Price of Medication here why?

[DaTT]

In all fairness, many generics aren't equal.

Those with a ton of money will keep buying the original formula because some generics don't work right for everyone.

I have not heard of this. In any "generic" vs "brand name" comparison I have done, the ingredients are exactly the same. Same name and quantity.

 

[BoberFett]

No thats part of the cost of production, but it doesnt affect the supply/demand curve any more than a normal mode.

Fail. A patent most definitely affects supply, as other producers are not allowed to enter the market.

 

[OutHouse]

Yep, let's just buy all our crap from other countries because it's cheaper and then bitch about outsourcing. This thread is proof positive of what I have been saying all along. Pharmaceuticals is just one more piece of the puzzle. Ya gotta love it.

outsource what? those drugs are made here in the US.

 

[OutHouse]

In all fairness, many generics aren't equal.

Those with a ton of money will keep buying the original formula because some generics don't work right for everyone.

Fail, you are flunking out of Pharmacy school?


generic drugs are chemically identical to their branded counterparts


http://www.fda.gov/drugs/resourcesforyou/consumers/questionsanswers/ucm100100.htm

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

Fail, you are flunking out of Pharmacy school?


generic drugs are chemically identical to their branded counterparts


http://www.fda.gov/drugs/resourcesforyou/consumers/questionsanswers/ucm100100.htm

Some generics have different fillers, and they can account for some difference between people's reactions. Mostly it's just placebo, though.

 

[BUnit1701]

If that were true, then corporations would not be seeing massive profits. I mean, if what you say is true, then they ONLY make a profit in the US, and in fact make a loss elsewhere. If they only made a small profit in elsewhere, they would not bother to subsisize the rest of the world, correct?

So tell me why Pfizer's 2012 net income was $14 billion? That does not sound like a struggling corporation to me - one having to move money around to make a profit.

He left part of the story out, that being that in the US the inhaler which costs $100 to produce is sold for $400. Unless the person buying is using insurance, then its $600.

 

[Dulanic]

I'm sure the drug companies deserve this kind of money. I take 2 medications....

Med1: $2,175.60 every 90 days
Med2: $4,534.60 every 30 days.

 

[piasabird]

You might also ask yourself how many of these drugs are researched and developed in Canada?

I am not saying American drugs are better by any stretch of the imagination. We just have different systems. Sometimes drugs have a price that is high but it is possible to get them at a discount.

I take this drug called Januvia(Spell). It is like $60 through my insurance but if I go to the manufacturer and get the discount card, I can get it for a lot less. This is just one example. You might also check different pharmacies.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Too bad you don't have the ability to refute the info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination

 

[Londo_Jowo]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_discrimination

Ok, still doesn't refute what reported in the article (ie, doctors/pharmaceutical/medical facilities less likely to be sued in Canada). How much more do Americans pay for services/products to help defend/protect these entities when being sued?

 

[hardhat]

I think that the term "subsidize" is being misused here. While the rest of the world does pay less for the exact same drugs, the drug companies still make a profit off of each and every sale (or sell the drugs as a loss leader to gain market share/brand recognition, etc.). There is no subsidy, only a market-driven reduction in price through wholesale pricing, less stringent patent protection systems, etc. If the US system only offered the same level of profitability as the rest of the world, research and development would slow down massively, many pharmaceuticals would seek other opportunities, etc. While the cost of pharmaceuticals and many other medical devices is stifling in the US, it mainly represents what the market will bear.

 

[AViking]

I think that the term "subsidize" is being misused here. While the rest of the world does pay less for the exact same drugs, the drug companies still make a profit off of each and every sale (or sell the drugs as a loss leader to gain market share/brand recognition, etc.). There is no subsidy, only a market-driven reduction in price through wholesale pricing, less stringent patent protection systems, etc. If the US system only offered the same level of profitability as the rest of the world, research and development would slow down massively, many pharmaceuticals would seek other opportunities, etc. While the cost of pharmaceuticals and many other medical devices is stifling in the US, it mainly represents what the market will bear.

I think it's that Americans don't know any better.

Lets be honest about this for at least one second. I grew up with American healthcare. It's normal. Everyone complains about the cost but "America Fuck Yeah!" and "We have the best healthcare in the world!". I go to Sweden and before I leave everyone rants and raves about "America Fuck Yeah!" and "Fuck Socialism!". They don't even for a second consider that something different could be better. No way! "Sweden is socialist, everyone is lazy, and everyone lives off the government teat!"

Well reality is very different. VERY different.

Ultimately what Americans have to decide is which system they prefer. Based on my own experiences:

USA
1. Great healthcare. If you go to the doctor for a booboo they will run every test imaginable.
2. Very expensive healthcare. You will spend a relatively large portion of your paycheck on healthcare. Even if you don't, your employer is, or the government is.
3. Overcrowded emergency rooms. They're terrible.
4. 17% of GDP is being spent on healthcare
5. Roughly 2 million Americans are going bankrupt each year due to medical bills.
6. 44 million Americans do not have health insurance.
7. An additional 38 million Americans do not have adequate health insurance
8. Average life expectancy in the USA is 78.7 years. Ranked 33 in the world.
9. We're the only industrialized country that are dependent on for profit medical coverage. The profit margins of pharmaceuticals, medical device manufacturers, etc are very high and that bill is being footed by all Americans.
10. Infant mortality is 6.81/1000 live births. Ranked 34 (behind Cuba)

SWEDEN

1. A regular doctor visit is pretty much "meh" compared to ours. They do not run every test imaginable and this can be frustrating. They will not run tests unless there is evidence to support the need for one. So if your ankle hurts they will first do a physical examination and then an x-ray but an MRI is out of the question since it's for soft tissue and they can't determine if it's soft tissue damage or simply you walking wrong and weakening your muscles. They will prescribe pain medicine and physical therapy rather since it is a more effective solution. I am used to getting the MRI but it won't happen until physical therapy determines that it is necessary.

2. Very affordable healthcare. It's $0. If you use it you have a yearly cap of about $100 for doctor visits and $100 for prescription medication. You pay higher taxes for this but I think you come out way ahead since the average American pays so much money for theirs. Your family in America is paying somewhere between $5,600 and $13,000 depending on the state and the deductible. The number is big. If you compare that as a percentage of your income it's very large and is larger than the tax difference I pay here to get not only healthcare but 16 months of Maternity/Paternity leave, a minimum of 5 weeks vacation, a pension plan, and so on. Our healthcare system only is cheap for those making very large sums of money. So yes, if you make $250,000 a year the American system is much cheaper. After all your income at retirement will mostly be based on capital gains and not your pension and you could give a shit about a $10,000 delivery charge to have a baby.

3. Unlike a regular doctors visit a trip to the ER is top notch. You are in and out of there. It's super effective and very impressive. Acute healthcare is way better than anything I experienced in the USA. Mostly due to the lack of overcrowding. Also due to the sheer number of doctors and specialists though there and ready. I think the US has a shortage of medical personnel right now. Either that or they just have a tons of doctors and specialists here.

4. Sweden pays 9% of their GDP for healthcare and funds 97% of healthcare coverage since patient costs are so small.

5. 0% of Swedes are going bankrupt due to healthcare bills
6. 100% of Swedes have healthcare coverage
7. 100% of visitors to Sweden from the EU/EEA have healthcare coverage but Americans who visit Sweden need to pay for the full cost of coverage since these are all based on reciprocal agreements and the USA doesn't provide healthcare to visitors.
8. Average life expectancy is 82 years. Ranked 4th.
9. Infant mortality is 2.56/1000 live births. Ranked 4th.

So the question is which one is more effective, more cost effective, and which one do you prefer? Or, you could just do the typical "America Fuck Yeah!"

 

[Juddog]

I think it's that Americans don't know any better.

Lets be honest about this for at least one second. I grew up with American healthcare. It's normal. Everyone complains about the cost but "America Fuck Yeah!" and "We have the best healthcare in the world!". I go to Sweden and before I leave everyone rants and raves about "America Fuck Yeah!" and "Fuck Socialism!". They don't even for a second consider that something different could be better. No way! "Sweden is socialist, everyone is lazy, and everyone lives off the government teat!"

Well reality is very different. VERY different.

Ultimately what Americans have to decide is which system they prefer. Based on my own experiences:

USA
1. Great healthcare. If you go to the doctor for a booboo they will run every test imaginable.
2. Very expensive healthcare. You will spend a relatively large portion of your paycheck on healthcare. Even if you don't, your employer is, or the government is.
3. Overcrowded emergency rooms. They're terrible.
4. 17% of GDP is being spent on healthcare
5. Roughly 2 million Americans are going bankrupt each year due to medical bills.
6. 44 million Americans do not have health insurance.
7. An additional 38 million Americans do not have adequate health insurance
8. Average life expectancy in the USA is 78.7 years. Ranked 33 in the world.
9. We're the only industrialized country that are dependent on for profit medical coverage. The profit margins of pharmaceuticals, medical device manufacturers, etc are very high and that bill is being footed by all Americans.
10. Infant mortality is 6.81/1000 live births. Ranked 34 (behind Cuba)

SWEDEN

1. A regular doctor visit is pretty much "meh" compared to ours. They do not run every test imaginable and this can be frustrating. They will not run tests unless there is evidence to support the need for one. So if your ankle hurts they will first do a physical examination and then an x-ray but an MRI is out of the question since it's for soft tissue and they can't determine if it's soft tissue damage or simply you walking wrong and weakening your muscles. They will prescribe pain medicine and physical therapy rather since it is a more effective solution. I am used to getting the MRI but it won't happen until physical therapy determines that it is necessary.

2. Very affordable healthcare. It's $0. If you use it you have a yearly cap of about $100 for doctor visits and $100 for prescription medication. You pay higher taxes for this but I think you come out way ahead since the average American pays so much money for theirs. Your family in America is paying somewhere between $5,600 and $13,000 depending on the state and the deductible. The number is big. If you compare that as a percentage of your income it's very large and is larger than the tax difference I pay here to get not only healthcare but 16 months of Maternity/Paternity leave, a minimum of 5 weeks vacation, a pension plan, and so on. Our healthcare system only is cheap for those making very large sums of money. So yes, if you make $250,000 a year the American system is much cheaper. After all your income at retirement will mostly be based on capital gains and not your pension and you could give a shit about a $10,000 delivery charge to have a baby.

3. Unlike a regular doctors visit a trip to the ER is top notch. You are in and out of there. It's super effective and very impressive. Acute healthcare is way better than anything I experienced in the USA. Mostly due to the lack of overcrowding. Also due to the sheer number of doctors and specialists though there and ready. I think the US has a shortage of medical personnel right now. Either that or they just have a tons of doctors and specialists here.

4. Sweden pays 9% of their GDP for healthcare and funds 97% of healthcare coverage since patient costs are so small.

5. 0% of Swedes are going bankrupt due to healthcare bills
6. 100% of Swedes have healthcare coverage
7. 100% of visitors to Sweden from the EU/EEA have healthcare coverage but Americans who visit Sweden need to pay for the full cost of coverage since these are all based on reciprocal agreements and the USA doesn't provide healthcare to visitors.
8. Average life expectancy is 82 years. Ranked 4th.
9. Infant mortality is 2.56/1000 live births. Ranked 4th.

So the question is which one is more effective, more cost effective, and which one do you prefer? Or, you could just do the typical "America Fuck Yeah!"

Obviously the Swedish system is better, but Amurika fuk yah! Faux News, Rush Limbaugh, etc. will continue to manipulate the sheeple as long as they continue to draw fat paychecks from the health industry, and the sheeple will blindly listen and believe them as they always have.

I'm not sure when the paradigm shift happened, but when I was little people used to talk about America being the best country in the world, #1 and all that, but the reality of it is that America is #30 now or something along those lines. Our healthcare sucks, our education system has fallen way behind, our broadband sucks, etc.. We used to be the land of the free, home of the brave, now the NSA is spying on everything you do online worse than China and pushing out malware to Tor users.

This country has turned to shit, and I'm really sad to see it being destroyed from the inside by the GOP and Democrats who are in the pocketbooks of big corporations. We're pretty much screwed at this point and on the decline. I saddens me greatly that the people in this forum would rather point the finger at the other side as always being the problem instead of trying to make this country great again. People like Texashiker admit they would like to see the entire country collapse, and the tea party has turned into the equivalent of suicide bombers and are blowing up the country from the inside with a threat that will bring us into another recession.

 

[AViking]

Obviously the Swedish system is better, but Amurika fuk yah! Faux News, Rush Limbaugh, etc. will continue to manipulate the sheeple as long as they continue to draw fat paychecks from the health industry, and the sheeple will blindly listen and believe them as they always have.

I'm not sure when the paradigm shift happened, but when I was little people used to talk about America being the best country in the world, #1 and all that, but the reality of it is that America is #30 now or something along those lines. Our healthcare sucks, our education system has fallen way behind, our broadband sucks, etc.. We used to be the land of the free, home of the brave, now the NSA is spying on everything you do online worse than China and pushing out malware to Tor users.

This country has turned to shit, and I'm really sad to see it being destroyed from the inside by the GOP and Democrats who are in the pocketbooks of big corporations. We're pretty much screwed at this point and on the decline. I saddens me greatly that the people in this forum would rather point the finger at the other side as always being the problem instead of trying to make this country great again. People like Texashiker admit they would like to see the entire country collapse, and the tea party has turned into the equivalent of suicide bombers and are blowing up the country from the inside with a threat that will bring us into another recession.

Well I lived in Sweden in the 1990's and had to make an ideological decision on which country was better to live in. I moved back to the USA. I think it was better back then. Today, I don't know how I could move back to the USA without taking a relatively massive hit to my quality of life. The only thing the USA has going for it is that if you have some incredible idea or are incredibly talented you have the most earning potential in the USA. You'll still have a lower quality of life most likely though unless you get really lucky.

I'd like to see that change though. There's really little reason to take a great country like the US and pretty much destroy it in only a couple generations.

 

[Juddog]

Well I lived in Sweden in the 1990's and had to make an ideological decision on which country was better to live in. I moved back to the USA. I think it was better back then. Today, I don't know how I could move back to the USA without taking a relatively massive hit to my quality of life. The only thing the USA has going for it is that if you have some incredible idea or are incredibly talented you have the most earning potential in the USA. You'll still have a lower quality of life most likely though unless you get really lucky.

I'd like to see that change though. There's really little reason to take a great country like the US and pretty much destroy it in only a couple generations.

Yeah I don't understand why people are ok with being #30 on the list. My parents' generation was all gung-ho about being #1 in everything, same goes with my grandparents' generation. Rupert Murdoch and his constant stream of bullshit being shat into people's mouths has corrupted this country from the inside out and people don't even realize they are being fed lies, instead they just blindly believe it.

The top-heavy rich has basically exploited the common person to the point where the middle class built up in the 50's is going to evaporate soon and the USA will be composed of either the poor or the super rich.

 

[AViking]

Well in the 1990's if you made $100,000 a year that was pretty good. Today you would need to make $180,000 to have the same spending power.

So even today if you make decent money you aren't getting much for it.

Yeah if you make $300,000 a year you're doing fine. How many make that kind of money though?

 

[Juddog]

Well in the 1990's if you made $100,000 a year that was pretty good. Today you would need to make $180,000 to have the same spending power.

So even today if you make decent money you aren't getting much for it.

Yeah if you make $300,000 a year you're doing fine. How many make that kind of money though?

Nobody I know even makes $100,000 a year.

 

[Linux23]

you know what's sad is that a majority of Americans think this country is just as great as it once was and that the rich are an example for them to make it big once day. fact is, this empire is about to implode. the rich don't give two shits about you or me. the only thing they care about is profit, profit, profit. you don't exist. their selfish actions do not include you or your family or anyone else but their fellow elite.

sad thing is its too late. its too late to reverse course on this sinking ship. it's like the frog being slowly boiled in water. it's too late to jump out of the pot.