Racism outside of the US ?

venk

Banned
Dec 10, 2000
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On this issue, I have to admit to being an ignorant American. How racists are the people in Europe and Asia? How are blacks/asians/whites/etc sterotyped there? Are they at all? What about goverenment policies? Also what about religious conflicts (ie Ireland)


PS. I don't care about the middle east, that could take years to sort out who exactly hates who.
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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I think its pretty much alike in most places, people are just looking for an excuse for their own problems so its easiest to blame the outsider. That is what I'm seeing here in Iceland at least.
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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<< I think its pretty much alike in most places, people are just looking for an excuse for their own problems so its easiest to blame the outsider. That is what I'm seeing here in Iceland at least. >>



The funny thing is, lots of extreme racist whites like to tell blacks to "Go back to Africa." I find that funny considering that whites came from Europe over to America (so they should easily "Go back to Europe") and that they shipped the native americans out west like cattle. And if I recall, blacks weren't brought over here on their own free will...but by ships chained together.

Anyway, just something that has always been pressing on my mind
rolleye.gif
 

Haircut

Platinum Member
Apr 23, 2000
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Well, in Britain we have had a few problems because of racism. Lots of links courtesy of the BBC
It has tended to flare up more in the Northern cities, the very right-wing British National Party got around 15-20% of the votes in this year's election in some of the regions where there were the race riots.
 

aphex

Moderator<br>All Things Apple
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Jul 19, 2001
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This topic has been on my mind recently due to the fact that im spending a semester abroad in either Sweden or Holland, and the fact that I am Jewish. However, i have heard that both places are fairly open to other religions and i shouldnt have any problems. Im hoping, for my sake, they they are correct.
 

Tominator

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
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<< "Go back to Africa." >>



If American Citizens call themselves anything but American I'll tell you right where to go!

I've only heard this when a debate about reparations or Black Separatists claiming there views are mainstream.

If you don't like it here, work to change it within reason or Go Back To Africa! Go Back To Anywhere....this is where you were born. You are American!
 

NFS4

No Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
72,636
47
91


<<

<< "Go back to Africa." >>



If American Citizens call themselves anything but American I'll tell you right where to go!

I've only heard this when a debate about reparations or Black Separatists claiming there views are mainstream.

If you don't like it here, work to change it within reason or Go Back To Africa! Go Back To Anywhere....this is where you were born. You are American!
>>


I'm not disagreeing with you...I'm just saying what kind of sh!t people try to pull off.
 

Cyberian

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Jun 17, 2000
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<< This topic has been on my mind recently due to the fact that im spending a semester abroad in either Sweden or Holland, and the fact that I am Jewish. However, i have heard that both places are fairly open to other religions and i shouldnt have any problems. Im hoping, for my sake, they they are correct. >>


You do have an advantage if you do not have a heavy accent or wear a yarmulke, in that people will not know your heritage unless you mention it.
It's a little harder to conceal being Black or Chinese. ;)
 

Czar

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
28,510
0
0


<<

<< I think its pretty much alike in most places, people are just looking for an excuse for their own problems so its easiest to blame the outsider. That is what I'm seeing here in Iceland at least. >>



The funny thing is, lots of extreme racist whites like to tell blacks to "Go back to Africa." I find that funny considering that whites came from Europe over to America (so they should easily "Go back to Europe") and that they shipped the native americans out west like cattle. And if I recall, blacks weren't brought over here on their own free will...but by ships chained together.

Anyway, just something that has always been pressing on my mind
rolleye.gif
>>


hehe exactly :)
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81


<<

<< I think its pretty much alike in most places, people are just looking for an excuse for their own problems so its easiest to blame the outsider. That is what I'm seeing here in Iceland at least. >>



The funny thing is, lots of extreme racist whites like to tell blacks to "Go back to Africa." I find that funny considering that whites came from Europe over to America (so they should easily "Go back to Europe") and that they shipped the native americans out west like cattle. And if I recall, blacks weren't brought over here on their own free will...but by ships chained together.

Anyway, just something that has always been pressing on my mind
rolleye.gif
>>



You know what Brandon, you can take your black @$$ on back to Africa.

;):)

 

b0mbrman

Lifer
Jun 1, 2001
29,470
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I know there's a bit of anti-Chinese feeling in all the big cities of SE Asia because ethnic Chinese entrepreneurs seem to take away jobs...same problem that NY grocers and LA liquor store owners face...

Um...my Korean friends tell me that they look down on Blacks in S Korea because the only contact they have with them in real life is with rough and tough infantry blacks.

Also, the only image they see of blacks is what they get from American movies...
 

b0mbrman

Lifer
Jun 1, 2001
29,470
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<< Well, in Britain we have had a few problems because of racism. Lots of links courtesy of the BBC
It has tended to flare up more in the Northern cities, the very right-wing British National Party got around 15-20% of the votes in this year's election in some of the regions where there were the race riots.
>>


I remember when I visited London this past winter, the big hubbub on the news was that there seemed to be a huge increase in cellphone theft (which mattered to me since I had a cellphone I didn't want stolen ;)) and in regards to racism, there were numbers saying most cell phone thefts were done by young black males despite them making up a small minority of the population as a whole.

Not sure what became of the whole thing. Obviously, I stopped caring when I was back in the US...enough cell phone thieves to worry about here anyway ;)
 

IGBT

Lifer
Jul 16, 2001
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Racism is a world wide phenomena inate in all humans. In homogenous societies classism is the actuality.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,178
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Its also quite a problem in countries with large gypsy populations.


People really, really don't like them.
 

aphex

Moderator<br>All Things Apple
Moderator
Jul 19, 2001
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<<

<< This topic has been on my mind recently due to the fact that im spending a semester abroad in either Sweden or Holland, and the fact that I am Jewish. However, i have heard that both places are fairly open to other religions and i shouldnt have any problems. Im hoping, for my sake, they they are correct. >>


You do have an advantage if you do not have a heavy accent or wear a yarmulke, in that people will not know your heritage unless you mention it.
It's a little harder to conceal being Black or Chinese. ;)
>>



Very true...
 

b0mbrman

Lifer
Jun 1, 2001
29,470
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From my own experience among Asian Americans in southern California, here's how the stereotypes work...

Japanese look down on Koreans and Koreans look down on Chinese.
Old Chinese people dislike the Japanese and some Cantonese look down on the
Some members of these groups look down on Filipinos but for most, Filipinos aren't really in the "chain" so to speak...So no down or up, they're more off to the side
As for Vietnamese, Thai, Cambodian, etc., since they're pretty rare, they can move in and out of every other group but not without paying a fee to do so. Also, ethnic Chinese from these countries look down on the other people from those countries...
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
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France has a large population of Arabs from North Africa, principally, Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria.

I can tell you that they are not well-liked. In fact, I would go as far as to say they're hated. It's interesting that in public, most French deride the right-winger Le Pen, but in private many of them support his views.

The French aren't crazy about Africans either (although they're not as despised as the Arabs) but they tolerate blacks from the Carribbean.

Anyway, that's my opinion based on a dozen or so trips to France.
 

Shantanu

Banned
Feb 6, 2001
2,197
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The U.S. has by far the least problems with racism than any other country on multi-ethnic country on Earth. Part of this has to do with the fact that there's an actual dialogue for racism here. In the U.S., problems with racism are dealt with in the courts and in the legislatures. As such, you may think that the U.S. is a "racist" place (as Jesse Jackson would have you believe), but rather it is a sign that the system works. Most countries just deny that they even have racial problems.

Countries that are comprable to the U.S. in Western Europe have a long way to go. I lived in the UK for 7 years during the 1980's. It was not uncommon there, for people of various ethnicities to be referred to by ethnic slurs to their face and get away with it too (i.e. black people would routinely be called "awesome people", Indians would be called "Pakis", etc. - I have yet to see that happen here in the U.S., without the person who said it being instantaneously beat down). If you were Indian in the UK, you had to accept being a second class citizen. When I moved to the U.S. in 1992, one of the things that absolutely shocked the hell out of me was that white clerks working at stores would give you the same treatment as the white customers - i.e. they would smile at you, and give you the cash in your hand. In the UK, they would just sneer at you and toss the money on the table. It was as if you were doing them a favor by shopping there... Since moving to the U.S., I've been accepted as an equal by Americans since day 1. That's not to say I haven't encountered some bigots, but most people treat people of other races with respect. The UK is also a multiethnic country like the U.S. But living in the UK, I could never call myself "British", because no Englishman would ever accept me as such.

Elsewhere in the world:

In India, there are bitter divisions between the various religious and ethnic groups. Even within these groups, there are bitter divisions based on race. Politics there is almost exclusively based on playing off ethnic issues, rather than real issues.

South Africa and Zimbabwe have some of the worst problems with racism. Being a white person there today is like being Jewish during Nazi Germany. The white people living in those countries are fleeing as fast as they can back to Europe. Some of them have been living there for generations...

In Australia, there's substantial racism against Asians.

Throughout Europe, there's recently been a tide of anti-Muslim sentiment, since a several of the Sept 11 hijackers were discovered to be European Muslims. Many xenophobic, anti-immigrant parties have since come into power.

On the topic of Western European Muslims (there are now 15 million of them), most have failed to assimilate into European society. This may be due to the fact that Europeans are extremely xenophobic and regard non-whites, and non-Christians with suspicion. This would have the effect of driving the ethnic minorities closer together and farther away from the general society. Muslims living in France, Germany, Denmark, Italy, and Spain are treated quite poorly and with considerable hostility. In contrast, most Muslims that I know who grew up in the U.S. have assimilated quite well into American society.

In Singapore, ethnic Indians and Malays have long complained of being treated as second class citizens.

In Fiji, half the population is composed of the native islanders, the other half is composed of ethnic Indians that came over in the 19th century under the British rule. The ethnic Indians are more prosperous than the native islanders, and as such the latter have considerable resentment towards the former. There was a coup last year in which the ethnic Indian President was thrown in jail, a native islander who installed himself in power, and a suspension of the civil rights of ethnic Indians living in Fiji.

There are literally countless examples. I would challenge you to find one multi-racial/multi-ethnic country in the world that has anywhere near the amount of racial harmony now enjoyed in the U.S.
 

Mookow

Lifer
Apr 24, 2001
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<< The funny thing is, lots of extreme racist whites like to tell blacks to "Go back to Africa." I find that funny considering that whites came from Europe over to America (so they should easily "Go back to Europe") and that they shipped the native americans out west like cattle. And if I recall, blacks weren't brought over here on their own free will...but by ships chained together. >>



Duh. Who is going to say "I'm the problem, for the good of the country, I'm leaving."? Exactly. Racists always see other people as lower than them. In other words, as far as a racist person's thought process goes, they think that "the problem could never be me, its you :| , now LEAVE!" Note that I'm not a tree hugging hippie in my thoughts, that was just my personal observations on the subject.
 

b0mbrman

Lifer
Jun 1, 2001
29,470
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<< France has a large population of Arabs from North Africa, principally, Tunisia, Morocco, and Algeria.

I can tell you that they are not well-liked. In fact, I would go as far as to say they're hated. It's interesting that in public, most French deride the right-winger Le Pen, but in private many of them support his views.

The French aren't crazy about Africans either (although they're not as despised as the Arabs) but they tolerate blacks from the Carribbean.

Anyway, that's my opinion based on a dozen or so trips to France.
>>


Yeah...I noticed that a little bit too in my one trip to France. :) It's interesting that France would be so pro-Arab in international politics in spite of these feelings...
 

venk

Banned
Dec 10, 2000
7,449
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<< There are literally countless examples. I would challenge you to find one multi-racial/multi-ethnic country in the world that has anywhere near the amount of racial harmony now enjoyed in the U.S. >>



Hows Canada? Toronto seems fairly diverse, but I have not been to much of Canada.
 

"This topic has been on my mind recently due to the fact that im spending a semester abroad in either Sweden or Holland, and the fact that I am Jewish."

Ahh! You finally narrowed your choices? At least Holland is still in the game! ;) Sweden is a cool country, though. :)

Well, back to topic: The word "racism" has been tossed around and used to loosely, so it is best you define what you mean by "racism" here.

I would venture to say "prejudice", "tribalism", etc. It certainly exists in every country, tribe, and continent. Don't let anyone fool you. Every group is prejudiced in some way. That is why when come minorities come whining and speaking as though "racism" is some big shock to them, I get utterly disgusted 'cuz they are being pretentious. In fact, they are so aware that within their nations of origin, they too discriminate against people on the basis of their languages, religions, tribes, etc. They too reign supreme in doctrine as taught to their kids and to the discriminated.

Nonetheless, they still have a point. I would say the degree of discrimination on the basis of one's identity tends to vary in countries. Some people or countries tend to possess the quality of discriminating and in a malicious manner than others would and do.
 

Shantanu

Banned
Feb 6, 2001
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<< Hows Canada? Toronto seems fairly diverse, but I have not been to much of Canada. >>



I would charecterize modern day Canadian race relations as good. Part of this may be due to Canada's physical and cultural proximity to the U.S. Canada's history has much in common with that of the U.S. They also benefit from the American experience.

The ethnic French may tell you a different story...