PSU requirements

[easytimes]

I'm in the process of building my list of parts and pieces to build a Core 2 Duo powered machine to replace my wife's 8+ year old still functioning rattle trap. I have most of the parts list down solid, but the power supply is tugging at me... mostly from my level of inexperience.

This is my first adventure into the realm of scratch building, rather than buying a brand name and replacing/upgrading over a number of years, to keep things going. I've had some help from a friend, in another state, but I fear I am wearing him out with all my questions. I'm from a fairly technical and detail oriented background, but I don't know all the standards talk, when it comes to computing hardware.

I see these revision numbers for the PSU's and I'm not sure if I have to shoot for one or another of them. My friend suggested a Silencer 470 ATX, from PC Power & Cooling. I'm not sure if he specifically researched for this particular build, or chose it based on quality, from past experience. It looks like it will work... and the choice seems to be good, since this machine will be located in a living room, where noise levels need to be somewhat subdued, as much as possible.

Any and all advice is appreciated,

 

[jonnyGURU]

What are the complete system specs of this built to be?

 

[easytimes]

Thanks jonnyGURU
Since this one is for the wife, I plan to use an Abit AB9 board, with either the E6400 or E6300 processors. I'm thinking to go with 1 gig of memory and an ATI 1300 256 mb vid card. A 250 gig HDD should be all she will ever need. I'll just use the integrated sound and Ethernet. A single DVD burner will just about cover her setup. It will never be overclocked, I can assure you.

I just want hers to be strong enough to take up some slack, when I'm building my machine or having problems with my present computer, before I build one for myself. I would also like it to be advanced enough to last as long as the present box has. By the way, my machine is nearing 6 years. Hopefully, I can get at least that much with these new ones.

 

[orangat]

PC power has a very good reputation but its quite pricey. The silencer line is its budget line but its certainly good enough. Since you are building a barebones pc, there are more affordable choices open to you.

 

[happy medium]

Easytimes,This 350 watt, 26 amp 12 volt rail, enermax power supply has served my overclocked system faithfully. I,m sure my system pulls more watts than yours. Can't beat it for $56.00. ----http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817103455

edit: heres a good place to check how many watts your system pulls---http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

 

[jonnyGURU]

Ok. So with a single X1300 card and a Conroe (which is more efficient) you shouldn't need much juice at all. The only thing you need to make sure of is that the PSU you get has the 8-pin EPS12V connector as many Conroe compatible boards need this connector. So for under $100 you can get something solid and quiet, efficient, with APFC and with plenty of power....

http://www.thenerds.net/index.php?page=productpage&affid=8&pn=ULT31843

The pic is wrong, but this unit comes in a slick black anodized housing and has UV "FlexForce" cables.

http://www.sundialmicro.com/SilverStone-Power-500Watt-sstst50ef_1723_640.html

This PSU has more than enough power and has 80% plus efficiency! Cables aren't sleeved or anything, though.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817388003

This unit is manufactured by SevenTeam, is all top notch components and fairly efficient.

http://www.axiontech.com/prdt.php******=FG&item=75147

EDIT: Anandtech doesn't like my Axiontech link, so just go there and search for an AMS Mercury 550W. It has a pair of 80MM fans, but it's very quiet.

 

[happy medium]

Mr. GURU you just taught me something. I never knew that a special connnector was needed for a conroe system. Does that mean anyone with a socket 378,775,and other older boards have to upgrade there power supplies as well as there boards?

edit : did some research any 20/24 pin power supply will power a conroe system

 

[easytimes]

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
Ok. So with a single X1300 card and a Conroe (which is more efficient) you shouldn't need much juice at all. The only thing you need to make sure of is that the PSU you get has the 8-pin EPS12V connector as many Conroe compatible boards need this connector. So for under $100 you can get something solid and quiet, efficient, with APFC and with plenty of power....

God, I love tech talk, especially when it's not encumbered with all sorts of jargon that freaks out my old and very slow brain, and sends me to a computer-talk glossary in a panic. Being detail oriented as I am, I like knowing the specific differences, in physical terms, too... I thank you so much for that inclusion.

I figured with all the efficiency talk wrapped around Conroe, I might not need quite as much power. But when you talk 6 and 8 year lifespans, who knows what will be needed, then? Too much PSU (energy availability) usually winds up being just right, when you get old. Believe me, I know what I'm talkin' about, here.

Oops, I just looked at the drawing, and don't see the 8-pin EPS12V connector on the PC Power Silencer. Guess my search continues... but with something to look for, anyways.
Thanks to everyone... man... when you guys see specs, you really jump.

 

[happy medium]

Originally posted by: DLeRium

Originally posted by: movingincircles
would a simple Smartpower 2.0 350W Antec do for an ATX conroe system?

Yes, but what is it with people skimping on power supplies? Wattage wise, you're fine. You need to ensure the rails are enough for today's graphics cards. I think the amperage is fine too, but the reliability and noise and also most importantly voltage regulation comes into question. I know that Antec SP does not rank the best in voltage regulation. TruePower does an insanely good job though, about as good as Seasonic @ 1 - 2% only.

answer your question? With a 26 amp 12v rail you could upgrade your video card with a 7900gt. With the cheap, efficient, 56 dollar enermax 350 I suggested. Don't get what you don't need is what i'm saying

 

[orangat]

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
Ok. So with a single X1300 card and a Conroe (which is more efficient) you shouldn't need much juice at all. The only thing you need to make sure of is that the PSU you get has the 8-pin EPS12V connector as many Conroe compatible boards need this connector. So for under $100 you can get something solid and quiet, efficient, with APFC and with plenty of power....
.........

Is getting a epv12v psu really necessary? Wouldn't a quality $50 unit with a 4->8pin connector do instead. I doubt the 8pin socket is anything special.

 

[happy medium]

Originally posted by: orangat

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
Ok. So with a single X1300 card and a Conroe (which is more efficient) you shouldn't need much juice at all. The only thing you need to make sure of is that the PSU you get has the 8-pin EPS12V connector as many Conroe compatible boards need this connector. So for under $100 you can get something solid and quiet, efficient, with APFC and with plenty of power....
.........

Is getting a epv12v psu really necessary? Wouldn't a quality $50 unit with a 4->8pin connector do instead. I doubt the 8pin socket is anything special.

I totally agree.

 

[easytimes]

Kinda hard to find one that lists an 8 pin connector of any kind, as I'm finding, now. Lots of PSU's list as EPS12V, but they don't mention such a critter in their repertoire of connections. I must be missing something, here. When I go to put all of this together, I won't have a lot of experience matching pins and connectors. I'm old, but I can learn... and that canoworms avatar is part of my aura... believe that. Me and old Murphy have been doing business for many years, now. It's why I'm so detail oriented.

 

[jonnyGURU]

Originally posted by: happy medium

Originally posted by: orangat

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
Ok. So with a single X1300 card and a Conroe (which is more efficient) you shouldn't need much juice at all. The only thing you need to make sure of is that the PSU you get has the 8-pin EPS12V connector as many Conroe compatible boards need this connector. So for under $100 you can get something solid and quiet, efficient, with APFC and with plenty of power....
.........

Is getting a epv12v psu really necessary? Wouldn't a quality $50 unit with a 4->8pin connector do instead. I doubt the 8pin socket is anything special.

I totally agree.

Agree all you want.

The motherboard manuals I've read (Intel, MSI, etc.) specifically state not to use an adapter for the 4-pin to accomodate the 8-pin socket. Even Hiper's website says not to use their Type-R PSU with an 8-pin EPS+12V board, and it's not like they're trying to sell you a new PSU with an 8-pin on it. They don't have a PSU with an 8-pin EPS+12V connector.

Is it the resistance of the adapter and trying to push twice the juice through half as many wires? Don't know. But I would think if there were manufacturers of motherboards and power supplies out there telling you not to use a 4-pin to 8-pin adapter, I think it deserves more consideration than just a couple opinions on a tech support forum.

 

[jonnyGURU]

Originally posted by: easytimes
Kinda hard to find one that lists an 8 pin connector of any kind, as I'm finding, now. Lots of PSU's list as EPS12V, but they don't mention such a critter in their repertoire of connections. I must be missing something, here. When I go to put all of this together, I won't have a lot of experience matching pins and connectors. I'm old, but I can learn... and that canoworms avatar is part of my aura... believe that. Me and old Murphy have been doing business for many years, now. It's why I'm so detail oriented.

I gave you a list of four PSU's with 8-pin connectors and you're still searching?

MOST power supplies have 8-pin connectors and have for years. Usually they're in the form of an 8-pin that splits into two fours. Unless you're trying to go cheap and find something for under $50. That's going to be tough because typically power supplies that are "lower end" don't have such a connector for the same reason they don't have PCI-e connectors: The PSU doesn't have enough power to juice such peripherals in the first place, so why set yourself up for failure?

If you want something cheaper than what I listed, there's also this unit:

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=PS-E5140GH&c=fr

$56 for a 400W Enhance. Less juice on the 12V rails than the 500W Enhance, but same efficiency, APFC, compact size, etc.

 

[easytimes]

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
I gave you a list of four PSU's with 8-pin connectors and you're still searching?

Nope, not searching at all. I just went to those websites and saw nothing that mentioned an 8 pin connector. It's was my point of reference.

I am VERY detail oriented, and if I see two 4 pin connectors, I don't take that as an 8 pin connector. I don't believe I saw anything that said EPS12V, except in the titling of the various PSU's.

Just to explain, I've done a few things with computers, since 1995, but this is brand new to me. Don't mean to be picky or overly anal, but this is all new stuff to me. I guess building a Core 2 Duo driven box is pretty new to a lot of folks at this point... but I'm even farther behind the curve than everybody here, I would imagine.

 

[jonnyGURU]

The Ultra on the Nerds I listed lists that PSU has an "8 pin EPS"

The Masscool listing at Newegg lists a "12V (8 pin)"

The AMS at Axiontech lists "24 + 8 pin & 6 pin."

The Silverstone at Sundialmicro doesn't have much detail. So I looked it up on Silverstone's site. It seems it does not have an 8-pin, but rather a 4-pin to 8-pin adapter.

I just reviewed the 400W Enhance in my last post and I know for a fact that has an 8-pin and the listing at eWiz confirms that by stating "8-pin CPU VR power connector."

You're just looking for an "8 pin." Neg the extra verbiage like "EPS" and it might be easier to find. Power supplies only have one 8-pin connector and it's the 2x4 12V connector for CPU power called the "EPS+12V."

Good luck!

 

[easytimes]

Disregard my last comments... I missed that one at Newegg... the one at SunDial was the one I was thinking about. I've looked at so many specs, my contacts are slipping.
THANKS!!!

Originally posted by: easytimes

Originally posted by: jonnyGURU
I gave you a list of four PSU's with 8-pin connectors and you're still searching?

Nope, not searching at all. I just went to those websites and saw nothing that mentioned an 8 pin connector. It's was my point of reference.

I am VERY detail oriented, and if I see two 4 pin connectors, I don't take that as an 8 pin connector. I don't believe I saw anything that said EPS12V, except in the titling of the various PSU's.

Just to explain, I've done a few things with computers, since 1995, but this is brand new to me. Don't mean to be picky or overly anal, but this is all new stuff to me. I guess building a Core 2 Duo driven box is pretty new to a lot of folks at this point... but I'm even farther behind the curve than everybody here, I would imagine.

 

[GalvanizedYankee]

easytimes, do a little reading here ...Mmmkay.
Just scroll down the page a bit.

I'm sure the guy recommending pcp&c Silencer(built by Seasonic) will put his blog up,
with even better info & testing


Personally, I'd go with the Enhance ENP-5140GH.

...Galvanized

 

[easytimes]

Originally posted by: GalvanizedYankee
easytimes, do a little reading here ...Mmmkay.
Just scroll down the page a bit.

Yep, I see what you mean... I'm not crazy about the aesthetics, because I'm a maintenance freak... or at least the prevention of maintenance problems. Comes from 37 years in that industry. I see aesthetics as being like coffee stains in the drop down trays on an airplane. If they don't wipe them, what else do they shortcut??? jet engine maintenance? This is no airplane, but a power supply is one thing you don't want to drop, in the long life of a computer, if it's possible. Can I get an AMEN?!

Originally posted by: GalvanizedYankee
I'm sure the guy recommending pcp&c Silencer(built by Seasonic) will put his blog up,
with even better info & testing

Nope, he's just someone who volunteered to assist me a little, with my choices... I have no problems with anything he says. I have been with him on a boat maintenance forum for some time, now. He bends over backwards to help anyone he can. He's computer savvy, but more so in the functionality line than the building line, although he has built a few of his own. Boat maintenance makes us a little anal about such things... you don't walk home from a sinking boat, after all.

The Enhance sounds like a great PSU, but those unsleeved lines are a little concerning, not to mention the low rating on functionality. I bet they sleeve PSU lines for a reason... like some of the fly-by-wire cables on the F-16's. I want this thing hang in there for the long haul, and the few dollars more I might spend for sleeved cables, might mean they did something else inside to "enhance" the longevity of the unit. I certainly can't bad mouth the Enhance... I don't know that much. I would prefer to see more attention to details... after all, that's my big thing.

 

[jonnyGURU]

The low functionality score has nothing to do with the quality or longeity of the unit. There's only one PCI-e connector, but I wouldn't use the unit with SLI (or any other unit of that capability.) The cables are not sleeved and there are no additional niceties like modular connectors, fan controllers, fan only, etc. A 7.5 score is not that bad.

 

[GalvanizedYankee]

Sleeving is just window dressing

Zippy/Emacs server SMPS that are good for ten years service are unsleeved.
Why? Because it makes it easy to use a clamp meter to check current draw.


...Galvanized

 

[easytimes]

Okay, I get it. I told you I was detail oriented. However, I just found the ULT31843 for $83... is it good enough to cover the price difference? It was in the first tier of recommendations, and one I didn't check for an 8 pin connector.

I figured jonnyGURU mentioned those, first, for a reason. Maybe I'm too focused on little stuff. I'm just taking it all in and trying to learn something, as I go.

 

[Praxis1452]

For what your running. The PSU that jonnyguru reviewed the enhance uh... forgot the part number it's great. Sleeved cables are mainly for "aesthetics" . They do look much nicer. Makes things cleaner too. For $56 doesn't seem to be able to be beat.