Rancher Ordered To Pay Illegal Aliens Because He Assaulted Them On His Property

[chucky2]

Mass illegal invasion has made that task very difficult on the legalized or natural born US Latino. They have their illegal alien friends to thank for that.

The only true way will be to effectively partrol the border, and use deadly force. Sucks for people living close the border.

For internal cases, it's going to mean legal and US citizen Latino's get stopped a lot. Again, they can thank their illegal alien friends for that.

Chuck

 

[xj0hnx]

I'm not sure what you aren't understanding. The castle doctrine is a set of conditions dealing with the defense of the home, sometimes this involves the right not to have to retreat. Just because another part of the self defense code ALSO includes a right not to retreat does not mean that the castle doctrine applies outside of the home.

This is not difficult. This is also why everyone else here is telling you that you're wrong.

I'm not sure what you aren't understanding. The Castle Doctrine doesn't just set conditions for defense of a home it extends to pretty much anywhere you are, you can defend yourself with deadly force if you are at the store, at a friends house, at a stop light, etc ...

This is not difficult, This is also why everyone saying different is wrong.

 

[her209]

In Texas you can if they have reasonable knowledge they are not suppose to be on your land. Which means that they have been issued a verbal warning, or they are going through a fence, or you have signs posted where they could see them. But there are a few exceptions in the case of law enforcement and others of official capacity officials such as medical professionals. In the case of the cop, shooting him while he's performing his official duty would not be the brightest idea to do even in Texas. You might get away with it, but I would highly recommend not doing it. But feel free to take pop shots at the guy he's chasing if he's in your yard.

Its my understanding that shooting someone who is retreating, i.e., shooting them in the back, is not considered self-defense also.

:\

 

[PieIsAwesome]

A quick Google search turns up that citizen's arrests are accepted in all states but North Carolina for felonies. Pretty sure that being an illegal alien is a felony or greater charge.

Jay walking isn't really a valid comparison because it's typically an infraction (fine) rather than an offense punishable by jail time. I would hope that being a border-jumper is an offense that would lead to jail time and ultimately deportation (although we all know that it isn't).

Its not. Entering illegally seems to be a misdemeanor, and if repeated it can become a felony. As for being in the country illegally (which is different from entering illegally, think visa overstayers), dunno.

EDIT: It seems that illegal presence is NOT a crime. Its a civil infraction.

 

[spidey07]

Its my understanding that shooting someone who is retreating, i.e., shooting them in the back, is not considered self-defense also.

:\

Not so if they are in your house, if so they're fair game no matter what. On property it would vary based on state because then you're defending property and not your life so shooting in the back can be OK.

 

[her209]

As for being in the country illegally (which is different from entering illegally, think visa overstayers), dunno.

Its a civil, i.e., not criminal, offense. That's my understanding anyways.

 

[werepossum]

I am curious as to what the more liberal posters would do in a similar situation. Let's say people come onto your property (home and business alike) on a weekly basis, steal everything that isn't nailed down and generally trash the place so that you're afraid to let your children play outside, let your wife go out alone, or even go about unarmed yourself. Let's say anything not strongly secured is just stolen, that things you buy or make to put food on your family's table are stolen or just broken on a weekly basis. Let's say some of your neighbors have in fact been murdered by some of these people. Let's say the police not only haven't caught the murderers, but say it isn't their problem. Let's say in fact that virtually everyone whose taxes you pay is either totally indifferent or actively against you.

This guy sounds like a real son of a bitch, but I feel for him. When it's your fences being broken down, your livestock being stolen, your tools being stolen, your house being burglarized, your neighbors being murdered or raped, your hard work being trampled into the mud, week after week after week - how long would your liberal tendencies hold up? When the government you want to subsidize your life instead takes the side of the hordes that are destroying what your hard work has built?

 

[Amused]

Well, that's supposedly what happened to him.. not what he did himself.

What ever Jesus did, the end result was him getting tortured and nailed to a stick by an angry mob.

Now explain again just why in the fuck I wanna do what he did???

 

[umbrella39]

Thread title is fraudently misleading.

Should this come as a surprise to anyone who has had to endure reading his lies for years under several different alts...

Simple math, don't play cop if you aren't one. When you do, you get in trouble no matter how noble your intentions.

 

[chucky2]

snip

Well, an unlimited amount of course!

That's why I think all these Lib posters need to post their real names and addresses. We can spread these throughout the Latino message boards that there's a free siesta given by these posters at their address every Fri and Sat night for the next year.

They should be just fine with that I believe, since they fully expect all these people affected by mass invasion to just deal with it. Call the police? Why, come on in senor should be their answer, afterall, what's a few people inside your house? In your yard? Seems like it's a perpetual positive.

Oh the squealing that would be heard if that happened.....

Chuck

 

[fskimospy]

watching the nativist meltdown by chucky here has been pretty amazing I have to say.

 

[chucky2]

What's amazing is you expect US citizens to just take it for years and years, and calmly just do nothing about it. That you think my attitude is amazing, is amazing in itself.

 

[umbrella39]

watching the nativist meltdown by chucky here has been pretty amazing I have to say.

After reading some of the tripe people have quoted him typing here it is clear he really needs to calm down and grow the fuck up and/or move into the woods. He is well past becoming what he hates already.

 

[chucky2]

Awww...poor liberals who want the invasion to continue don't like being called out, man, I'm so hurt!

 

[werepossum]

watching the nativist meltdown by chucky here has been pretty amazing I have to say.

I notice you didn't address my point. How about it? If memory serves, you're a therapist or councilor, right? You probably work in an office, probably have some books you reference, a computer you use to make appointments, pay taxes, do accounts. Suppose every week or so someone breaks into your office. Your computer is stolen, your furniture is busted up for firewood, your books torn up for toilet paper. Your home too is not safe; groups of men cross through your children's playground, break in and steal everything if your home is left unattended, vandalize your home and your car so that your wife is afraid to go to the mailbox or answer the door or even stay home alone without a gun. Occasionally one of your fellow councilors or one of your neighbors is murdered. And this goes on for weeks, months, years. And the police say it isn't their problem, it's someone else's problem, and the federal government says if you endanger or threaten these people then it's come down on you, and people in other states tell you that the vast majority of these people are extremely poor, honest, hard working people just trying to make a better life, and if you've got a problem with them then you're a racist or "nativist". (After all, it's not YOUR apartment or YOUR office, it's the world's home and office.)

Can you honestly put yourself in his position?

 

[Bowfinger]

Awww...poor liberals who want the invasion to continue don't like being called out, man, I'm so hurt!

With all due respect, you're really not very bright. You want to know why the government doesn't do more to keep out illegals? Because their (largely-Republican) corporate owners don't want to keep them out. Cheap Mexican labor is great for profits. Not only do they work cheap, but they keep downward pressure on other, American-held jobs. Their first choice is off-shoring, off course, but when they can't move the jobs to a third-world country, they move the third-world workers to the job. (See also H1B for a more professional version of the same scam.)

Don't believe it? Then explain why eight years of Republican leadership -- including several years of control of both POTUS and Congress -- got absolutely squat done to fix this. The fact is that you and the rest of the middle-class GOP fan-boys are rubes. The party doesn't really care about you. You're just the marks they pander to so they can keep transferring wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite. You're a useful tool, nothing more.

 

[umbrella39]

The whole useful part it up for debate. Leave that word out and I think you have something.

 

[chucky2]

With all due respect, you're really not very bright. You want to know why the government doesn't do more to keep out illegals? Because their (largely-Republican) corporate owners don't want to keep them out. Cheap Mexican labor is great for profits. Not only do they work cheap, but they keep downward pressure on other, American-held jobs. Their first choice is off-shoring, off course, but when they can't move the jobs to a third-world country, they move the third-world workers to the job. (See also H1B for a more professional version of the same scam.)

Don't believe it? Then explain why eight years of Republican leadership -- including several years of control of both POTUS and Congress -- got absolutely squat done to fix this. The fact is that you and the rest of the middle-class GOP fan-boys are rubes. The party doesn't really care about you. You're just the marks they pander to so they can keep transferring wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite. You're a useful tool, nothing more.

With all due respect, you're not very bright either. Not once did I say I loved the way the illegal invasion issue was handled - or rather, not handled at all - when the Rep's had control. Perhaps you've somehow decided I'm a Republican because I rail on looney libs who love illegal invasions because they have a White/National Guilt trip going on: I'm not.

I cannot imagine why you'd ever think I'm a Republican. Next you'll call me a NeoCon like what's his name did earlier in the thread and I had to disprove that as well. Here, it's really simple:

These people are not our citizens. They are not coming over a thousand a year, 10 thousand a year: They're coming over in invasion numbers. No one can dispute that. The primary job of the Federal government is to secure the country from threats: I would argue that of all the other things it should be doing, everything else is secondary. I know this will sound crazy, but, invasion by members of another country sounds like something the Federal government ought to be preventing.

They're not. Rep's aren't. Dem's aren't.

That doesn't change Reality for the US citizens who are living where the invasion is happening. And, this man has been driven by Reality to start taking the actions he's taking - because his Federal government has totally failed him, and everyone else in the country, in this regard.

People taking issue with this guy first need to go take issue with the Federal government, and when the Fed's have finally secured the border and dealt with the illegals in-country, then they can start harping on this guy when he pulls something like this: Because at that point, there will be no more illegal aliens in the US.

Somehow, I'm the crazy one for thinking/expecting that???

Chuck

 

[feralkid]

 

[CycloWizard]

With all due respect, you're really not very bright. You want to know why the government doesn't do more to keep out illegals? Because their (largely-Republican) corporate owners don't want to keep them out. Cheap Mexican labor is great for profits. Not only do they work cheap, but they keep downward pressure on other, American-held jobs. Their first choice is off-shoring, off course, but when they can't move the jobs to a third-world country, they move the third-world workers to the job. (See also H1B for a more professional version of the same scam.)

Don't believe it? Then explain why eight years of Republican leadership -- including several years of control of both POTUS and Congress -- got absolutely squat done to fix this. The fact is that you and the rest of the middle-class GOP fan-boys are rubes. The party doesn't really care about you. You're just the marks they pander to so they can keep transferring wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite. You're a useful tool, nothing more.

Minimum wage increases created a black market for labor. Even with millions of illegals coming in to fill the demand, it wasn't enough, so additional supply was found overseas. The black market labor didn't pay into the system to supply the safety net, so when the economy went south, the safety net collapsed. The government, of course, responded by expanding the safety net, raising minimum wage, and creating an even bigger supply gap which its own citizens were legally forbidden from meeting because the ones making these idiotic rules are the ones primarily benefiting from them.

 

[Bowfinger]

With all due respect, you're not very bright either. Not once did I say I loved the way the illegal invasion issue was handled - or rather, not handled at all - when the Rep's had control. Perhaps you've somehow decided I'm a Republican because I rail on looney libs who love illegal invasions because they have a White/National Guilt trip going on: I'm not.

Yet here are your exact words: "poor liberals who want the invasion to continue ..."

When you single out "liberals" in this -- and pretty much every other -- partisan comment you make, your bias is blatantly obvious. The simple fact is that illegal immigration is supported far more by greedy Republican businessmen than it is by bleeding-heart liberal Democrats.

I cannot imagine why you'd ever think I'm a Republican.

Actions speak louder than words.

Next you'll call me a NeoCon like what's his name did earlier in the thread and I had to disprove that as well.

Rationalizing is not the same as disproving. Given you continue to parrot the typical neo-con justifications for unilaterally invading Iraq, it's not really much of a stretch to suspect you're a neo-con. Maybe a bad assumption, but once again actions speak louder than words.

[ ... ]
Somehow, I'm the crazy one for thinking/expecting that???

Chuck

Umm, I don't think anybody suggested that at all. Looks to me you're being criticized for two things. One, you come across like some shoot from the hip, reckless redneck vigilante who thinks you should be free to take the law into your own hands, or even to ignore the law when you don't agree with it. Two, you seem to blame "liberals" for the illegal immigration problem. Both are wrong.

 

[Zebo]

With all due respect, you're really not very bright. You want to know why the government doesn't do more to keep out illegals? Because their (largely-Republican) corporate owners don't want to keep them out. Cheap Mexican labor is great for profits. Not only do they work cheap, but they keep downward pressure on other, American-held jobs. Their first choice is off-shoring, off course, but when they can't move the jobs to a third-world country, they move the third-world workers to the job. (See also H1B for a more professional version of the same scam.)

Don't believe it? Then explain why eight years of Republican leadership -- including several years of control of both POTUS and Congress -- got absolutely squat done to fix this. The fact is that you and the rest of the middle-class GOP fan-boys are rubes. The party doesn't really care about you. You're just the marks they pander to so they can keep transferring wealth from the working class to the wealthy elite. You're a useful tool, nothing more.

You get it as usual bow. All it takes is a gander at Chamber of Commerce web site to see they have been pimping amnesty and open borders for years. This is the Republicans real constituency.

But dems don't mind either, more votes. Votes for what? I dunno they don't do much once they have them.

Anyway I think it all goes to the larger issue of neither party really works for the average American and you can see this in every bill like the insurance company protection act - those with the gold make the rules. So in effect both parties are tools.

On a related note all my friends are small business owners. I play poker with them, I fish with them. We BBQ together, they are dear friends - 95% Republican and They LOVE illegals. So it's not just tippy top either.

 

[zsdersw]

What ever Jesus did, the end result was him getting tortured and nailed to a stick by an angry mob.

Now explain again just why in the fuck I wanna do what he did???

I don't know.. I was just posing the question "what would Jesus do?"

 

[Zebo]

Minimum wage increases created a black market for labor. Even with millions of illegals coming in to fill the demand, it wasn't enough, so additional supply was found overseas. The black market labor didn't pay into the system to supply the safety net, so when the economy went south, the safety net collapsed. The government, of course, responded by expanding the safety net, raising minimum wage, and creating an even bigger supply gap which its own citizens were legally forbidden from meeting because the ones making these idiotic rules are the ones primarily benefiting from them.

Good way to get carted away in hand cuffs for tax evasion. All it takes is one injury + ambulance chasing lawyer, one employee who knows just a little law, one decent audit to lose everything thus this black market is so small as to be irrelevant. No legit or businessman or with any size employs black market labor.

There are easy ways to employ. In fact they revolve around not knowing they are illegal since they provide adequate documentation for i9 form.

 

[chucky2]

Yet here are your exact words: "poor liberals who want the invasion to continue ..."

When you single out "liberals" in this -- and pretty much every other -- partisan comment you make, your bias is blatantly obvious. The simple fact is that illegal immigration is supported far more by greedy Republican businessmen than it is by bleeding-heart liberal Democrats.

B.S. I said liberals because that's who I was talking to, liberals. Haven't seen a die hard liberal yet on here who is in favor of doing what it will take - whatever that is - to lock down our borders. The Republican constituency, not masters, are much less sympathetic to letting illegals invade. And as far as it being supported, it's supported by all the polar points: Big business Rep's, small business Dem's and Rep's, and whiny liberal Guilters. Everyone else is going WTF why doesn't someone stop this?!!? And those 4 groups are exactly why...

Actions speak louder than words.

I've already said I'm not a NeoCon, not a Rep, certainly I'm not a liberal...I guess I'm fiscally conservative, socially liberal, all Realist. What does that make me on the label scale?

Rationalizing is not the same as disproving. Given you continue to parrot the typical neo-con justifications for unilaterally invading Iraq, it's not really much of a stretch to suspect you're a neo-con. Maybe a bad assumption, but once again actions speak louder than words.

Please read earlier in the thread. I've already debunked that I'm a NeoCon. Keep trying to label me though, it'll be easier to target once you've got a label that'll stick.

Umm, I don't think anybody suggested that at all. Looks to me you're being criticized for two things. One, you come across like some shoot from the hip, reckless redneck vigilante who thinks you should be free to take the law into your own hands, or even to ignore the law when you don't agree with it. Two, you seem to blame "liberals" for the illegal immigration problem. Both are wrong.

I never said, All liberals are the 100% reason why we have illegal invasion...but, we both know I didn't say that, don't we. The illegal invasion has long since passed the point of shoot from the hip. I guaran godd@mn t you, if it was you and your family and property on the border down there, and your neighbor was murdered, your friends and family were endangered, assaulted, vandalized, and your Fed government was basically doing almost everything it could do to not stop the invasion, you'd be right out there with your gun rounding up illegals in your spare time. You'd be a total and complete F'ing idiot not to. The invading illegals have turned it back into the Wild West for the US locals there...hard to keep following laws in that environment, and I'm sure not blaming the guy from 1800 miles away.

Chuck