Public employee benefits

[Ferocious]

Overall, 90% of public employees enjoy a defined-benefit pension, compared with only 20% (and falling) of the private work force............

many employees in the private sector will get hit with a double whammy: while their pensions erode, increasingly they will be hit with cuts in government services and forced to pay higher taxes to cover the pensions of public employees, the kind they can only dream about.

Many who work for state or local governments may retire in their 40s and collect a pension as well as receive subsidized health care.

I would think an improved defined contribution plan would allow the government to keep attracting the same caliber of employees it does now...with much less 'risk' to Joe taxpayer later. Also I have a MAJOR problem with subsidizing a healthcare benefit that I will never get to enjoy myself.

Time article

 

[tommywishbone]

I think any civil service job is the modern day equavilent of getting hired by General Motors or AT&T back in the day. Once you're hired it's almost impossible to get fired and if you stick around and do your 20 years, you will retire with a million bucks (full pay & insurance for life).

Arnold is on to the civil service scheme here in California and is trying to break it up, but the unions are too big and have way too much money. It's totally out of control and costing 100's of billions. Absurd.

 

[IronWing]

There are trade offs. State and local public sector jobs tend to pay less than private sector jobs requiring the same education/skill/experience, often a lot less. Also, not all juristictions offer great benefits. California is probably at the high end. Other states offer 401k type benefits with no defined benefit component.

On the health care benefits again it varies widely. Some states pay close to 100% of health premiums while other states cover very little. For example the State of Wyoming's state employee health plan spiraled down a couple years ago. The premiums paid by workers rose so fast that younger, healthier workers could find cheaper plans on thier own and pulled out of the pool. This led to higher costs within the plan forcing older, healthy workers to so the same, collapsing the plan. The obvious solution for both private sector and public sector employees is nationalized health insurance.

As far as private sector employees seeing their pensions erode, that is what unions and lobbying are for. Under current law, corporations can raid or under fund their pension plans. This needs to be made a criminal act.

Your poll needs another option: Make private plans more like the better public plans.

 

[fjord]

All hard-working americans should have defined benefits (public and private). The only sane choice is to make it part of their compensation. Salary + benefits + pension system = Full compensation.

Civil service benefits are only slightly below average, and certainly nothing to point to as an ideal. The million dollar myth is an old one. I've seen University benefits packages that are closer to reasonably good, but by no means the best available.

IMO there should be a minimum standard of set benefits--and no employer (private or public) should be allowed to offer less than that.

Its unamerican and unpatriotic to try and screw hard-working americans, ala Arnold.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Originally posted by: Ferocious
I would think an improved defined contribution plan would allow the government to keep attracting the same caliber of employees it does now...with much less 'risk' to Joe taxpayer later. Also I have a MAJOR problem with subsidizing a healthcare benefit that I will never get to enjoy myself.

Time article

This is the same calibre of employee that is bankrupting the country and makes you wait in line at the DMV for six hours to renew your license. I don't think it would be hard to find more like that. Go cruise the fast food joints.

Originally posted by: fjord
All hard-working americans should have defined benefits (public and private). The only sane choice is to make it part of their compensation. Salary + benefits + pension system = Full compensation.

Civil service benefits are only slightly below average, and certainly nothing to point to as an ideal. The million dollar myth is an old one. I've seen University benefits packages that are closer to reasonably good, but by no means the best available.

IMO there should be a minimum standard of set benefits--and no employer (private or public) should be allowed to offer less than that.

Its unamerican and unpatriotic to try and screw hard-working americans, ala Arnold.

All Americans should have benefits but the reality is that most small business' simply can't afford it. My business can barely afford to provide even the most basic of health care coverage much less a pension or retirement program. If you forced a benefits package on him he'd probably just close up shop and go play the bond market. Why be open for biz if you can't make money? An idea like that would be a death nail to many small business owners.

Pensions are a thing of the past my friend. So is lifetime employment with the same company. Employees have to take care of themselves now. In the end it's a good thing because a person who dilligently contributes to a 401K, Roth or some other retirement plan will do much better in the long run.

 

[IronWing]

Originally posted by: Whoozyerdaddy

Originally posted by: Ferocious
I would think an improved defined contribution plan would allow the government to keep attracting the same caliber of employees it does now...with much less 'risk' to Joe taxpayer later. Also I have a MAJOR problem with subsidizing a healthcare benefit that I will never get to enjoy myself.

Time article

This is the same calibre of employee that is bankrupting the country and makes you wait in line at the DMV for six hours to renew your license. I don't think it would be hard to find more like that. Go cruise the fast food joints.

Originally posted by: fjord
All hard-working americans should have defined benefits (public and private). The only sane choice is to make it part of their compensation. Salary + benefits + pension system = Full compensation.

Civil service benefits are only slightly below average, and certainly nothing to point to as an ideal. The million dollar myth is an old one. I've seen University benefits packages that are closer to reasonably good, but by no means the best available.

IMO there should be a minimum standard of set benefits--and no employer (private or public) should be allowed to offer less than that.

Its unamerican and unpatriotic to try and screw hard-working americans, ala Arnold.

All Americans should have benefits but the reality is that most small business' simply can't afford it. My business can barely afford to provide even the most basic of health care coverage much less a pension or retirement program. If you forced a benefits package on him he'd probably just close up shop and go play the bond market. Why be open for biz if you can't make money? An idea like that would be a death nail to many small business owners.

Pensions are a thing of the past my friend. So is lifetime employment with the same company. Employees have to take care of themselves now. In the end it's a good thing because a person who dilligently contributes to a 401K, Roth or some other retirement plan will do much better in the long run.

Public employees aren't bankrupting the country. Elected officials are.

Your point about small business and healthcare is exactly why we need taxpayer funded national health insurance. It takes the burden off business and levels the playing field in terms of ability ot attract/retain employees.

I agree with your statement about defined benefit pensions, they are on the way out. This makes retaining the Social Security program vital.

 

[rudder]

Originally posted by: tommywishbone
I think any civil service job is the modern day equavilent of getting hired by General Motors or AT&T back in the day. Once you're hired it's almost impossible to get fired and if you stick around and do your 20 years, you will retire with a million bucks (full pay & insurance for life).

Probably more like 30 years needed to retire with full benefits. No full paymore like 50%, and no free health insurance. Thats Tennessee state government anyway.

Other states and the federal government may be different.