Protest to end the Federal Reserve tomorrow (11/22)

Evander

Golden Member
Jun 18, 2001
1,159
0
76
Be sure to attend if you leave nearby, check the list of cities here:
http://www.endthefed.us/

Federal Reserve Roundup Post:

Democratic Congressman D. Kucinich: Repeal the Fed, Impeach the Prez:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...o0luBs&feature=related

Nevada GOP platform: "We support the repeal of the Federal Reserve Act":
http://www.nevadagop.org/About...ult.aspx?SectionId=776

Nader VP Matt Gonzalez says abolish the fed:
http://www.vanityfair.com/onli...ing-against-obama.html

Idaho GOP wants to abolish Federal Reserve:
http://redstaterebels.typepad....9/idaho-gop-wants.html

Steve Forbes calls for drastic reduction of Fed:
http://digg.com/business_finan...ing_of_Federal_Reserve

Former Georgia congressman and 2008 Libertarian Presidential Candidate Bob Barr calls to end the Fed:
http://libertymaven.com/2008/0...-federal-reserve/1123/

Investor Jim Rogers call for end to Fed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwIncF3yrpQ

Peter Schiff blames the Fed on economic crisis:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Je0jARsDbjw

A phone call to the Fed:
http://digg.com/business_finan...hone_Call_To_The_Fed_3

Federal Reserve spokesman speaks out:
http://digg.com/business_finan...h_From_a_Fed_Spokesman

Fractional Reserve Banking versus Ayn Rand's Ethics:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWnhX2koVEc

Greenspan in 1966 blames the Fed's mismanaged policies for Great Depression:
http://www.321gold.com/fed/greenspan/1966.html

Whether or not you believe in any conspiracy theories, keep in mind that Federal Reserve policies reward the politician by allowing him to "give" his constituents more without increasing taxes, thus increasing his chance for reelection, but punish both the saver and the investor. Printing fiat currency causes inflation and savers are hit the hardest by this. Those who try to beat inflation become investors - they may try their hand in the stock market, but look how the Federal Reserve lending practices caused the price of stock to plummet in the recent economic crisis, nearly wiping out people's life savings. Inflation and mismanaged policies are felt by everyone and are reason enough to oppose the Federal Reserve.
"?A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have..."
-Thomas Jefferson

P.S.
Free Federal Reserve e-book:
http://www.joeplummer.com/meet_the_system.html
Beware the protest police:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeEsIm-V1ZA
 

scruffypup

Senior member
Feb 3, 2006
371
0
0
Personally I feel there is a lot of ignorance on what the Federal Reserve does for the United States and the positive that it provides to our economy and monetary system.

The Federal Reserve will not be wiped out due to the protests,... it won't even be an after thought. The Federal Reserve (or a system like it) is needed.

Anyways,... people like to find blame in everything. It is easy to point fingers and complain. It is hard to suggest a better way of doing things. Our country has become increasingly a bunch of whiners who cannot accept blame and like to point fingers.

The Federal Reserve tends to keep inflation in check and doesn't create it.
The Federal Reserve is not the reason for the "lending crisis" or the stock market downturn and had nothing to do with "wiping out life savings"
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,417
33,001
136
While I disagree w/ scruffypup's statements concerning the Fed's complicity in the current cluster, I still think the Fed is very much needed. However it needs to be run by folks who place pragmatism ahead of ideology. In other words, no more Chicago School hacks.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
Originally posted by: Evander

Greenspan in 1966 blames the Fed's mismanaged policies for Great Depression:
http://www.321gold.com/fed/greenspan/1966.html

I always like this one. People have yet to realize that the Fed acted in DEFENSE of gold backed currency in 1929+, which is what people blamed them for, causing the GD. Had they not done that we'd have likely felt the GD to a far lesser extent. That was the criticism.

Gotta love uneducated people.
 

IronWing

No Lifer
Jul 20, 2001
72,417
33,001
136
Originally posted by: miketheidiot
i should go to the counterprotest in Minneapolis.

Post video. I think dueling kill-the-Fed save-the-Fed rallies would be hilarious.
 

StageLeft

No Lifer
Sep 29, 2000
70,150
5
0
I'm sure a lot of people will be at this rally who barely know how to spell their own name. I wonder what meaning they can really add to the agenda?
 

Evander

Golden Member
Jun 18, 2001
1,159
0
76
Judging by most of the replies here I see that probably nobody even bothered to watch or read any sources I posted, despite the many links I provided and despite my attempt to show the Federal Reserve issue crosses party lines and crosses ideological and business beliefs. Nonetheless, I will attempt to address some of the concerns here, despite the fact that most will not listen or read more than 2 or 3 sentences before a short attention spans kick in and they go about wasting time on myspace or go directly into hurling more insults my way . So this information is for those few with a genuine interest in changing the status quo.

PART I: DID THE FED CAUSE THE SEPTEMBER COLLAPSE OR IS THIS SCAPEGOATING BY PIMPLY FACED YOUTUBE EDUCATED IDIOTS?
I guess this depends on whether or not you consider Steve Forbes to be a pimply faced youtube educated idiot. If you don't consider him so, why not watch this short 3 minute video clip of Steve Forbes explaining the meltdown:
http://thesaloon.net/blog/_arc...008/10/25/3947199.html
Hell I transcribed a few sentences for you that you can use for reference.
"I think it begins with our own central bank, the Federal Reserve, which 4 years ago created excess liquidity, created excess money, that created global excess liquidity, started the commodities boom and really destructively spilled over into the housing market, where everyone figured "why not let lending standards come down, after all housing prices always go up don't they?" So that started it. The Fed created the conditions for the bubble and everyone participated in it. It wasn't just banks and lenders, new players in the game, Wall Street participated too. You saw the same thing happen all over the world - package these things, spread them all over the place - securitization. So it became a global mania, a global bubble... We had two entities here, Freddy and Fanny... helped fuel this thing - underwrote a trillion dollars worth of less than prime mortgages"
And I guess it also depends on whether or not you consider Ron Paul to be a pimply faced youtube educated idiot, when he mirrored Forbes thoughts and wrote:
http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul494.html
"At least 90% of the cause for the financial crisis can be laid at the doorstep of the Federal Reserve. It is the manipulation of credit, the money supply, and interest rates that caused the various bubbles to form. Congress added fuel to the fire by various programs and institutions like the Community Reinvestment Act, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, FDIC, and HUD mandates, which were all backed up by aggressive court rulings."
So is it fair to blame the crisis COMPLETELY on the Fed? No, in fact here's a great little article demonstrating the American people have a part in the crisis by buying oversized houses and SUV's they didn't need:
http://www.delsquacho.com/blog...n-ourselves/index.html
But to be sure, the Fed and the government deserve a lion's share of the burden for dangling the carrot of cheap credit in front of the American consumer. Here is the opinion of Peter Schiff, president of EuroPacific Capital and Ron Paul's economic adviser during his 2008 campaign for the White House:
http://jglobal.blogspot.com/20...n-federal-reserve.html
"What few economic leaders have acknowledged is that the Federal Reserve itself is responsible for the real estate and credit bubbles, which are the source of our current troubles. By keeping interest rates too low for too long, the Fed ignited a speculative fever and engendered a disregard for risk management that pushed asset prices above rational levels. Should we blame the private sector for taking advantage of all the cheap credit, or the Federal Reserve for supplying it? If a kindergarten teacher passes out handfuls of Pixie Sticks, and then leaves her classroom unattended for several hours, should we blame the five year olds for the hysteria that ensues?"
Schiff, coincidentally, was the man of dead on predicted the September '08 meltdown well before it happened:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...C71D0CDFF9F38B&index=4
but perhaps he too, is a pimply faced youtube educated idiot.

PART II: UNEDUCATED IDIOTS!!! WHEN THE GREAT DEPRESSION HAPPENED, WE WERE ON THE GOLD STANDARD!!! THE FED IS NOT TO BLAME, AND GOLD IS FLAWED!!! OR IS IT...

I don't even need to type anything here, if you had just read SOME of Greenspan's essay from 1966 (this was back in the day before he became a fuckup who abandoned Ayn Rand's laissez-faire capitalism) you'll see exactly how the establishment of the Fed created a devastatingly harmful credit based currency in addition to the gold standard which was already in place. Said Greespan:
"Technically, we remained on the gold standard; individuals were still free to own gold, and gold continued to be used as bank reserves. But now, in addition to gold, credit extended by the Federal Reserve banks ("paper reserves") could serve as legal tender to pay depositors.

When business in the United States underwent a mild contraction in 1927, the Federal Reserve created more paper reserves in the hope of forestalling any possible bank reserve shortage. More disastrous, however, was the Federal Reserve's attempt to assist Great Britain who had been losing gold to us because the Bank of England refused to allow interest rates to rise when market forces dictated (it was politically unpalatable). The reasoning of the authorities involved was as follows: if the Federal Reserve pumped excessive paper reserves into American banks, interest rates in the United States would fall to a level comparable with those in Great Britain; this would act to stop Britain's gold loss and avoid the political embarrassment of having to raise interest rates. The "Fed" succeeded; it stopped the gold loss, but it nearly destroyed the economies of the world, in the process. The excess credit which the Fed pumped into the economy spilled over into the stock market-triggering a fantastic speculative boom. Belatedly, Federal Reserve officials attempted to sop up the excess reserves and finally succeeded in braking the boom. But it was too late: by 1929 the speculative imbalances had become so overwhelming that the attempt precipitated a sharp retrenching and a consequent demoralizing of business confidence. As a result, the American economy collapsed. Great Britain fared even worse, and rather than absorb the full consequences of her previous folly, she abandoned the gold standard completely in 1931, tearing asunder what remained of the fabric of confidence and inducing a world-wide series of bank failures. The world economies plunged into the Great Depression of the 1930's."

PART III: I AM A SHEEPLE. I'M STILL NOT CONVINCED ANYTHING IS WRONG, AND THINK THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM IS JUST FINE AND DANDY

By supporting the Federal Reserve, you are supporting fiat currency (paper money backed by nothing). Well, actually that's not quite true, it is backed by the government's ability to tax you. It is no coincidence that when the Federal Reserve was established in 1913, that same year the income tax was imposed upon us. Are you fine and dandy with paying the income tax or fine and dandy when paying hefty penalties for misunderstanding a monstrously complicated tax code or when an IRS agent gives you incorrect information that you trusted was correct but results in an audit? If you're confused about what our fiat currency, the US dollar, is backed by, take a look at these 2 items. You wouldn't have to read this if you had bothered reading any of my original links:

A) SHORT EXPLANATION - A PHONE CALL TO THE FED:
CALLER - Are Federal Reserve Notes backed by anything?
MR. SUPINSKI-Yes, by the assets of the Federal Reserve but, primarily by the power of congress to lay tax on the people.
CALLER - Did you say, by the power to collect taxes is what backs Federal Reserve Notes?
MR. SUPINSKI - Yes

B) LONGER EXPLANATION - ALAN GREENSPAN IN 1966:
"But the process of cure was misdiagnosed as the disease: if shortage of bank reserves was causing a business decline-argued economic interventionists-why not find a way of supplying increased reserves to the banks so they never need be short! If banks can continue to loan money indefinitely-it was claimed-there need never be any slumps in business. And so the Federal Reserve System was organized in 1913. It consisted of twelve regional Federal Reserve banks nominally owned by private bankers, but in fact government sponsored, controlled, and supported. Credit extended by these banks is in practice (though not legally) backed by the taxing power of the federal government."

PART IV - I DON'T TRUST GREENSPAN OR THE FREE MARKET! HE SAID HIMSELF HE MADE A MISTAKE IN THINKING THE MARKET WOULD CORRECT ITSELF
I did say there were 2 Greenspans didn't I? You can reasonably trust the the Greenspan during his pre-fuckup years. But during the last 20 to 30 years, he became a fuckup who mismanaged the Federal Reserve and instead of directly blaming himself, in a final act of betrayal he blamed his faith in the free market. I don't have time to convince you why his "admission" of a mistake was a complete farce, so why don't you take a look at a few articles on the web and judge for yourself. I'll get you started with a couple:
http://www.capmag.com/article.asp?ID=5340
http://www.washingtonpost.com/...5/AR2008101503166.html

PART V: OUR "FIAT CURRENCY" DOLLAR IS STRONG! IT WILL NOT COLLAPSE, AND NEITHER WILL OUR ECONOMY UNDER THE FEDERAL RESERVE... RIGHT?
Those pimply faced, you tube educated internet conspiracy theorists at the BBC don't seem to think so:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7684397.stm
But surely this guy and his rantings on Fox Business are always wrong:
http://www.infowars.com/?p=5938
And this guy we already know will be wrong as usual, right?
http://www.boom2bust.com/2008/...-is-going-to-collapse/

PART VI OK, MAYBE I'M A LITTLE CONVINCED ABOUT ALL THIS FEDERAL RESERVE CRAZINESS...
Well first you have to get mad:
http://digg.com/political_opinion/Turn_Off_Your_TV_Now
And then start doing something about it. Personally, I go for the Ron Paul movement:
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/
and the Libertarian Party
http://www.lp.org/
but like I said the issue of the Federal Reserve crosses party lines. Whatever action you take, make sure it is not inaction. Now excuse me, I'm not gonna write about this any further, I'm going to take action by participating in a protest. Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
 

TallBill

Lifer
Apr 29, 2001
46,017
62
91
PART III: I AM A SHEEPLE. I'M STILL NOT CONVINCED ANYTHING IS WRONG, AND THINK THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM IS JUST FINE AND DANDY

Once I turned 17 I stopped calling people sheep. I don't "support" the federal reserve. I don't need to. It's there, and I don't care. Protesters are just going to be a social annoyance.
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
I won't be there.

This entire economic crisis has been manufactured by those tricky rich, and Tiger Woods, in a self-centered attempt to eliminate the terribly overcrowded conditions that have been imposed on America's golf courses over the last decade by the petite bourgeoisie (That's French for "little sheeple") and their disposable income.

In protest I am going golfing today. Because I refuse to let the man keep me down.
 
Dec 30, 2004
12,553
2
76
Hm, I used to be libertarian, but after reading tons and tons about economics and the federal reserve, I have decided they are necessary to our country's functioning.
Capitalism by definition seeks out the MOST profit NOW not matter what, to the detriment of everyone, unless there are clear and foreseen consequences to one making these decisions (such as free markets-- that let the inefficient player fail). So in that regard I'm still Libertarian. But the Fed is necessary. The alternative is jobs for NOBODY because everybody hoards their (insert currency here) because it gains value faster than any investments gain value.
 

PottedMeat

Lifer
Apr 17, 2002
12,363
475
126
Hehe I wonder how many people will actually show up. Someone will probably go up to a small group and say 'What you guys doin?' and they'll say 'uh... waitin' for a taxi' or something.
 

Double Trouble

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
9,270
103
106
Originally posted by: Evander
Be sure to attend if you leave nearby, check the list of cities here:
http://www.endthefed.us/

Federal Reserve Roundup Post:

Democratic Congressman D. Kucinich: Repeal the Fed, Impeach the Prez:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...o0luBs&feature=related

Nevada GOP platform: "We support the repeal of the Federal Reserve Act":
http://www.nevadagop.org/About...ult.aspx?SectionId=776

Nader VP Matt Gonzalez says abolish the fed:
http://www.vanityfair.com/onli...ing-against-obama.html

Idaho GOP wants to abolish Federal Reserve:
http://redstaterebels.typepad....9/idaho-gop-wants.html

Steve Forbes calls for drastic reduction of Fed:
http://digg.com/business_finan...ing_of_Federal_Reserve

Former Georgia congressman and 2008 Libertarian Presidential Candidate Bob Barr calls to end the Fed:
http://libertymaven.com/2008/0...-federal-reserve/1123/

Investor Jim Rogers call for end to Fed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwIncF3yrpQ

Peter Schiff blames the Fed on economic crisis:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Je0jARsDbjw

A phone call to the Fed:
http://digg.com/business_finan...hone_Call_To_The_Fed_3

Federal Reserve spokesman speaks out:
http://digg.com/business_finan...h_From_a_Fed_Spokesman

Fractional Reserve Banking versus Ayn Rand's Ethics:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWnhX2koVEc

Greenspan in 1966 blames the Fed's mismanaged policies for Great Depression:
http://www.321gold.com/fed/greenspan/1966.html

Whether or not you believe in any conspiracy theories, keep in mind that Federal Reserve policies reward the politician by allowing him to "give" his constituents more without increasing taxes, thus increasing his chance for reelection, but punish both the saver and the investor. Printing fiat currency causes inflation and savers are hit the hardest by this. Those who try to beat inflation become investors - they may try their hand in the stock market, but look how the Federal Reserve lending practices caused the price of stock to plummet in the recent economic crisis, nearly wiping out people's life savings. Inflation and mismanaged policies are felt by everyone and are reason enough to oppose the Federal Reserve.
"?A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have..."
-Thomas Jefferson

P.S.
Free Federal Reserve e-book:
http://www.joeplummer.com/meet_the_system.html
Beware the protest police:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeEsIm-V1ZA

Funny, just about all those links are to crackpots (Kucinich) and fringe nuts. Without even reading all of those, it's pretty easy to see I should be on the other side of whatever opinion they are supporting.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,509
9,727
136
Considering their actions during this depression, causing it to worsen by a wide margin, f? the Federal Reserve.

If you guys support it, what would YOU have done with your $40,000?