Putin Warns US About Socialism

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Specop 007

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2005
9,454
0
0
Originally posted by: manowar821
Originally posted by: Specop 007

No better, which is the heart of the problem. "We the people" are being led around by the nose.

I concur.

But the point is McCain didnt get elected and Obama did. There for I am concerned about what Obama, as the Community Leader, is doing.

And it makes me real nervous when the leader of a country that was the modern era's representation of socialism tells us "Hey, careful cause it doesnt work!". But for some reason our politicians continue to lead us right down that exact path, and the dumbass 51% majority cheer......
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*
 

Specop 007

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2005
9,454
0
0
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*

No crickets, spot on truth. But our elected leaders will ignore any input from others because damnit, THIS time it will work! And our citizens in this country are too damn stupid to care as long as the Community Leader promises to take care of them.
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
Originally posted by: Specop 007
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*

No crickets, spot on truth. But our elected leaders will ignore any input from others because damnit, THIS time it will work! And our citizens in this country are too damn stupid to care as long as the Community Leader promises to take care of them.

I also believe that calling Obama a "Communist" is stupid and inaccurate, so don't get too excited...
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,890
55,155
136
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*

What would you want anyone to say? What Putin said was a mixture of the obvious and the retarded. We shouldn't have blind faith in the state's omnipotence? Thanks for the news flash, Vladimir. That military spending is a shitty way to use your resources in economic terms? Once again, blindingly obvious and not worth commenting on.

As for his Ron Paul-esque comments on the economy, the things he says are so generalized that they are near worthless. 'We should get rid of the bad assets', ' we should have personal responsibility', 'we need to address the root cause'. Wheeeeee. It's just econo-babble coming from a politician. Moreover his flaws are directly relevant, as the general thrust of his statements are in direct contradiction with a large number of his own policies, which makes you think that he doesn't even believe the bullshit he's spewing.

At least in my case the crickets were from contempt.
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*

What would you want anyone to say? What Putin said was a mixture of the obvious and the retarded. We shouldn't have blind faith in the state's omnipotence? Thanks for the news flash, Vladimir. That military spending is a shitty way to use your resources in economic terms? Once again, blindingly obvious and not worth commenting on.

As for his Ron Paul-esque comments on the economy, the things he says are so generalized that they are near worthless. 'We should get rid of the bad assets', ' we should have personal responsibility', 'we need to address the root cause'. Wheeeeee. It's just econo-babble coming from a politician. Moreover his flaws are directly relevant, as the general thrust of his statements are in direct contradiction with a large number of his own policies, which makes you think that he doesn't even believe the bullshit he's spewing.

At least in my case the crickets were from contempt.
I believe Putin's statement regarding "root cause" is perhaps the most profound. I also believe that none of the recent actions taken by our own government -- TARP, bailouts, "stimulus," etc -- address the real "root causes" of our problems.
 

BansheeX

Senior member
Sep 10, 2007
348
0
0
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: K3N
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: K3N
Putin speaking against socialism? MY ASS! Putin nationalized 50.01% of their largest company, Gazprom, which is about as socialist as you can get. As a result of nationalizing gazprom, the russian standards of living and amount of industries rised dramatically.

Obama will nationalize all failing industries and he will run them the way the Democratic part has run Fannie May and Freddie Mac.

Fannie May and Freddie Mac were good organizations until they were privatized in 1968 under Nixon.

Free Market Touter: But, but, THATS NOT FREE MARKET!!

lol

Yeah that's the free market and what Obama is proposing isn't socialism.


Um, epic fail. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are government sponsored enterprises. Despite being "privately managed" and having "private shareholders," there was always widespread belief that mortgages handled by these corporations were implicitly backed by the U.S. taxpayer, a belief that has been ratified in recent events.

And really, these creations were very socialist in concept. Originally created to make loans to low income families. Constantly pressured by politicians (mostly Democrats) to do so. There is this weird, inexplicable idea surrounding bored academic circles that overtaxed depreciating assets are big revenue generators, and are in all ways to all people superior to renting, and that it should be the duty of the government to do everything in its power to "make all Americans homeowners." It sounds well-meaning, but it's just nonsense from self-important nitwits who think it's their job to grease the market because we're all a bunch of dumb, neglected cattle.

And if you want to blame a lack of regulation, you better start researching some of the strategic contributions and conflicts of interest that were going on between them and our supposed regulatory committees.
 

Mardeth

Platinum Member
Jul 24, 2002
2,608
0
0
Originally posted by: palehorse

I believe Putin's statement regarding "root cause" is perhaps the most profound. I also believe that none of the recent actions taken by our own government -- TARP, bailouts, "stimulus," etc -- address the real "root causes" of our problems.

Which are?



And you cant say that socialism doesnt work, because it does (hint: scandinavia). The question is, DOES IT WORK FOR YOU?
 

GTKeeper

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2005
1,118
0
0
Originally posted by: winnar111
Putin would be a hell of a better President than Zero. Can we trade?

Go move to Russia you fucking troll and see how great life under a 'great' president (who is not named Putin btw) is. Then write us a letter on how things SHOULD be done in the US.

You put American patriotism to shame.
 

GTKeeper

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2005
1,118
0
0
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: palehorse
Whatever Putin's background and flaws -- or those of the OP -- that doesn't change the fact that Putin was absolutely correct in everything he was quoted as saying in the OP.

*crickets*

Putin has always been popular with the people because he always says the right thing, which was exactly what they wanted to hear. Lets re-visit this statement when Russia defaults again like they did in 1998. They have a good chance at doing that.
 

Atreus21

Lifer
Aug 21, 2007
12,001
571
126
Originally posted by: Socio
Perhaps we are really heading towards Facism, not Socialism;

Facism Checklist

The 14 characteristics are:


1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism -- Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights -- Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to 'look the other way' or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause -- The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic, or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

4. Supremacy of the Military -- Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.

5. Rampant Sexism -- The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation and national policy.

6. Controlled Mass Media -- Sometimes the media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or through sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in wartime, is very common.

7. Obsession with National Security -- Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined -- Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions.

9. Corporate Power is Protected -- The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed -- Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely or are severely suppressed.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts -- Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free-expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment -- Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses, and even forego civil liberties, in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption -- Fascist regimes are almost always governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions, and who use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.

14. Fraudulent Elections -- Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against (or even the assassination of) opposition candidates, the use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and the manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

Looks like we have or are filling that list already, pretty scary stuff!

So someone took the laundry list of what they hated about Bush, labeled it a checklist to fascism, and posted it. Brilliance.

Patriotism and love of country is not fascism. Opposition to abortion and same-sex marriage legislation is not sexism. Also, something tells me that if Gore had won in 2000 in Bush v. Gore, number 14 wouldn't exist.
 

TheSlamma

Diamond Member
Sep 6, 2005
7,625
5
81
What.. did he warn that communism is better?

He's the one I always think we should turn to for advice.
 

Nemesis 1

Lifer
Dec 30, 2006
11,366
2
0
In the same thinking as Putin. I will say that everyone here . Without exception will all agree on one thing , A First. That Two party was in its concept designed to fail . The 2 party systen is a century old conspirecy to get world control . Everone here will understand that very soon.
 

Nemesis 1

Lifer
Dec 30, 2006
11,366
2
0
You guys sit here debating if we should put money into the military complex. To stimilate the economy.

To be honest I am beside myself,about this. It stresses me greatly. I am of average or below intelligence. Anyone who prescribes to the idea that building a Economy based on ARMS Sales. Is lower on the life scale than that of an ape. Especially under the guize of Democracy. I seriously hope that you are very young or not Americans,

What PART OF THESE WORDS DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND.

Those who live by the sword shall die by it.


What part above don't you believe or understand. Because its as plainly written as it could possiably have been . No evil lawyer mombo jumbo. Common Words that can't not be denied.
 

JDub02

Diamond Member
Sep 27, 2002
6,209
1
0
I never thought I would agree with Putin, but I find myself in that situation. It really is impossible to borrow and spend your way out of a spending problem.
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
Originally posted by: Mardeth
Originally posted by: palehorse

I believe Putin's statement regarding "root cause" is perhaps the most profound. I also believe that none of the recent actions taken by our own government -- TARP, bailouts, "stimulus," etc -- address the real "root causes" of our problems.

Which are?

And you cant say that socialism doesnt work, because it does (hint: Scandinavia). The question is, DOES IT WORK FOR YOU?

no, the real question is: WOULD IT WORK FOR 330+ MILLION PEOPLE?

Scandinavia has roughly 20 million people...

The Myth of the Scandinavian Model
Excerpt:
However, despite Bruegel, distorted academic studies and the European media?s praise, the efficiency of the major Scandinavian economies is a myth. The Swedish and Finnish welfare states have been going through a long period of decline. In the early 1990s they were virtually bankrupt. Between 1990 and 1995 unemployment increased five-fold. The Scandinavian countries have not been able to recover.

55-60% tax rates, absolutely no job creation, and an unmotivated workforce!? no fucking thank you...

Lastly, I would say that the "root causes" of our current economic mess are a complete lack of proper regulations, oversight, attribution, and accountability in our banking, real estate, and other investment sectors. I would also say that the new Stimulus bill fails to adequately address ANY of those issues...
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,890
55,155
136
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: Mardeth

Which are?

And you cant say that socialism doesnt work, because it does (hint: Scandinavia). The question is, DOES IT WORK FOR YOU?

no, the real question is: WOULD IT WORK FOR 330+ MILLION PEOPLE?

Scandinavia has roughly 20 million people...

The Myth of the Scandinavian Model
Excerpt:
However, despite Bruegel, distorted academic studies and the European media?s praise, the efficiency of the major Scandinavian economies is a myth. The Swedish and Finnish welfare states have been going through a long period of decline. In the early 1990s they were virtually bankrupt. Between 1990 and 1995 unemployment increased five-fold. The Scandinavian countries have not been able to recover.

55-60% tax rates, absolutely no job creation, and an unmotivated workforce!? no fucking thank you...

Thanks for the link to an conservative blog. Sweden had a housing bubble in the 1990s that was quite similar to what we have today. And as we're finding out today, yeap... that leads to a recession and money problems.

Contrary to that blog's ridiculous assertions, the real GDP growth in evil socialist 'unmotivated workforce' Sweden has averaged 3% this decade. The real GDP growth in capitalist utopia, low regulation, corporate tax cutting, *growing housing bubble* United States during the decade up to this point was...a colossal 3.1%. %. The 'zero job creation' evil socialist state of Sweden had an unemployment rate averaging all of 2% higher than the capitalist utopia of the United States. (oh, and by the end of 2008 the difference in rates was a whopping 0.4%, and actually by the end of the year Capitalist Paradise US unemployment had exceeded No Job Creating Sweden's... oops!) and yes all the numbers are adjusted to use the same standard) They manage to do all this and give their citizens a considerably higher standard of living than one of the largest, most resource rich countries on the planet.

Oh, and Ireland's gangbusters growth as shown in those charts the blog links... guess what it's looking like that was financed by? Yes, our good old friend the housing bubble. Ireland's fabulous economy as shown by those charts is now in danger of complete systemic collapse.

I'm sure it's just the damn commie European media along with their friends in academia trying to make socialism look good though, just like the blog says!
 

palehorse

Lifer
Dec 21, 2005
11,521
0
76
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: Mardeth

Which are?

And you cant say that socialism doesnt work, because it does (hint: Scandinavia). The question is, DOES IT WORK FOR YOU?

no, the real question is: WOULD IT WORK FOR 330+ MILLION PEOPLE?

Scandinavia has roughly 20 million people...

The Myth of the Scandinavian Model
Excerpt:
However, despite Bruegel, distorted academic studies and the European media?s praise, the efficiency of the major Scandinavian economies is a myth. The Swedish and Finnish welfare states have been going through a long period of decline. In the early 1990s they were virtually bankrupt. Between 1990 and 1995 unemployment increased five-fold. The Scandinavian countries have not been able to recover.

55-60% tax rates, absolutely no job creation, and an unmotivated workforce!? no fucking thank you...

Thanks for the link to an conservative blog. Sweden had a housing bubble in the 1990s that was quite similar to what we have today. And as we're finding out today, yeap... that leads to a recession and money problems.

Contrary to that blog's ridiculous assertions, the real GDP growth in evil socialist 'unmotivated workforce' Sweden has averaged 3% this decade. The real GDP growth in capitalist utopia, low regulation, corporate tax cutting, *growing housing bubble* United States during the decade up to this point was...a colossal 3.1%. %. The 'zero job creation' evil socialist state of Sweden had an unemployment rate averaging all of 2% higher than the capitalist utopia of the United States. (oh, and by the end of 2008 the difference in rates was a whopping 0.4%, and actually by the end of the year Capitalist Paradise US unemployment had exceeded No Job Creating Sweden's... oops!) and yes all the numbers are adjusted to use the same standard) They manage to do all this and give their citizens a considerably higher standard of living than one of the largest, most resource rich countries on the planet.

Oh, and Ireland's gangbusters growth as shown in those charts the blog links... guess what it's looking like that was financed by? Yes, our good old friend the housing bubble. Ireland's fabulous economy as shown by those charts is now in danger of complete systemic collapse.

I'm sure it's just the damn commie European media along with their friends in academia trying to make socialism look good though, just like the blog says!
So 55-60% taxation doesn't bother you?

You also believe that a nation of 330+ million people could do the same?

interesting...
 

Born2bwire

Diamond Member
Oct 28, 2005
9,840
6
71
Originally posted by: Nemesis 1
You guys sit here debating if we should put money into the military complex. To stimilate the economy.

To be honest I am beside myself,about this. It stresses me greatly. I am of average or below intelligence. Anyone who prescribes to the idea that building a Economy based on ARMS Sales. Is lower on the life scale than that of an ape. Especially under the guize of Democracy. I seriously hope that you are very young or not Americans,

What PART OF THESE WORDS DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND.

Those who live by the sword shall die by it.


What part above don't you believe or understand. Because its as plainly written as it could possiably have been . No evil lawyer mombo jumbo. Common Words that can't not be denied.

I don't think you quite understand just how much money we get from selling a fighter jet. Hell, if anything, the USSR shows us that you can achieve a nice balance of trade by exporting Kalashnikovs.
 

daniel49

Diamond Member
Jan 8, 2005
4,814
0
71
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Guys, it's Winnar. He knows the shit he is saying is stupid, he just doesn't care because he's probably about 12 years old. Hopefully someone will take notice of this sooner rather than later and actually ban him.


Yes ban all descent.....

First, learn how to spell dissent, secondly read the rest of my post that you neglected to bold.

Then again, you're Budmantom. This means that you're one of the stupidest people that contribute to these forums. (either that, or you're a top notch troll)

You have a great way to express your point of view, we will not become a socialist or communist nation and everyone that disagrees should be silenced or banned.

By the way can any of you leftists make a point w/o personal attacks?

I know that anytime you disagree the other person is stupid and a troll and must be banned.

They call it the fairness doctrine:laugh:
 

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,890
55,155
136
Originally posted by: palehorse
Originally posted by: eskimospy

Thanks for the link to an conservative blog. Sweden had a housing bubble in the 1990s that was quite similar to what we have today. And as we're finding out today, yeap... that leads to a recession and money problems.

Contrary to that blog's ridiculous assertions, the real GDP growth in evil socialist 'unmotivated workforce' Sweden has averaged 3% this decade. The real GDP growth in capitalist utopia, low regulation, corporate tax cutting, *growing housing bubble* United States during the decade up to this point was...a colossal 3.1%. %. The 'zero job creation' evil socialist state of Sweden had an unemployment rate averaging all of 2% higher than the capitalist utopia of the United States. (oh, and by the end of 2008 the difference in rates was a whopping 0.4%, and actually by the end of the year Capitalist Paradise US unemployment had exceeded No Job Creating Sweden's... oops!) and yes all the numbers are adjusted to use the same standard) They manage to do all this and give their citizens a considerably higher standard of living than one of the largest, most resource rich countries on the planet.

Oh, and Ireland's gangbusters growth as shown in those charts the blog links... guess what it's looking like that was financed by? Yes, our good old friend the housing bubble. Ireland's fabulous economy as shown by those charts is now in danger of complete systemic collapse.

I'm sure it's just the damn commie European media along with their friends in academia trying to make socialism look good though, just like the blog says!
So 55-60% taxation doesn't bother you?

You also believe that a nation of 330+ million people could do the same?

interesting...

What do you think is interesting about it? The blog post that you quoted seems to be manifestly false unless you have some sort of other evidence to back it up. Furthermore, the purpose of any economic system is to further the present and future prosperity of the citizens that operate under it. Sweden's system appears to protect the present and future prosperity better than ours does. If that involved a million percent taxation I couldn't care less, as the end goal of a good life is what matters.
 

AlienCraft

Lifer
Nov 23, 2002
10,539
0
0
Originally posted by: Budmantom
Originally posted by: eskimospy
Guys, it's Winnar. He knows the shit he is saying is stupid, he just doesn't care because he's probably about 12 years old. Hopefully someone will take notice of this sooner rather than later and actually ban him.


Yes ban all descent.....
Yes do that. Because banning Descent is not banning Dissent. And that way, no one can get lower than anyone else and still disagree. :confused: :D :disgust: