurt the bill and raise the level of cynicism about Washington politics,? said Senator Lamar Alexander, a Tennessee Republican. ?The provisions ought to be applied to all of the states.?

The number of special provisions is likely to grow as the full Senate begins debating the measure in coming weeks. Because Democrats are unlikely to win many Republican votes, individual lawmakers will have leverage to demand changes to satisfy parochial interests.

At the same time, those provisions may make it easier for Congress to approve a sweeping bill by giving lawmakers more of a stake in legislation they may not otherwise fully support.

Doing Their Jobs

?Members being able to convince colleagues of the special circumstances in their states?? said Senator Kent Conrad, a North Dakota Democrat. ?That?s what members are here to do -- represent their state.?

Senate Democratic leaders are meeting behind closed doors with Obama administration officials to combine measures approved by the finance and health committees. Debate may begin next week on the legislation, which would expand health coverage to millions of uninsured Americans and place new restrictions on insurance companies.

Health-insurer stocks have lost ground in the last month on concern the overhaul will hurt profits. The Standard & Poor?s index of 13 managed-care companies dropped 13 percent, led by Hartford, Connecticut-based Aetna Inc.

Lawmakers have already made exceptions to some of the biggest policy changes under consideration.

$100 Billion Cut

Democrats such as Senators Bill Nelson of Florida and Ron Wyden of Oregon secured provisions setting aside $5 billion to shore up benefits for constituents who participate in Medicare Advantage. That program allows private insurers to contract with the government to provide Medicare benefits.

The bill that came out of Senator Max Baucus?s finance committee cuts more than $100 billion from Medicare Advantage to help fund the overhaul. Some lawmakers say they are concerned the elderly will see a reduction in benefits.

The measure doesn?t identify which states could get the $5 billion. The language is so confusing -- those eligible include retirees in ?counties where the MA benchmark amount in 2011 is equal to the legacy urban floor amount? -- that even congressional aides said they aren?t sure.

Nelson said the aid isn?t directed solely at Florida. ?It affects several states, including New York,? he said. ?We?re trying to grandfather in seniors so that they don?t lose the benefits they have.?

Wyden said it would go to states like Oregon that ?would face hardships? under Medicare Advantage cuts.

Help for Unions

Lawmakers such as Senator Robert Menendez of New Jersey pushed for exceptions to a tax on expensive insurance plans. The tax would be phased in more slowly in states the government determines have the highest costs.

Democrat John Kerry, whose state of Massachusetts is likely to end up on the list, said the tax may disrupt his state?s own efforts to expand health coverage.

?If you change the way it?s working, you automatically upset people?s expectations,? Kerry said.

Those in professions deemed high risk like mining would also get a break. For them, the tax would kick in for family insurance plans worth $26,000 not $21,000.

Menendez said that was designed to protect those ?who gave up money at the table in order to get better health-care packages,? referring to Democratic-supporting unions. Senator Dick Durbin of Illinois last week said lawmakers are considering additional changes to reduce the tax hit on union members.

Full Funding

Reid secured provisions to ensure his state of Nevada won?t face higher Medicaid costs.

Democrats want to expand coverage by loosening eligibility rules for the joint federal-state health-care program for the poor. Some governors say that could saddle them with higher bills. State spending would increase by $33 billon under Baucus?s plan, the Congressional Budget Office says.

The plan calls for ?full federal funding? of Medicaid for new beneficiaries in only those states that had unemployment rates of at least 12 percent in August and whose Medicaid enrollment is below the national average.

Only Nevada, Rhode Island, Michigan and Oregon meet that criteria. That prompted complaints from other lawmakers that their states would have to pay more.

?We cut special favors for special states, not based on need or requirements but on the influence of the individual senator,? said Arizona Republican John McCain.

Reid responded: ?I make absolutely no apologies -- none - - for helping people in my state.?
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
0
While the back room deal making is going on, don't expect to have the Democrats deliver on their campaign promises to open up the legislative process to public scrutiny -

House leaders urged to post legislation well before votes

By David Lightman | McClatchy Newspapers

WASHINGTON - As Congress prepares to consider historic changes to the nation's health care system, Democratic leaders are balking at supporting a change in the rules that would let the public see the bills' texts 72 hours before a vote.

An unusual coalition of conservatives, watchdog groups and a handful of Democrats has joined the push by Rep. Brian Baird, D-Wash., to put the 72-hour measure into a binding rule for the House of Representatives. Similar efforts in the Senate haven't gained much momentum.

House Democratic leaders have pledged transparency before. In their 2006 campaign book, in the "integrity" section, they vowed that legislation would be available to the public 24 hours before "consideration" of final versions.

On some recent big bills, that hasn't happened, however. On Feb. 12, the 1,100-page, $787 billion economic-stimulus plan was made public at 10:45 p.m. EST and brought up in the House 13 hours later.

Nadeam Elshami, a spokesman for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said that since Democrats took control of the House in 2007, several measures had been adopted to make the legislative process more transparent, such as posting amendments' texts online before consideration.

Pelosi also said last month that she was "absolutely" willing to put the health care bill online 72 hours in advance but that she wouldn't back legislation forcing her to do so.

"The vast majority of bills that have been considered by the House have been online for weeks and will continue to follow this process," Elshami said. Elshami didn't respond, however, when asked why Pelosi won't back Baird's bill.

Baird vowed to keep pushing.

"It's great what she said about health care, but it hasn't happened yet," he said. "The problem is that over the last decade or so, the more important the legislation, the less time we've had to read it."

Republicans and independent watchdog groups also have pounced.

"We think the public has a right and an obligation to look at these bills, and perhaps say to their congressman or senator, 'Fix this,' '' said Lisa Rosenberg, the government affairs consultant at the Sunlight Foundation, an independent group that works for openness in government.

Republicans were hardly champions of such transparency when they controlled Congress most of the time from 1995 to 2007. The 2,065-page 2003 Medicare prescription-drug benefit bill was made available to the public 22 hours before House debate began.

According to a study by Rafael DeGennaro, the president of Citizen Century Institute, an independent research group based in Branford, Conn., Republican House leaders acted on eight major budget bills from 1996 to 2004 without giving 72 hours' notice.

Two developments have spurred the movement to change the system: the House Democrats' 2006 platform, and the rise of the Internet, which gives the public unprecedented access to Congress' inner workings.

Seventy-two hours is considered adequate time for review because "a handful of hours is really too short, but we don't want a rule that forces one more slowdown," said Bartlett Cleland, the director of the Institute for Policy Innovation's Center for Technology Freedom, an advocacy group based in Dallas.

The House and Senate are expected to finish writing health care legislation shortly, perhaps by the end of this week, with floor debate to follow as soon as next week.

Baird and Rep. Greg Walden, R-Ore., are trying to force their 72-hour resolution to change House rules to the floor with a "discharge petition," an unusual procedure that leaders dislike because it challenges their control of the process.

Currently, the petition has 182 signatures, almost all Republicans; 218 are needed to force a House vote.

In the Senate, where the issue rarely has come up, Republicans tried to get the Finance Committee to adopt the 72-hour rule as it deliberated over health care measures last month. Part of the problem: The committee technically wasn't writing a bill, but drafting "conceptual language."

Chairman Max Baucus, D-Mont., urged everyone not to worry. "It's all good faith," he said. "It's based on comity. We work together. We trust each other. And that's worked very, very well." The 72-hour effort failed by one vote in the Finance Committee.

**************

Urge your elected representative to READ THE BILL -

READ THE BILL!!!
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
There is a reason that Reid is in for a tough re-election campaign next year.

My guess is that he is trying to get everything he can for his state so that he can use it to try and save his job.
 

Zstream

Diamond Member
Oct 24, 2005
3,395
277
136
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
There is a reason that Reid is in for a tough re-election campaign next year.

My guess is that he is trying to get everything he can for his state so that he can use it to try and save his job.

Phis, Sarah Palin made him do it!
 

extra

Golden Member
Dec 18, 1999
1,947
7
81
So PJ how can you have a right wing fear troll thread if no one bites? Doesn't seem to be working lol.
 

shadow9d9

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2004
8,132
2
0
Hahaha. Yeah, "rushing" healthcare after skyrocketing costs that republicans have done nothing about in the last 30 years... You are such a joke. 30 years fighting uphill against morons like you and your fearmongering.

Could be worse. We could have a braindead president that spends $1 trillion getting us involved in 2 endless occupations of foreign countries while giving military contracts to friends... while killing 100k people including our own....

But hey.. spending money on our own people for once. FEAR!!! BOOGA BOOGA!

WAR GOOD! HEALTH INSURANCE FOR OUR OWN PEOPLE BAD!
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
0
Originally posted by: extra
So PJ how can you have a right wing fear troll thread if no one bites? Doesn't seem to be working lol.

What is so trollin' about this thread? The second posted article covers the Republican lack of transparency when they were in power.

If you were not a partisan hack you would also be concerned by the bs going on in DC, especially as it is being done by members of both parties. Now that the Democrats are in charge, I guess you just roll over and accept the pats on your head like a spoiled little lap dog with a pink bow tied into your hair.

 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
0
Funny isn't it. I still can't find these open meetings on CSPAN in my TiVos channel guide.

This is the exact reason there is a 10th amendment. If your state wants government health care than it can have it. If your state doesn't want government health care it doesn't have to have it.
There is no reason that any state should be treated differently in legislation. Shit like this is the everything wrong with Washington.


In actuality, where exactly does the constitution authorize the federal government authority over health care....but I guess that is another thread.

 

PingSpike

Lifer
Feb 25, 2004
21,758
602
126
Meet the new boss.

Whether you support the health care inititive or not, any reasonable person would have to admit this is horseshit. But its the same old horseshit.
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
0
Originally posted by: Patranus
Funny isn't it. I still can't find these open meetings on CSPAN in my TiVos channel guide.

This is the exact reason there is a 10th amendment. If your state wants government health care than it can have it. If your state doesn't want government health care it doesn't have to have it.
There is no reason that any state should be treated differently in legislation. Shit like this is the everything wrong with Washington.


In actuality, where exactly does the constitution authorize the federal government authority over health care....but I guess that is another thread.

As the government takeover of more and more parts of our economy takes place, I, too, wonder where these powers are coming from. Certainly the Constitution is meant to limit the Federal government's power, reserving most to the States. It will eventually be up to the Supreme Court to decide. Too bad they won't get involved until these nationalization actions are already on the books.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,268
126
I'm on break at a day long seminar and it is painfully obvious that there will be no significant savings in healthcare. Any projections are specious because Congress has no understanding of the current and future needs of health care in America. Politicians don't want to know.
 

MotF Bane

No Lifer
Dec 22, 2006
60,801
10
0
Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
I'm on break at a day long seminar and it is painfully obvious that there will be no significant savings in healthcare. Any projections are specious because Congress has no understanding of the current and future needs of health care in America. Politicians don't want to know.

Don't confuse them with the facts.
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
4,822
0
0
Does the Federal Government have any right to order me to buy, and eat, broccoli????

Can Obama and Congress Order You to Buy Broccoli?

Can Obama and Congress Order You to Buy Broccoli?

Wednesday, October 21, 2009
By Terence P. Jeffrey

Can President Barack Obama and Congress enact legislation that orders Americans to buy broccoli? If so, where did they get that authority? What provision in the Constitution empowers the federal government to order an individual to buy a product he does not want?

This is not a question about nutrition. It is not a question about whether broccoli is good for you or about the relative merits of broccoli versus other foods. It is a question about the constitutional limits on the power of the federal government. It is a question about freedom.

Can President Obama and Congress enact legislation that orders Americans to buy health insurance? They might as well order Americans to buy broccoli. They have no legitimate authority to do either. Yet neither Obama nor the current leadership in Congress seems to care about the constitutional limits on their power.

They are now attempting to exert authority over the lives of Americans in a way no president and Congress has done before.

In 1994, when Congress last pondered a national health care plan that would require all Americans to purchase health insurance, the Congressional Budget Office studied the issue.

?A mandate requiring all individuals to purchase health insurance would be an unprecedented form of federal action,? the CBO concluded. ?The government has never required people to buy any good or service as a condition of lawful residence in the United States.?

When the Senate Finance Committee was debating its version of health care reform legislation this month, Republican Sen. Orrin Hatch of Utah tried to offer an amendment that would have expedited judicial review were the bill enacted because Hatch saw multiple constitutional problems with the proposal. Ordering individuals to buy health insurance was one of them.

?The only conceivable constitutional basis for Congress requiring that Americans purchase a particular good or service is the power to regulate interstate commerce,? said Hatch.

?Even if the Supreme Court has expanded the commerce power, there has been one constant,? Hatch continued. ?Congress was always regulating activities in which people chose to engage. They might be non-commercial activities or intra-state activities, but they were activities.?

Yet the committee?s health care proposal, Hatch said, did something entirely different.

?Rather than regulate what people have chosen to do, it would require them to do something they have not chosen to do at all,? he said. ?If we have the power simply to order Americans to buy certain products, why did we need a Cash-for-Clunkers program or the upcoming program providing rebates for purchasing energy appliances? We could simply require Americans to buy certain cars, dishwashers or refrigerators.?

Or broccoli, or carrots, or ?medical marijuana? for that matter.

The Constitution?s commerce clause is short and simple. It says: ?The Congress shall have Power ... To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes.?

Now, imagine an American sitting on his back porch casually enjoying the would-be anathematized state of not owning health insurance. When it comes to health insurance, this American has not been, is not and never intends to be engaged in any form of commerce with any entity in any foreign nation, distant state or Indian tribe.

If he did decide to engage in health-insurance related commerce with any entity in a foreign nation, distant state or Indian tribe, Congress could constitutionally regulate that action. But this American simply won?t oblige. As a free person?like generations of Americans before him?he has weighed the risks and benefits of buying health insurance, and he has decided not to buy it. He is fully ready to accept the good and bad consequences of this decision.

All he wants from the government is to be left alone.

For President Obama and Congress to reach into this American?s backyard and force him to buy health insurance would be a blatantly unconstitutional act.

But in the Finance Committee, Chairman Max Baucus, a Democrat from Montana, refused to allow a vote on Sen. Hatch?s amendment to expedite judicial review of provisions in the health care bill. In this case, Baucus was punctilious about Senate rules on limits of his committee?s authority. Hatch?s amendment, he ruled, involved an issue under the jurisdiction of the Judiciary Committee. The Finance Committee must not touch it.

All versions of the health care bill under consideration in Congress would order Americans to buy health insurance. If any of these bills is enacted, the first thing it would accomplish is the amputation of a vital part of our Constitution, and the death of another measure of our liberty.
 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
9,280
0
0
It sickens me as to what the commerce clause has turned into. Anyone who had read up on the history of the constitution knows the intent (and actual wording) was to stop certain states from taxing goods from other states.

Now the commerce clause is being used to justify the government regulating things that has nothing to do with commerce like truck drivers talking on their cell phone while driving.
 

0marTheZealot

Golden Member
Apr 5, 2004
1,692
0
0
Originally posted by: Patranus
Funny isn't it. I still can't find these open meetings on CSPAN in my TiVos channel guide.

This is the exact reason there is a 10th amendment. If your state wants government health care than it can have it. If your state doesn't want government health care it doesn't have to have it.
There is no reason that any state should be treated differently in legislation. Shit like this is the everything wrong with Washington.


In actuality, where exactly does the constitution authorize the federal government authority over health care....but I guess that is another thread.

The 10th amendment has been dead ever since the Civil War. Just about every major initiative in the US is against the 10th with that line of reasoning.
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: shadow9d9
Hahaha. Yeah, "rushing" healthcare after skyrocketing costs that republicans have done nothing about in the last 30 years... You are such a joke. 30 years fighting uphill against morons like you and your fearmongering.

Could be worse. We could have a braindead president that spends $1 trillion getting us involved in 2 endless occupations of foreign countries while giving military contracts to friends... while killing 100k people including our own....

But hey.. spending money on our own people for once. FEAR!!! BOOGA BOOGA!

WAR GOOD! HEALTH INSURANCE FOR OUR OWN PEOPLE BAD!

30 Years? Were Democrats completely out of govt over the past 30 years?

And where have you been? Are we out of Iraq? Are we not increasing our presence in Afghanistan?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Are troops and equipment working for free now or something?!?!?!?!?!?