Project DarK

[Pliablemoose]

Looks like 3 unlimited rate plans, service will be avaialable without factoring in the subsidized phone fees, rapid rollout of 4G, and a few new phones.

I'm on board, the damn subsidized rate plans piss me off, I have to buy new phones and resell them all the time to get my $'s worth out of a new contract. I'd rather just pay for a phone and pop a TMobile sim card in it, and have a reduced rate plan.

Anyway, rollout is October 25th.

 

[erwos]

I'll be curious to see how it turns out. If, indeed, this is going to involve non-subsidized phones, I have serious questions about how many people it will attract.

 

[DivideBYZero]

This, amongst many other things, is essential for the US mobile market. SIM only deals are perfect for people who want to change plans without collecting yet another handset they just don't want or need. Next on the list will be not charging for incoming texts and calls, but I fear that may take a little longer...

 

[erwos]

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
This, amongst many other things, is essential for the US mobile market. SIM only deals are perfect for people who want to change plans without collecting yet another handset they just don't want or need. Next on the list will be not charging for incoming texts and calls, but I fear that may take a little longer...

Here's the thing, though: we have heterogeneous phone networks. Sprint and Verizon customers can't just switch to T-Mo with their paid-off phones. Hell, aren't the AT&T and T-Mo 3G bands different?

I don't disagree with the general gist that you should be allowed to buy non-subsidized plans at a cheaper price - I just don't think that would be a game changer in the US market.

 

[Deeko]

Its a step in the right direction, though. Sounds like T-Mobile's parent company - based in Germany - is trying to turn T-Mobile into a more European style wireless company. If its true, and if it attracts a decent number of subscribers, we could see the others follow suit. Definitely a good thing for the industry.

And if T-Mobile really rolls out 21+ mbps hspa+, that's damn impressive, they'll go from last to first in the data field real quick.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: erwos

Originally posted by: DivideBYZero
This, amongst many other things, is essential for the US mobile market. SIM only deals are perfect for people who want to change plans without collecting yet another handset they just don't want or need. Next on the list will be not charging for incoming texts and calls, but I fear that may take a little longer...

Here's the thing, though: we have heterogeneous phone networks. Sprint and Verizon customers can't just switch to T-Mo with their paid-off phones. Hell, aren't the AT&T and T-Mo 3G bands different?

I don't disagree with the general gist that you should be allowed to buy non-subsidized plans at a cheaper price - I just don't think that would be a game changer in the US market.

Exactly.

For me, I want to be able to score a used phone off eBay or Craigslist and use it, and not lock into a 2 year contract over & over...

 

[erwos]

Originally posted by: Deeko
Its a step in the right direction, though. Sounds like T-Mobile's parent company - based in Germany - is trying to turn T-Mobile into a more European style wireless company. If its true, and if it attracts a decent number of subscribers, we could see the others follow suit. Definitely a good thing for the industry.

Totally agree that it's a good thing for the industry... I just don't think it'll be all that successful in the area of "make T-Mobile #1 fast!".

And if T-Mobile really rolls out 21+ mbps hspa+, that's damn impressive, they'll go from last to first in the data field real quick.

I have two concerns:
1. T-Mobile is infamous for having rather poor coverage. Having super-fast data with terrible coverage isn't terribly useful to travelers.
2. Are consumers really going to notice the difference between 8mbps and 21mbps on their cellphones? When does latency become more of a factor for the user experience than bandwidth?

I am desperately hoping T-Mobile will prove me wrong on all of this, because I'd love to see competition reignited in the cell phone market.

 

[Deeko]

1 - I had T-Mobile for about 7 years before switching to Verizon. I've lived in two major cities and quite a few surrounding areas. I actually got considerably BETTER signals on T-Mobile than Verizon. Now - Verizon's 3G network is bigger than T-Mobile's, but in terms of raw coverage area, I've actually had more success with T-Mobile. Admittedly I live in populated areas, and in more remote places, Verizon is the winner.

2 - Who is actually getting 8mbps right now? T-Mobile's actual speed rate is closer to 1mbps - and yea, 21 would be a whole lot faster.

 

[jdjbuffalo]

It will be interesting to see the details of this plan. I am very interested in it.

This is the first I've heard that it would be non-subbed phones. I'm kind disappointed in that but at the same time I see it as a benefit. I've only had 3 phones with T-Mobile over the last 7 years that I've had them and only the first two were ones bought from T-Mobile. The third one I got from someone not wanting to use an unlocked AT&T Blackberry Curve anymore. I've not been under contract for 3 years now and I really don't want to go under contract again.

If they offer these plans without having to sign up for a contract then I'll be all over it as it would give me data for the same price that I'm paying for just 1000 minutes + 400 texts.

 

[blackangst1]

Pliablemoose:

All the info I've read has nothing confirmed. Do you have a confirmed link for a source? Ive been following this since it turned up on boygenious.

http://www.boygeniusreport.com...roject-black-handsets/

http://www.intomobile.com/2009...s-unlimited-plans.html

http://gizmodo.com/5378270/t+m...t-update-its-much-more

http://www.tmonews.com/2009/10...le-little-star-rumors/

http://www.gadgetreview.com/20...f-the-line-phones.html

being the most referred to sources. None of which have been confirmed.

 

[Cuda1447]

I have a few things to chime in about.

1. From what I know, there will be subsidized contracts as well as non-subsidized contracts. So consumers will have both options.
2. @ erwos. T-Mobile actually isn't famous for having poor coverage. They just don't have the marketing to make it seem like they have good coverage. The fact is that in the top 50 markets in the U.S T-Mobile is either #1 or #2 in terms of coverage. They are leaps and bounds ahead of AT&T in terms of coverage and especially dropped calls.
3. T-Mobile doesn't have the biggest 3g network, but they are rolling 3g's out a very fast rate and plan to actually increase the rate at which they roll out 3g. End result is supposed to be the largest 3g network. HSPDA is also in the works, probably 1st quarter of next year. The cool thing about that it is all just a software upgrade, it doesn't require more towers or anything. If I'm not mistaken T-Mob. could even jump to 42mbps if they wanted, with just another software upgrade. I'm not entirely sure on the technology though.
4. @ erwos again. T-Mob isn't planning on taking #1. Their goal is #3 right now.
5. New phones aren't really part of project dark as far as I know. The Blackberry 9700 (3g blackberry) Cliq, and N900 are all pretty much confirmed. But outside of that there isn't really any amazing handsets that T-mob is planning on stealing business with. Although there are rumors about the HTC HD2 going to T-Mob, which would be pretty cool.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: blackangst1

None of which have been confirmed.

Same here, Im just spreading rumors

 

[erwos]

Originally posted by: Cuda1447
2. @ erwos. T-Mobile actually isn't famous for having poor coverage. They just don't have the marketing to make it seem like they have good coverage. The fact is that in the top 50 markets in the U.S T-Mobile is either #1 or #2 in terms of coverage. They are leaps and bounds ahead of AT&T in terms of coverage and especially dropped calls.

That's marketing speak for "we cover cities, and that's about it". AT&T's current problem is that they're _too_ successful, and have congestion issues... those are fixable a lot faster than rolling out new towers.

4. @ erwos again. T-Mob isn't planning on taking #1. Their goal is #3 right now.

Well, duh, #3 is sort of on the way to #1. They want to be #1 and fast, every single leak about Project Dark has noted this.

 

[blackangst1]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: blackangst1

None of which have been confirmed.

Same here, Im just spreading rumors

No, dont get me wrong I hope it comes to fruition...and boygenious has pretty good sources. But I guess with TMo employees signing (probably very stringent) non-disclosure, we may not see anything confirmed for a bit.

Im sure someone will yap though. They always do hehe

 

[Pliablemoose]

Here are some pics of the plans with no prices...

 

[blackangst1]

Wowee...could be a huge game changer...

 

[shortylickens]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
Here are some pics of the plans with no prices...

Without a dollar value I cant get too excited yet.
What I really need is about 30 minutes per month and unlimited data, all for a reasonable price. If I could get it contract-free that would be even better.
But I admit I am excited about all the potential here.

 

[Pliablemoose]

I'm a bit more excited about Wal Mart's announced plans, if they allow other cdma phones, I'll be switching over to them...

 

[corkyg]

Right now, there is no big advantage for T-Mobile here in the USA. They are a separate P&L company from Deutches Telekom, one of the best 3G providers in Europe.

If there were a closer ties, and USA subscribers would be able to access the European network when travelling w/o roaming charges, I would welcome it. It would make Euro travel so much easier.

 

[TheWart]

In reading all the coverage of the phone installment plans, I seem to be missing what is so appealing about these. For one, there are ways to pay for a phone in installments already....it is called a credit card (and there are enough of them that offer 0% financing for 6-12 months).

In addition, I don't see how it is so great unless you are a wealthy consumer who likes to hop from network to network. For example, you pay $400 for a phone (up front, or installments), and then let's say $50 a month for service. Since you did not get a subsidy, you dont have to have a two year contract, great. Or, you pay $199 or $100 for the phone (subsidized b/c of contract) and then $50 a month for service....

I cannot see a whole lot of situations where the ability to hop from network to network outweighs the extra $$ you are paying. Am I missing something obvious here?

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: TheWart

I cannot see a whole lot of situations where the ability to hop from network to network outweighs the extra $$ you are paying. Am I missing something obvious here?

That's exactly how I read it too, no real benefit, except TMobile will likely sell more handsets per line of service. Of course that will translate into more phones on the used market...

Unless they have a killer family plan I won't be changing, although the trend to unsubsidized phones should lead to lower monthly fees, so the specifics of the plans aren't as important as market trends.

What the US needs is a carrier who provides just high speed data on a device that allows VOIP.

 

[shortylickens]

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose

Originally posted by: TheWart

I cannot see a whole lot of situations where the ability to hop from network to network outweighs the extra $$ you are paying. Am I missing something obvious here?

That's exactly how I read it too, no real benefit, except TMobile will likely sell more handsets per line of service. Of course that will translate into more phones on the used market...

Unless they have a killer family plan I won't be changing, although the trend to unsubsidized phones should lead to lower monthly fees, so the specifics of the plans aren't as important as market trends.

What the US needs is a carrier who provides just high speed data on a device that allows VOIP.

The people in charge dont want that, it would cost them money.

 

[erwos]

Originally posted by: shortylickens

Originally posted by: Pliablemoose
What the US needs is a carrier who provides just high speed data on a device that allows VOIP.

The people in charge dont want that, it would cost them money.

If the FCC mandates net neutrality, they won't have a choice. The major carriers already offer some data-only plans for your smartphones...

In fact, that's why AT&T did a sudden about-face on Skype on the iPhone - the FCC chairman made some noises about net neutrality as it pertained to mobile carriers, and it seemed to scare them immensely:
http://www.wired.com/epicenter...9/10/iphone-att-skype/

My guess is that, eventually, we'll see metering by data usage and not "minutes", especially with 4G roll-outs.

 

[abaez]

What carrier offers data only? I've gone into both ATT and TMO stores and every single time they say I need a voice plan (this is with an unbranded, unlocked e71). ATT has prepaid data, but it's very expensive.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Originally posted by: abaez
What carrier offers data only? I've gone into both ATT and TMO stores and every single time they say I need a voice plan (this is with an unbranded, unlocked e71). ATT has prepaid data, but it's very expensive.

Yep, deaf phone users have been fighting for data/text only phones for some time. The only thing I can find are notebook plans for data only...