Putting on weight

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

I mentioned something about 1g per pound, but as I originally stated it just happens to work out that way. Personally I do 40/40/20 protein/carbs/fat which right now as I am cutting that 40% calories from protein just happens to be my body weight (175). If I am not cutting, then it shoots up to ~225g which is over 1g per pound. I've been a bad boy for many months so I'll be cutting for a while . . .

Anyhow that is all just what I am doing with my body. As has been said it is best to go to that wannabebig forums or bodybuilding.com is good as well in my opinion.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor
Man the wrong information in this thread is making my head hurt.

OP take Special K's advice and go to a forum like Wannabebig or bodybuilding.com and get the people there (who actually know what they are talking about) to help you. In the mean time you can PM Special K, Amused, RedDawn, Spamela, Koing, or myself, who actually know about weightlifting and aren't some wannabe pretender on a computer forum.

Good Luck! And some very, very, basic things to remember:

Get your diet in check first, supplements don't do crap if you are eating bad.
You want to get big? Eat, eat a lot. Chicken, steak, etc, but eat clean, but a lot. If you are having trouble, this is were protein shakes or MRS come in. Also look into Controlled Labs Black Hole, its a great appetitete stimulant if you are really having trouble.
You need to cardio, period.
Stick with compound exercises, bench, squat, deadlift. No need to do isolation exercises for now, because since your new your gains will be great in the beggining. Stay with around 3 sets of 10 for now, as you need to stay light and concentrate on form (elitelifts.com) has great writeups on beggingers looking to improve form.
Take a scoop of whey in the morning, one after you workout(the most important), and one before bed. Optimum Nutrition's 100% Whey is pretty much the best protein on the market. You can get 10lbs for 50$ right now at dpsnutrition.com.
IGNORE any other supplements right now, you need to lift, you don't need creatine, you don't need any of that muscle tech no2 crap. Just lift, and eat.
Stay away from weight gainers for now, they aren't needed, and most are just full of sugar (someone mentioned BSN True Mass, that's of Malodextrin), plus a home made weight gainer is much more healthy, works better, and is more efficient.
BUY OATS, they are the most calorie dense food you can buy, steel cut preferbly. Eat them with your protein shake post workout to get a good carb/protein ratio.
Carbs before and after lifting, never go on a low carb diet, you need it for energy. High GI (gatorade) are fine before and after lifitng.
Get a good multi, take one in the morning. Look into NOW adam, it is the best out there, pretty much equal to animal pak.
Read and research, you'll learn more and more and once you get started you can focus on your goals (in this case getting big) more.
That's just the lifting side. Running is another ball game.


Good Luck Bro! Great to see you want to change your lifestyle.
-Scott

do you mean lean?

 

[HybridSquirrel]

ive been working out this summer swimming/bike riding getting ready for iron man..and i gained 10 pounds

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor
Man the wrong information in this thread is making my head hurt.

OP take Special K's advice and go to a forum like Wannabebig or bodybuilding.com and get the people there (who actually know what they are talking about) to help you. In the mean time you can PM Special K, Amused, RedDawn, Spamela, Koing, or myself, who actually know about weightlifting and aren't some wannabe pretender on a computer forum.

Good Luck! And some very, very, basic things to remember:

Get your diet in check first, supplements don't do crap if you are eating bad.
You want to get big? Eat, eat a lot. Chicken, steak, etc, but eat clean, but a lot. If you are having trouble, this is were protein shakes or MRS come in. Also look into Controlled Labs Black Hole, its a great appetitete stimulant if you are really having trouble.
You need to cardio, period.
Stick with compound exercises, bench, squat, deadlift. No need to do isolation exercises for now, because since your new your gains will be great in the beggining. Stay with around 3 sets of 10 for now, as you need to stay light and concentrate on form (elitelifts.com) has great writeups on beggingers looking to improve form.
Take a scoop of whey in the morning, one after you workout(the most important), and one before bed. Optimum Nutrition's 100% Whey is pretty much the best protein on the market. You can get 10lbs for 50$ right now at dpsnutrition.com.
IGNORE any other supplements right now, you need to lift, you don't need creatine, you don't need any of that muscle tech no2 crap. Just lift, and eat.
Stay away from weight gainers for now, they aren't needed, and most are just full of sugar (someone mentioned BSN True Mass, that's of Malodextrin), plus a home made weight gainer is much more healthy, works better, and is more efficient.
BUY OATS, they are the most calorie dense food you can buy, steel cut preferbly. Eat them with your protein shake post workout to get a good carb/protein ratio.
Carbs before and after lifting, never go on a low carb diet, you need it for energy. High GI (gatorade) are fine before and after lifitng.
Get a good multi, take one in the morning. Look into NOW adam, it is the best out there, pretty much equal to animal pak.
Read and research, you'll learn more and more and once you get started you can focus on your goals (in this case getting big) more.
That's just the lifting side. Running is another ball game.


Good Luck Bro! Great to see you want to change your lifestyle.
-Scott

do you mean lean?

No, eating clean as opposed to eating "dirty". Eating clean = eating healthy foods, although I guess technically by this definition you could also call it eating lean. Eating dirty would mean getting your calories from pizza, ice cream, candy bars, etc. Technically you could still grow as long as your total calories were high enough, but the ratio of fat to muscle gained would probably not be as favorable.

 

[allies]

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

Except you won't use it all

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: allies

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

Except you won't use it all

Link to a scientific study verifying this?

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: allies

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

Except you won't use it all

Sure, you are going to piss some out, but can you tell the exact amount of protein you need? No, always better to get more protein, and it shows on the guys who have back in the day.

Sorry, I respect your mom's PhD and all, but I have had nutritionalists with degrees tell me creatine is harmful etc.

EDIT: Also, do actually you workout? Or are you just posting your opinion that means nothing because you don't know what you're talking about?

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: JS80

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor
Man the wrong information in this thread is making my head hurt.

OP take Special K's advice and go to a forum like Wannabebig or bodybuilding.com and get the people there (who actually know what they are talking about) to help you. In the mean time you can PM Special K, Amused, RedDawn, Spamela, Koing, or myself, who actually know about weightlifting and aren't some wannabe pretender on a computer forum.

Good Luck! And some very, very, basic things to remember:

Get your diet in check first, supplements don't do crap if you are eating bad.
You want to get big? Eat, eat a lot. Chicken, steak, etc, but eat clean, but a lot. If you are having trouble, this is were protein shakes or MRS come in. Also look into Controlled Labs Black Hole, its a great appetitete stimulant if you are really having trouble.
You need to cardio, period.
Stick with compound exercises, bench, squat, deadlift. No need to do isolation exercises for now, because since your new your gains will be great in the beggining. Stay with around 3 sets of 10 for now, as you need to stay light and concentrate on form (elitelifts.com) has great writeups on beggingers looking to improve form.
Take a scoop of whey in the morning, one after you workout(the most important), and one before bed. Optimum Nutrition's 100% Whey is pretty much the best protein on the market. You can get 10lbs for 50$ right now at dpsnutrition.com.
IGNORE any other supplements right now, you need to lift, you don't need creatine, you don't need any of that muscle tech no2 crap. Just lift, and eat.
Stay away from weight gainers for now, they aren't needed, and most are just full of sugar (someone mentioned BSN True Mass, that's of Malodextrin), plus a home made weight gainer is much more healthy, works better, and is more efficient.
BUY OATS, they are the most calorie dense food you can buy, steel cut preferbly. Eat them with your protein shake post workout to get a good carb/protein ratio.
Carbs before and after lifting, never go on a low carb diet, you need it for energy. High GI (gatorade) are fine before and after lifitng.
Get a good multi, take one in the morning. Look into NOW adam, it is the best out there, pretty much equal to animal pak.
Read and research, you'll learn more and more and once you get started you can focus on your goals (in this case getting big) more.
That's just the lifting side. Running is another ball game.


Good Luck Bro! Great to see you want to change your lifestyle.
-Scott

do you mean lean?

No, eating clean as opposed to eating "dirty". Eating clean = eating healthy foods, although I guess technically by this definition you could also call it eating lean. Eating dirty would mean getting your calories from pizza, ice cream, candy bars, etc. Technically you could still grow as long as your total calories were high enough, but the ratio of fat to muscle gained would probably not be as favorable.

Exactly.

 

[Descartes]

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

Except you won't use it all

Sure, you are going to piss some out, but can you tell the exact amount of protein you need? No, always better to get more protein, and it shows on the guys who have back in the day.

Sorry, I respect your mom's PhD and all, but I have had nutritionalists with degrees tell me creatine is harmful etc.

EDIT: Also, do actually you workout? Or are you just posting your opinion that means nothing because you don't know what you're talking about?

So are you saying it is or it isn't?

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: Descartes

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor

Originally posted by: allies
I missed the point about him having a tough time stomaching food. Protein shakes would come in handy there. Also, there's no reason why you need 1g protein per pound body weight, as someone mentioned before. There's a formula my mom has (she's worked with olympic athletes, has a PhD in nutrition, etc) that can be adjusted if you're trying to build lots of mass, but I'll have to ask her for it.

But like I said, if it's a lot more convenient (by all means you need to get protein somehow) via shakes will suffice

Actually there is no reason not to get 1g/lb.

Except you won't use it all

Sure, you are going to piss some out, but can you tell the exact amount of protein you need? No, always better to get more protein, and it shows on the guys who have back in the day.

Sorry, I respect your mom's PhD and all, but I have had nutritionalists with degrees tell me creatine is harmful etc.

EDIT: Also, do actually you workout? Or are you just posting your opinion that means nothing because you don't know what you're talking about?

So are you saying it is or it isn't?

Its perfectly fine. Recently someone had some kidney trouble with CEE and creainitine levels, but it was because he was predisposed to kidney trouble already.

 

[pcnerd37]

Originally posted by: bignateyk

Originally posted by: pcnerd37
I need to do some research on this kind of stuff as well, because im slightly heavy, 195 at 5'7" and im looking to turn that fat into muscle by starting some kind of daily workout schedule starting the beginning of October and hope to be in good shape and skinnier by the end of the year. Any advice you guys have for me would be great. Im looking for something that will give me max strengh as I am considering looking into becoming a professional wrestler and l and am not real sure where to start.

Ban.

Do you have a problem with people having dreams? If so, you need to ban yourself and off yourself.

 

[CellarDoor]

Originally posted by: allies
You don't need to supplement your diet with protein. It's basically a waste of money. You can get well enough protein from eating a regular diet and gettint 5-6 glasses of milk per day. Also creatine will help you put on weight, but the majority of it will be water weight (muscles tend to retain more water when supplemented with creatine).

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I think allies is dead on. From what I've read, the average American digests 2 times the amount of protein they actually need. If the OP doesn't have a large appetite, and he's not eating a lot of calories, how is he going to gain any mass?

If you really want to do this, you have to bump up the calories. I wouldn't worry about the protein shakes, just have some high quality protein right after you workout (glass of chocolate milk, or a peanut butter and honey sandwich are supposed to be excellent for you after you work out).

Like I said though, I'm no expert.

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: mribnik1

Originally posted by: allies
You don't need to supplement your diet with protein. It's basically a waste of money. You can get well enough protein from eating a regular diet and gettint 5-6 glasses of milk per day. Also creatine will help you put on weight, but the majority of it will be water weight (muscles tend to retain more water when supplemented with creatine).

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I think allies is dead on. From what I've read, the average American digests 2 times the amount of protein they actually need. If the OP doesn't have a large appetite, and he's not eating a lot of calories, how is he going to gain any mass?

If you really want to do this, you have to bump up the calories. I wouldn't worry about the protein shakes, just have some high quality protein right after you workout (glass of chocolate milk, or a peanut butter and honey sandwich are supposed to be excellent for you after you work out).

Like I said though, I'm no expert.

The "average American" does not lift weights for the purpose of building muscle either. I realize the protein requirements for sedentary individuals are probably quite low. I'm not professing to be an expert either, but I don't think any study has ever been done on the protein requirements and utilization of people lifting heavy weights and trying to build muscle.

There's certainly no harm in doing so, so I don't see what the problem is with following the "1.0g/LB bodyweight" (some use 1.5) recommendation. Sure it may be somewhat arbitrary, but anectodal evidence from people who have been using it for years suggests that it works quite well.

 

[Nutdotnet]

Originally posted by: F22 Raptor
Man the wrong information in this thread is making my head hurt.

OP take Special K's advice and go to a forum like Wannabebig or bodybuilding.com and get the people there (who actually know what they are talking about) to help you. In the mean time you can PM Special K, Amused, RedDawn, Spamela, Koing, or myself, who actually know about weightlifting and aren't some wannabe pretender on a computer forum.

Good Luck! And some very, very, basic things to remember:

Get your diet in check first, supplements don't do crap if you are eating bad.
You want to get big? Eat, eat a lot. Chicken, steak, etc, but eat clean, but a lot. If you are having trouble, this is were protein shakes or MRS come in. Also look into Controlled Labs Black Hole, its a great appetitete stimulant if you are really having trouble.
You need to cardio, period.
Stick with compound exercises, bench, squat, deadlift. No need to do isolation exercises for now, because since your new your gains will be great in the beggining. Stay with around 3 sets of 10 for now, as you need to stay light and concentrate on form (elitelifts.com) has great writeups on beggingers looking to improve form.
Take a scoop of whey in the morning, one after you workout(the most important), and one before bed. Optimum Nutrition's 100% Whey is pretty much the best protein on the market. You can get 10lbs for 50$ right now at dpsnutrition.com.
IGNORE any other supplements right now, you need to lift, you don't need creatine, you don't need any of that muscle tech no2 crap. Just lift, and eat.
Stay away from weight gainers for now, they aren't needed, and most are just full of sugar (someone mentioned BSN True Mass, that's of Malodextrin), plus a home made weight gainer is much more healthy, works better, and is more efficient.
BUY OATS, they are the most calorie dense food you can buy, steel cut preferbly. Eat them with your protein shake post workout to get a good carb/protein ratio.
Carbs before and after lifting, never go on a low carb diet, you need it for energy. High GI (gatorade) are fine before and after lifitng.
Get a good multi, take one in the morning. Look into NOW adam, it is the best out there, pretty much equal to animal pak.
Read and research, you'll learn more and more and once you get started you can focus on your goals (in this case getting big) more.
That's just the lifting side. Running is another ball game.


Good Luck Bro! Great to see you want to change your lifestyle.
-Scott

Lol...pot calling kettle....

(You're on the same computer forum dude)

 

[RaiderJ]

Originally posted by: Cdubneeddeal
You probably want to stop the running and maybe just walk. You'll be burning a lot of calories that you desperately need to gain weight. Be careful when you purchase your protein. Choose a high quality whey based that is ultra filtered. If you buy cheap protein you'll have very bad smelling gas and even diarrhea (Which is water loss). I've been very happy with EAS Myoplex for years. If you seriously want to gain some weight take some creatine.

By all means eat more food. Lots of steak, boneless skinless chicken, potatoes, etc. Stick to the staples. And try to eat six times a day. For three of your meals use a protein shake instead of solid foods.

What type of workout are you doing/planning?

I agree - although I like to throw in some cardio. Running a couple miles every other day or so I've found to be very beneficial in my overall health.

 

[duragezic]

Thanks for all the replies.

So would a jug of whey protein from Walmart be adequate or do I have to get some sort of intense stuff? I don't wanna spend too much money at the start, but with my appetite I do believe I would need protein shakes.

I think I'll cut running down to every other day or so. Just to get more energy, but I won't be doing it to burn calories (try to minimize that anyway). I think a small amount of cardio like this would be helpful with lifting as well since when I first ran I was just done after like 1/4 mile but after running for 4-5 days I can do almost a mile without as much trouble. Smoking doesn't help anything either so I think I'll just do some light jogging.

 

[YetioDoom]

Originally posted by: Special K
OP refer to the link in my sig. If you are serious about this, go to that board, register, and make a post introducing yourself and stating your goals. There are lots of knowledgable people there who would be more than happy to give you advice.

This man speaks the truth! There is an unbelievable wealth of knowledge on WBB.

 

[Amused]

Personally, I think the formula is ideal at 1 gram of protein for every lb of LEAN body weight. 1.5 if you are a very hard gainer.

So if you are 130 and have 20% body fat, that's 104 grams of protein a day.

I'd say the OP should aim for 100-120 grams of high quality protein a day (focus on beef, chicken, fish and turkey).

Oh, and form, form, form, form. Did I mention form? This includes full range of motion on all exercises. Higher reps (10-12) until you perfect your form and get used to handling the weights. Keep this up for 3-6 months and then advance to higher weights and lower reps.

If you have any question as to how an exercise is done, use this as a reference:

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

Finally, stick to basic compound exersices. Presses, rows and squats. Basically the BOLD exercises in the link above.

 

[allies]

F22... yes I workout... and I run a lot. I'm gonna be a sophomore in college, but I still run with my highschool team during the summer months, and workout every other day (rotating muscle groups) with another runner, and also do plyometrics. I'm not just spouting off BS. I think Amused has a pretty fair assessment on protein needs. I asked my mom this morning and she said that all the studies have not shown any need to have over 1.8g/Kg of body weight. Anything over goes unused, and if you have functioning kidneys, it is NOT excreted in urine, but instead the amino acids that form from it are stored as fat.

If you want me to make a spreadsheet with the formula, I will later today.

Edit: Also about creatine, in studies 1/3 of the subjects do not respond to it at all, and the other 2/3s have a tendency to develop injuries. I'd say be careful if you want to incorporate supplemental creatine in your diet.

 

[Gravity]

Take a good multi-vitamin that has bcaa and zinc. Get at least 8 hours of sleep every night. Eat 4-6 smaller meals throughout the day. 1 gram of protein per lb of body weight throughout the day. Creatine if you're over 30, otherwise, your body is still producing a good amount of Testosterone and you will grow if you're consisten.

Good luck,

Gravity

 

[duragezic]

Thank you all.

I was under the impression that multivitamins weren't absorbed very well if they are made with calcium carbonate but I've seen several suggestions that still recommend them. I shall pick up a tub of whey protein (possible one of the weight-gainer mixes of protein/fat/carbs but I'm not sure yet), a decent multivitamin, and possible something else. I was talking with my roommate at work about lifting and supplements since hes real intense about that stuff. With his help I'll find some decent products at Walmart and modify my strength training a bit. Then in a couple of months after I have a better idea I can modify aspects of the routine and supplements and he talked about doing an online order for supplements (which he has done since I've lived with him). We'll be in the same house next school year too so basically our kitchen is gonna be loaded out with supplements heh.

I really wanna do this and keep up with it seriously. My general motivation for it is to get bigger and build muscle, feel more energetic and healthier.

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: mribnik1

Originally posted by: allies
You don't need to supplement your diet with protein. It's basically a waste of money. You can get well enough protein from eating a regular diet and gettint 5-6 glasses of milk per day. Also creatine will help you put on weight, but the majority of it will be water weight (muscles tend to retain more water when supplemented with creatine).

I'm not an expert on the subject, but I think allies is dead on. From what I've read, the average American digests 2 times the amount of protein they actually need. If the OP doesn't have a large appetite, and he's not eating a lot of calories, how is he going to gain any mass?

If you really want to do this, you have to bump up the calories. I wouldn't worry about the protein shakes, just have some high quality protein right after you workout (glass of chocolate milk, or a peanut butter and honey sandwich are supposed to be excellent for you after you work out).

Like I said though, I'm no expert.

There's your problem right there.

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: duragezic
Thank you all.

I was under the impression that multivitamins weren't absorbed very well if they are made with calcium carbonate but I've seen several suggestions that still recommend them. I shall pick up a tub of whey protein (possible one of the weight-gainer mixes of protein/fat/carbs but I'm not sure yet), a decent multivitamin, and possible something else. I was talking with my roommate at work about lifting and supplements since hes real intense about that stuff. With his help I'll find some decent products at Walmart and modify my strength training a bit. Then in a couple of months after I have a better idea I can modify aspects of the routine and supplements and he talked about doing an online order for supplements (which he has done since I've lived with him). We'll be in the same house next school year too so basically our kitchen is gonna be loaded out with supplements heh.

I really wanna do this and keep up with it seriously. My general motivation for it is to get bigger and build muscle, feel more energetic and healthier.

Zinc, Calcium, and Iron, all compete for absorbtion, with Calcium being the winner. Don't sweat it in a multi though. Pick up some Fish Oil also, 2-4g's a day, 2 caps in the morning, 2 caps at night with meals.

 

[SVT Cobra]

Originally posted by: allies
F22... yes I workout... and I run a lot. I'm gonna be a sophomore in college, but I still run with my highschool team during the summer months, and workout every other day (rotating muscle groups) with another runner, and also do plyometrics. I'm not just spouting off BS. I think Amused has a pretty fair assessment on protein needs. I asked my mom this morning and she said that all the studies have not shown any need to have over 1.8g/Kg of body weight. Anything over goes unused, and if you have functioning kidneys, it is NOT excreted in urine, but instead the amino acids that form from it are stored as fat.

If you want me to make a spreadsheet with the formula, I will later today.

Edit: Also about creatine, in studies 1/3 of the subjects do not respond to it at all, and the other 2/3s have a tendency to develop injuries. I'd say be careful if you want to incorporate supplemental creatine in your diet.

Amused has bacially said what I have said, although he incorporates it as lean body weight.

And, I am just LOL'ing at your creatine comment, typical nutritionalist crap. They do study nurtition, but they do not do weightlifting stuides etc.

When you can go squat over 600lbs, and bench over 400lbs, with 50g's of protein per day, PM me, I'll be waiting. Until then, I understand you beleive what you think to be right, but there are many, and I mean pretty much everyone in any weightlifitng federation you can find, that disagrees with you.