Radeon/GF4 and nForce 2 compatibility? (EDITED TITLE)

[TrollMan]

I've seen quite alot of comparison on these boards between Ti4200s and Radeon 9500Pros and 9700s, so my interest is now piqued... but am unsure of compatibility and stability!

In the UK I can get a Gainward Golden Sample (overclocking joy ) 8x AGP Ti4200 for about $20 less after VAT than an 8x AGP Sapphire 9500Pro. The cheapest 9700 (Non-Pro) works out about $80 more, for which I could buy another 512MB of RAM - and I don't even know if its 8x AGP!

The motherboard is going to be an nForce 2 with 8x AGP (possibly the MSI K7N2-L) with an Athlon XP 1900+. The slowest link is the current RAM, 512MB of DDR PC2100...

How do the Radeons perform in terms of stability with nForce/2 motherboards? And is the 9500Pro still worth buying over a card I can overclock to Ti4600 speed without even breaking sweat?

EDIT: Seen about 9700s having problems with certain PSUs, mine is a 430W Enermax...

 

[lumen]

I posted about exactly this topic a while back... and the jury is still out on the whole Ti4200 vs. 9500 issue for me personally. I did come to find out you can mod a regular ATI 9500 (non-Pro) to make it perform at 9700 levels... but personally I'm a little hesitant to mess with a video card much.

One thing that caught my eye in your post was when you said you could get 512mb of DDR ram for $80, what on earth are you buying? generic ram? or was that supposed to be $80 euros?

 

[TrollMan]

I forgot to add VAT *ashamed*
PC2100 (to match my existing RAM) - "major brand" - works out at $80 + VAT (17.5%)

Ideally I'd rather not be fiddling with soldering etc, hence why I'm comfortable with the idea of a Golden Sample but said the 9500Pro over the 9500...

Does anyone know anything about any compatibility issues with these graphics cards and motherboards, etc?

 

[jiffylube1024]

Originally posted by: lumen
I posted about exactly this topic a while back... and the jury is still out on the whole Ti4200 vs. 9500 issue for me personally. I did come to find out you can mod a regular ATI 9500 (non-Pro) to make it perform at 9700 levels... but personally I'm a little hesitant to mess with a video card much.

One thing that caught my eye in your post was when you said you could get 512mb of DDR ram for $80, what on earth are you buying? generic ram? or was that supposed to be $80 euros?

-The sucess rate for modding a 9500 to 9700 is low, <50%. If you don't succeed, you still get a good card, but not the killer deal it is otherwise.

-All 9700 cards are AGP 8X. I'm 99% sure all 9500 cards are AGP 8X also.

-I've heard from a couple of people here of compatibility problems with the Radeon 9500/9700 and the NForce 2 motherboard. Now, they didn't seem too reliable, and I've heard of a lot of people running this combo fine, but if you really want to be safe, the Ti4200 on the NForce 2 (nvidia in nvidia) is the safest bet. Also, the performance between the two is pretty close. However, the 9500/Pro gives you DirectX9 compatibility/features, so it's a tough call.

 

[AnAndAustin]

The nForce2's do seem to be causing a little trouble at the mo, but they are very new. A Rad9500PRO should be every bit as stable as a GF4TI and a whole lot faster esp with FULL AA & AF, and that's before it hits 9700 type speeds by o/c'ing. The 9500PRO also has DX9 and significant improvements in image quality, TVout and DVD/MPEG playback. The 9500 modded to 9700 is NOT worth the risk or gamble, it is very unlikely to work! I'd say either get a 4200 for sheer value, a 9100 to tide you over a few months while GF-FX and the even newer Radeons come out or else shoot for a Rad9500PRO or 9700. NOTE; ALL 4800SE are essentially a GF4TI4400 using AGP8x, 4800 are 4600 using AGP8x. I'm a UK'er too so check these out...

www.dabs.com :
Dabs Rad9100 64MB TVout £56
Dabs GF4TI4200-8X 128MB TVout £122
Rad9500PRO 128MB £144
Leadtek GF4TI4800SE 128MB VIVO £154
PNY GF4TI4800 128MB TVout £179 (probably still weeks away from arrival)

www.komplett.co.uk :
Gainward Golden Sample GF3TI200 128MB 4.0ns £74
Gainward GF4TI4800SE 64MB DDR £119
Gainward GF4TI4200-8X 128MB 3.5ns £130 (may use the old 250/444 clocks instead of 250/500)
MSI AGP GF4TI4800SE 128MB DDR £157
Creative 3DBlaster GF4TI4800SE 128MB 2.8ns (not in yet but est 7/2/03) £157
Sapphire Radeon 9500 Atlantis PRO 128MB (not in yet but est 14/2/03) £147

Watford (www.savastore.com) :
8500LE 64MB £72
8500LE 128MB £81
4200-8X 128MB £135
4800SE 64MB £140
4800SE 128MB £152
9500PRO 128MB £159 (not in yet & unk manu)

All 3 of these are VERY good and dependable retailers, not like Ebuyer who are disgustingly BAD. I've highlighted what seem like the best deals to me, of course the std 4200 cards are still very fine and should be £100-120, I didn't include them because that's what I've already got when I was looking around!

 

[TrollMan]

Thanks!

Are those prices including VAT? The price I was basing the 9700 on was the Dabsvalue one. The Ti4200 is currently £128 inc VAT (from Scan) and MicroDirect do the Sapphire 9500 Pro for £142 inc VAT...

I'm keen on the nForce 2 as I found the Asus A7N266-E one of the most stable boards I have used - and the onboard sound chip better than most sound cards! I have seen some posts saying they have 9700s running without problems on the Epox 8RDA but am unsure if this has the on-board 5.1 decoding etc, the MSI K7N2-L has a very appealing price/features combo but I don't know if anyone has tried this with a 9500 or 9700? Also, do the new nForce drivers released at the end of last week help sort the current issues?

I think I may be a bit too full of questions

 

[AnAndAustin]

All those prices inc VAT and I have shopped with all 3 suppliers on numerous occasions. IIRC you can get a Rad9700 for around £180 which is cheaper than many GF4TI4600 cards! Delivery from all 3 will be between £4.50 and £7.50 so you'll probably want to buy all your new kit from the same supplier.

nForce2 shows a lot of promise and if you want the slight speed boost and great onboard goodies thenForce2 rocks. Only reason I got my KT400 over an nForce2 was because I didn't think they were 'twice the price' good (still don't), although they had only just hit the stores. nForce o/b sound and LAN are easily as good as any consumer add in card too. For nFOrce2's perf to really shine you need to enable Dual Channel DDR and run it at a 333FSB+ with a CPU at XP2400+ type speeds. nForce1 had a lot of issues (inc price) which were resolved relatively quickly, I'd expect the same this time round BUT I'll bet nVidia are focusing most of their efforts on the gfx market at the mo. Other than that I can't tell you which brand nForce2 mobo to go for, they should all be good, if sound is important to you be sure it has the 'SoundStorm' tag.

So for £56 that Rad9100 should pack a very good punch, not a whole lot slower than a GF4TI4200 and you'll probably be able to sell it on for about the same money when the Rad9700 and GF-FX cards come down in price. If you want something more now a GF4TI4200 should come in between £100 and £120 and they tend to hit at least TI4400 speeds once o/c'ed. The GF4TI4800SE for £119 is VERY tempting as you're assured of TI4400 speeds and should hit TI4600 speeds albeit with 'only' 64MB RAM ... the card should again sell on well thanks to that high sounding name (TI4600 owners must be unhappy). The sweetest things at themo have got to be the Rad9500PRO and 9700 ... sweet!

 

[Killrose]

My Epox 8RDA and my hacked 9500-9700+ is a perfect match. NO issues of anykind. Running @185MHz bus and AGP set @75MHz.

 

[Mem]

Another very good UK online shop is The Overclocking Store ,they have free delivery as well.btw the Connect3D 9500 Pro is only £146.86 inc vat,also do full range of other cards like GF4s etc.

 

[TrollMan]

Killrose - does your 8RDA have the NVidia APU with 5.1 (thru MCP2-T?) or is it generic-type AC97 six channel sound?