Ready For the Real Obamacare to be Implemented?

[Jhhnn]

In every state I've lived the top marginal rate kicks in at a very low income. So lets look at someone making 30K a year. Lets just assume they pay no federal income tax, they will still save the 6% on state and 7.65% on FICA. So that would still be $369/yr, which is a big deal to someone making 30K a year. But yeah, fuck those rich people who use their FSAs.

BTW: I support ACA and think it has been a big success, and for the most part I am fine with the FSA changes. But it is completely disingenuous to claim it doesn't impact middle class people in a noticeable way.

It affects very few people in the first place because most people can't avail themselves of FSA's & very few of those folks earn $30K.

I'll concede that I've underestimated some of the potential tax burdens but not the ridiculous whining that comes with it.

I'm also entirely amenable to changes in the tax code or the ACA that would better serve special needs people & families. And, let's face it, subsidies for low income families & the Medicaid extension are designed to offset any lost tax advantage for such folks.

OTOH, I'm dead certain that Repubs simply will not allow the ACA to be amended in any positive way. They're using the minority of people negatively affected as a way to paint the ACA as a monster to justify killing it.

They'll do their damndest to to accomplish that regardless of the facts.

 

[Zorba]

It affects very few people in the first place because most people can't avail themselves of FSA's & very few of those folks earn $30K.

I'll concede that I've underestimated some of the potential tax burdens by not the ridiculous whining that comes with it.

I'm also entirely amenable to changes in the tax code or the ACA that would better serve special needs people & families. And, let's face it, subsidies for low income families & the Medicaid extension are designed to offset any lost tax advantage for such folks.

OTOH, I'm dead certain that Repubs simply will not allow the ACA to be amended in any positive way. They're using the minority of people negatively affected as a way to paint the ACA as a monster to justify killing it.

They'll do their damndest to to accomplish that regardless of the facts.

I agree that it is likely to not affect hardly anyone only making 30K, I was just trying to illustrate that even with 0% federal tax. I also agree the expansion of medicad would help this situation out a lot.

I also completely agree that republicans in general go out of their way make sure the government/programs don't work as effectively as they should just so they can then claim "See that program sucks, vote for us!"

 

[JSt0rm]

fuck the poor. kill all radicals.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

They die for us. Seems fair.

What do inner city thugs do for us, other than give democrats votes?

Inner city thugs haha! You want to say black guys but you're afraid but you'll do the wink, wink words.

 

[nickqt]

Inner city thugs haha! You want to say black guys but you're afraid too but you'll do the wink, wink words.

All of the bigots are currently congregating in this thread.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2446552

 

[Zorba]

They die for us. Seems fair.

What do inner city thugs do for us, other than give democrats votes?

What is really sad is the military, well at least the Air Force, doesn't provide their people with basic safety equipment or procedures. So kids are getting their bodies messed up for life, for no good reason 10,000 miles from a war zone.

BTW: A large chunk of your military heroes were "inner city thugs" before they joined.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

All of the bigots are currently congregating in this thread.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2446552

I wonder which one is Spidey's alt account?

 

[werepossum]

Inner city thugs haha! You want to say black guys but you're afraid too but you'll do the wink, wink words.

Sad to think you might actually believe that "inner city thugs" and "black guys" are interchangeable.

In any case I do not believe the mods are copacetic with the term "inner city thugs" and thus it should be avoided. It also bears repeating that meth heads shooting each other in rural paradise are not any better than crack heads shooting each other downtown.

 

[Fanatical Meat]

Sad to think you might actually believe that "inner city thugs" and "black guys" are interchangeable.

In any case I do not believe the mods are copacetic with the term "inner city thugs" and thus it should be avoided. It also bears repeating that meth heads shooting each other in rural paradise are not any better than crack heads shooting each other downtown.

My point was how he managed to shoehorn "inner city thugs to vote Democrat" into an ACA discussion.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Good, I don't give a damn about the middle class as if they voted for this they deserve to get it good and hard. And better yet, no more progressive refusing to put their money where their mouth is always saying it's a "collective action problem." I'm especially gratified their own law ensures they're picking up an outsized amount of the costs:

You have a point. Working examples of better health care systems implemented in other nations abound and Americans could have rallied for real socialized medicine with its cost savings and efficiency. However, many Americans wanted Republicare ("don't get sick, and if you get sick, die quickly and quietly) and the end result of health care reform ended up being the Republicans' individual mandate idea from the 1990's.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Because preferring that government pay for everything isn't rational. People need to pull their own weight, with government only stepping in where that isn't possible or practical.

The government pays for the military, is that rational? What about the police? The fire department?

Under real socialized medicine, the government would not magically fund the health care system. Instead it would tax the populace and then use those proceeds to pay for it. People are already paying gobs of money for private health insurance. Instead of giving it to insurance companies, the money would go to the government instead.

That same money (probably less of it) would then used to fund the healthcare system, eliminating the expensive insurance middle man paper pushers and their wealthy executives. Other nations that have done this have 100% coverage, zero medical bankruptcies, a more relaxed and contented populace, a business climate free from insurance cost concerns, and they are spending a smaller percentage of GDP (and also in terms of dollars per capita) on healthcare.

The free market dogmatists read about those systems that have been replicated in countless nations and their reaction is like that of the caricatured socialists in Atlas Shrugged when upon hearing John Galt's speech they exclaim: "We couldn't have heard it." We don't have to believe it!" "It couldn't have been real!"

 

[WhipperSnapper]

It was a "train wreck." It was a "disaster." Remember? Funny thing is, though, righties never told us when the train wreck/disaster was going to happen. They never OWNED their reckless statements.

It's like the Second Coming all over again. Like a true believer on a street corner, just keep saying "The train wreck is coming," and those grass-roots know-nothings will follow you anywhere, including to their self-destructon.

The Republicans are, however, correct. It is an impending trainwreck. Obamacare is not a fundamental change to how the American healthcare system works. The Republicans, "rocket scientists" that they are, fail to realize that Obamacare utilizes the basic medical system that they themselves support and advocate for -- private hospitals, private insurance companies, unregulated pharmaceutical prices. A mandate requiring people to buy insurance isn't a substantive chance to the prior healthcare system.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

I've been on Tricare for a while, and know plenty of people who go to the VA as well, and let me tell you, those of you rooting for government health care (single payer) are in for a real treat when it actually comes to pass.

Why aren't the people in the UK, Japan, South Korea, France, Germany, Switzerland, etc., up in arms over their nation's socialized or heavily government-regulated healthcare programs? Shouldn't those people already be experiencing the "real treat"?

(Hint...they think the American pseudo-free market system is nightmarish and would much prefer the systems their nation's already have in place. What does that tell you about the efficacy of socialized medicine?)

 

[WhipperSnapper]

And the really irritating part is that most of what would pass for the "health-care apocalypse" was proceeding quite nicely long before the ACA took effect. But with the ACA now the law of the land, ANY negative health care statistics are going to be blamed on the ACA by righties.

Obamacare/ACA is the best thing to happen for the Republicans. The sheeple will believe that Obamacare is a new program, completely different from the system that we had before, and now it has Obama's name for it, when in reality it's 99.9% the same as the system we had before. However, when the system eventually collapses, the sheeple will blame Obama and the Democrats for what amounts to the Republican's health care system.

 

[werepossum]

My point was how he managed to shoehorn "inner city thugs to vote Democrat" into an ACA discussion.

Duly noted.

Obamacare/ACA is the best thing to happen for the Republicans. The sheeple will believe that Obamacare is a new program, completely different from the system that we had before, and now it has Obama's name for it, when in reality it's 99.9% the same as the system we had before. However, when the system eventually collapses, the sheeple will blame Obama and the Democrats for what amounts to the Republican's health care system.

I would agree except for one thing: The Democrats own the media. When it does collapse, it will be blamed squarely on the Republicans.

 

[nickqt]

Duly noted.


I would agree except for one thing: The Democrats own the media. When it does collapse, it will be blamed squarely on the Republicans.

Of course, some of the largest corporations are controlled by Democrats!

GE, News Corp, and Clear Channel are all notoriously known for their libruul bias!

Y'all are hilarious. Keep it up.