Does anyone have any recomendations on a good but inexpensive titanium driver. I want something similiar to the great big bertha (maybe not quite as big) but there's no way I'm paying 400 dollars for it.
Question for golfers here.
- Thread starter Jhill
- Start date
Get a used Big Bertha or some other name brand driver off ebay. Golf clubs are pretty cheap on there.
Jason
Jason
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
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No, if you're looking for the most bang for the buck, stay away from OEM drivers entirely. Typically, a $400 TM or Callaway driver is an $80 head on a 6 buck shaft with $300+ going to the dealer, the manufacturer and the tour pro who lies and says he uses that model. The most important part of any club is the shaft and typical OEM clubs use CRAPPY shafts that were bought from the lowest bidder. Find a local clubmaker and have him build you a component driver with a top-notch titanium head from Bang, SMT or Integra with a high-quality aftermarket shaft that suits your game and swing speed. You should easily be able to come up with something that outperforms a $400 proshop model for $100-$150.
Thanks thats sounds like a good plan. I have a club builder by me, I'll pay him a visit. What are OEM clubs anyway? I'm not sure what you mean by OEM clubs.
Also what is a component driver? Do you mean just not a pre-built one?
Thanks for the help.
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
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OEM = Original Equipment Manufacturer, the big name stuff you buy in ProShops, Golf stores and the online sellers like TGW.com. It's stuff like Taylormade, Calloway, Cleveland, etc. It's, to put it mildly, junk. The OEM quality control is non-existent and clubs don't match the stated lofts, the swingweights are off throughout a set, you're limited in selection of shafts and grips and worst of all, you're paying a huge amount to support their tour program. A normal tour pro makes over $500,000 a year from club endorsements (and much more than that for big names) to say he plays a certain brand of clubs, but he doesn't really use the stuff that you or I can buy. Taylormade is the #1 driver on the PGA tour. You know how many tour pros play the TM heads with the shafts that you or I can buy in a pro shop? ZERO!!
Component clubs are ala carte. Some manufacturers make heads, others make shafts, others make grips. Rather than buying a Taylormade driver and being locked in to whatever shaft and grip choices they offer, by using components you get EXACTLY what you want and what fits your game. You choose a head syle and loft you like, match it up with any shaft on the market (there are hundreds) in any flex you want and pair it with any grip in any size. A good clubfitter will match the loft and flex to your swing and you'll wind up with a club with a head just as good as an OEM, a shaft that's much better than an OEM and a fit that's far better than you'll get by walking into a proshop and hitting a few balls into a net.
Quality component titanium driver heads run $40-$120. Graphite shafts run $10-$70 (mostly, Fujikuras are much more, but that's an artificially inflated price) and a clubmaker/fitter might upcharge you $50-$75 for the fitting and building. You can get a $50 head on a $50 shaft and walk out the door with a club for $150 (including building costs) that will be better than any proshop OEM club. You can also build an incredibly good driver with a $40 head on a $25 head with a $5 grip and get it out the door for under $125 and it'll still match or surpass superexpensive Taylormade 500 series or the newest Big Berthas.
If you've got a local clubmake/fitter who deals with quality components, talk to him about the following:
Cheapest, but still good: ($125-150)
BangSF360 or Integra TF360 head with a shaft like an SK Fiber Pure Energy, Penley Graphite Lite or UST ProForce75 (whichever model the fitter thinks matches your swing best)
Mid-range: ($150-175)
SMT Shinnecock or Big Bang with a shaft like an SK Fiber PE, Proforce XL or Graphalloy ProLite
High-end: ($175-200)
SMT Nemesis or SMT 455 DB with a shaft like a Graphalloy Blue, a Graphite Designs Purple Ice or a Penley ETA shaft.
I build a ton of component drivers just by starting with one. Some guy gets one and lets his friend hit it and the friend hits it better than his $400 OEM driver (because it's a better club) so he wants one. Then his friend wants one and that guys brother in law wants one, etc etc etc. No advertising, just word of mouth. How good a player are you and how far do you hit your current driver?
Component clubs are ala carte. Some manufacturers make heads, others make shafts, others make grips. Rather than buying a Taylormade driver and being locked in to whatever shaft and grip choices they offer, by using components you get EXACTLY what you want and what fits your game. You choose a head syle and loft you like, match it up with any shaft on the market (there are hundreds) in any flex you want and pair it with any grip in any size. A good clubfitter will match the loft and flex to your swing and you'll wind up with a club with a head just as good as an OEM, a shaft that's much better than an OEM and a fit that's far better than you'll get by walking into a proshop and hitting a few balls into a net.
Quality component titanium driver heads run $40-$120. Graphite shafts run $10-$70 (mostly, Fujikuras are much more, but that's an artificially inflated price) and a clubmaker/fitter might upcharge you $50-$75 for the fitting and building. You can get a $50 head on a $50 shaft and walk out the door with a club for $150 (including building costs) that will be better than any proshop OEM club. You can also build an incredibly good driver with a $40 head on a $25 head with a $5 grip and get it out the door for under $125 and it'll still match or surpass superexpensive Taylormade 500 series or the newest Big Berthas.
If you've got a local clubmake/fitter who deals with quality components, talk to him about the following:
Cheapest, but still good: ($125-150)
BangSF360 or Integra TF360 head with a shaft like an SK Fiber Pure Energy, Penley Graphite Lite or UST ProForce75 (whichever model the fitter thinks matches your swing best)
Mid-range: ($150-175)
SMT Shinnecock or Big Bang with a shaft like an SK Fiber PE, Proforce XL or Graphalloy ProLite
High-end: ($175-200)
SMT Nemesis or SMT 455 DB with a shaft like a Graphalloy Blue, a Graphite Designs Purple Ice or a Penley ETA shaft.
I build a ton of component drivers just by starting with one. Some guy gets one and lets his friend hit it and the friend hits it better than his $400 OEM driver (because it's a better club) so he wants one. Then his friend wants one and that guys brother in law wants one, etc etc etc. No advertising, just word of mouth. How good a player are you and how far do you hit your current driver?
I do not agree with GagHalfrunt at all. I recently hit the new TaylorMade 580 (?) ... and was simply AMAZED over my Ping ISI driver. Go to the range and hit a bunch of drivers ... and purchase which ever matches you the best. Some brands (namely Callaway) has always used incredibly poor shafts in their drivers. I mean they are literally $4 shafts, but Taylormade and Ping have been using higher quality (not the best, but good) shafts in their clubs for a while now.
If I were you, I would find a titanium driver that you hit well, search ebay for a used one, and then insert a high quality shaft (frequencey, stiffness, flex, all of that good stfuff) matched to your swing. You will get the advantages of having a great head with a good shaft that should provide a longer and straighter ball flight.
A good shaft will cost you about $80 ... just so you know.
If I were you, I would find a titanium driver that you hit well, search ebay for a used one, and then insert a high quality shaft (frequencey, stiffness, flex, all of that good stfuff) matched to your swing. You will get the advantages of having a great head with a good shaft that should provide a longer and straighter ball flight.
A good shaft will cost you about $80 ... just so you know.
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
- 126
Quite wrong! How many component drivers have you hit? About none? Yeah, that's what I thought. The shaft upgrades that OEMs offer are junk. Titleist offers a Fujikura speeder upgrade. But it's not the Speeder that Ernie and Phil play, it's just a made in China piece of junk with Fujikura's name stamped on it. Fujikura themselves admit it's not the same shaft and that it's really a low-priced knockoff, but the suckers still buy them.
And where do you get that $80 for a shaft garbage? Most good shafts are well under that. David Toms won a couple of weeks ago with a Ping head reshafted with a Graphalloy Blue. Shaft price: under $50. Fred Couples won with a Harmon Tour Designs shaft in a TM head. Shaft price: under $40. A Purple Ice is under $50. Apache Orange Crushes and Penley ETAs are under $60. The #1 driver shaft on the PGA tour is the UST Proforce and that shaft costs less than $40. It surpassed the Grpahalloy ProLite as #1 and that shaft can be had for under $35. Get a clue. Just because you wasted $400 on a club that's worth under $100 doesn't mean others should follow suit.
Jhill, don't believe me and definitely don't believe Spac3d. Believe yourself. Find a clubmaker that'll let you hit some overpriced OEM junk right next to a quality component club. If you don't prefer the component club and still spend more than $200 less on it, I'll eat a ProV1.
Oh, well thanks for informing me on how many and what type of clubs I hit
Most of the graffaloy's I have seen from stores around here are $80 installed. There isn't too much of a market for decent shafts around here, and I would rather have it isntalled locally then sending it across the Internet to have someone else install it. I was just giving him a general price too... I would rather tell him a higher price than for him to walk into a store and think he was getting ripped off for some higher price.
I also told Jhill to hit all of the clubs and find a club that matched him. That is all that a custom fitter would do too. You cannot just grab any club, then hit a custom built club built for you and compare them. If I wanted to get a new club, I am not saying I wouldn't fully customize the club. Ping can put in whatever shaft I tell them to put in, whatever loft, bend, etc. and they will sent it straight to me.
I never said that I spent $400 on my driver, I get all of the clubs I play with for free
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
- 126
Sorry, not a clue. I'm east coast. Try visiting the GEA forums and ask a left-coaster there, ask the pro at your local club or look in the phonebook for a GCA certified clubmaker. Odds are there's a good clubmaker very close to whereever you live.
then why did you say that you didn't agree with GagHalfrunt at all?
I think he is quite right, that is if you can find a good local fitter.
The problem is finding one (ie, a bad builder is just as likely to rip you off as an OEM).
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
- 126
OREOSpeedwagon
Diamond Member
- May 30, 2001
- 8,485
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Instead of making it so complicated for the guy why not just give him a simple straightforward answer? I would highly recommend a Titleist 975J. I bought one a few weeks ago for $155 on eBay with a Graffalloy Stiff Flex shaft and I am VERY satisfied. Find a driver you hit well and search eBay for an identical or similar one and you'll get it for sometimes 50% less than what you'd pay at the pro shop.
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
- 126
Ummm, you think searching pro shops for a club that you hit well and then searching Ebay for the EXACT same club, then going through the bidding process hoping to get it for a fair price all the while risking it being a counterfeit, a bad condition or broken model, a wrong size, flex or lie angle or any of 100 other problems is less complicated than spending 30 minutes with a qualified clubfitter? Getting fit for a club is a simple process. A good clubfitter will have you in the right length, lie and shaft flex inside 5 minutes. After that it's just a matter of dialing it in to get it perfect by playing with heads with different COGs and shafts with different flex points. A good clubfitter can tell you whether you're better off in a 12* head with a low launch shaft, a 10.5* head matched to a low torque shaft or a 9* head with a faster tip shaft. That's something you can never find out hitting into nets in a pro shop. Getting fit by a professional is far less complicated that hitting every make and model and hoping you stumble across something suitable by trial and error.
Going with a custom built club can save you a lot of money over an OEM club and it will be built to fit you not the "average" golfer. Go look at Golfsmith for prices on club components. As for OEM clubs not being as good of quality at custom clubs, I do not agree with that. You just have to look harder for the quality clubs that OEMs make. Your best bet is to probably check with a local pro-shop and see what they have to offer. They can also special order clubs for you if needed. Currently, I have woords that I custom built but I really want to get a Titleist 975L-FE driver. It is probably the best driver I have hit ever. As for the cheap shafts on OEM clubs, I probably put more stress on a golf lub shaft than 95% of golfers (my swing speed is around 110mph). I need an X flex shaft to even be able to hit the ball without feeling the shaft flex when I hit it. So, I am not going to find a club for me in your average golf store. Most pro-shops have them and if I am luckly some other golf store do too.
I agree about the component clubs. I can't afford them just yet. I'm just using a really piece of junk Northwestern set (I think...I don't even check). But I play just as well as the guys with the Callaways, Pings and Taylormades. I always laugh when I get a particularly boastful guy with his expensive OEM clubs as a golf partner. They usually start off really boastful, then when I match or outdrive them with my cheap POS driver they quiet down. My dad has had a couple of component clubs made for him and the difference is like night and day. I'm doing a lot of experimentation with my swing this year so next year when I'm consistent, I think I'm going to splurge on a custom set.
Quick question to GagHalfrunt. Is it just a misconception of mine, or do OEM manufacturers neglect the quality control on certain less-used clubs - say, the even irons like 4, 6 and 8 - moreso than the odd-numbered irons like 3,5,7,9? I don't even bother to use my 6 or 8 because they just feel crappy.
Quick question to GagHalfrunt. Is it just a misconception of mine, or do OEM manufacturers neglect the quality control on certain less-used clubs - say, the even irons like 4, 6 and 8 - moreso than the odd-numbered irons like 3,5,7,9? I don't even bother to use my 6 or 8 because they just feel crappy.
GagHalfrunt
Lifer
- Apr 19, 2001
- 25,284
- 1,997
- 126
The OEMs ignore the quality control on EVERY club. On your set it happens to be the 6 and 8 that are off. On another set from the same manufacturer it'll be the 4 and 9 that are wrong. On another the 3 will be wrong. The OEMs don't bother with checking anything. They figure the good golfer will have his clubs checked and adjusted or customized as necessary and the bad golfer will blame himself for his failure to hit certain clubs. I have NEVER measured and specced a set of irons from an OEM where all clubs were within normal tolerances. EVERY set has had clubs that were off for flex, swingweight, loft or lie. They're just slapped together and tossed onto into a box without any effort being made to be sure that they all conform and will play to the same specs within a set. If you buy OEMs and get a set where only 1 or 2 clubs need to be adjusted to fit the rest of the set you're lucky. It's gotten so bad that even buying individual clubs like drivers or wedges is a crapshoot. Forget about trying to get a set of 8 irons that are in synch with each other, that's impossible, but even buying a single club that matches the specs is tough. Most 10* drivers are either 9* or 11*. Two indentical-looking high-end drivers will have swingweights ranging from C6 (very light, womens clubs mostly) to E8 (King Kong only). A shaft that says "Stiff" might play anywhere from extra-stiff to ladies. A sand wedge listed with 12* of bounce might really only have 4*.
I'm currently building a set of irons for a customer, the epoxy is drying as I type this. He was having trouble with his old set and it was among the worst I've ever seen. In 8 clubs there were 3 different shaft flexes, the 6 iron had less loft than the 5 and no 2 clubs had the same swingweight or lie angle. You seriously could have taken a 5 iron from one brand, the 6 from another, the 7 from another, etc at random and had them come out as close to matched as this set was. The set? Callaway Big Berthas that he had payed $800 for. The set I'm building him is Dynacraft DFS II heads with Rifle shafts and Lamkin grips. All heads were checked before building and were dead on spec for loft, lie and weight. All shafts were flex tested and one had to be adjusted by trimming to get it to match the other 7 clubs, so now all 8 are identical. All swingweights are now identical. The price? $78 for the heads. $96 for the shafts. $32 for the grips. $4 for ferrules. $210 worth of parts, I'm charging him $140 for the fitting and building and misc supplies. For $350 out the door he gets a set that fits him and that's been specced so that each club matches every other club. The component heads are better than the Calloways, the shafts used are better than stock Callaway shafts and he got exactly the grips he wanted, built up with 3 wraps of tape under the left hand (don't ask me why, that's how he wanted it). Clubs exactly to his specs for less than half the price of the badly built OEMs he was using.
interesting information. my brother in law just broke a big bertha shaft the other day. i hear it's pretty common in calloway drivers. do the custom makers have lifetime warranties too?
I did this also
I broke the shaft on my callaway hawkeye 5 wood... called callaway and they reshafted it for free
just call them up, they will mail you a packing slip, then mail the club to them... wait a couple of weeks and voila! new shaft!! they even repainted the grooves on the club!!
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