President Obama: Immigration bill coming this year

[WhipperSnapper]

If Obama wants to help the American people and also reduce the cost of health care -- then why the hell is he trying to import impoverished people who will drive down wages for members of the lower classes while also consuming more government-provided health care and services than they contribute?

He just doesn't understand Global Labor Arbitrage and Malthusian Forces (and neither do the Republicans). I hope that his attempt at illegal alien amnesty or an expansion of legal immigration goes down in flames.

I've been supporting Obama's attempt to start to transform the American health care system, but I've consistently opposed him on these other issues. We need to rid ourselves of both the Democrats and the Republicans and put a better, Americans First-type of party in office.

 

[Zedtom]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
If Obama wants to help the American people and also reduce the cost of health care -- then why the hell is he trying to import impoverished people who will drive down wages for members of the lower classes while also consuming more government-provided health care and services than they contribute?

He just doesn't understand Global Labor Arbitrage and Malthusian Forces (and neither do the Republicans). I hope that his attempt at illegal alien amnesty or an expansion of legal immigration goes down in flames.

I've been supporting Obama's attempt to start to transform the American health care system, but I've consistently opposed him on these other issues. We need to rid ourselves of both the Democrats and the Republicans and put a better, Americans First-type of party in office.

The focus on people from Central America and Mexico in relation to health care should not let us ignore the influx of elderly from eastern Europe. These people arrive in the US as visitors of relatives or tourists, and decide to stay. Since many are poor, they become dependent upon welfare, food programs, and Medicare/Medicaid.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: her209
Awesome. This issue needs to dealt with if we're going to have true UHC.

i agree. but it does nto sound as if Obama is going to deal with it now. I also have my doubts on how he will deal with it.


and patranus you are getting annoying. I don't mind slamming Obama when he deserves it fuck you are grasping at straws and looking like a fool.

 

[Darwin333]

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Vic


So what you're saying is that the government IS the solution. Got it.

Don't try to trap me Vic. We're both smarter than that and I know you've read The Constitution. You're trying to group me with hardcore libertarians which I am not, and you most likely know that.

I don't think you're even remotely a libertarian, spidey.

And -- aside from an item prohibiting Congress from outlawing the importation of slaves until after 1808 -- there's absolutely nothing in the Constitution against or even about immigration. Quite the opposite, the Founding Fathers were counting on it with borders wide open.

Correct. As long as they became citizens. Nobody AFAIK has a problem with immigration and we all welcome it, it's the illegal part that they have a problem with.

But we have an invasion going on.

Yes, an invasion of mostly Mexican immigrants looking for work, 97% of whom don't commit any serious crimes and all of whom provide a net economic benefit in the aggregate.

The humanity!

A net economic benefit? Do you really believe that they can't find an American to do those jobs? Said Americans, and their employers, would be paying payroll taxes versus mostly under the table work. To top it off, more Americans employed equals less unemployment benefits the government would be paying out. So how exactly is outsourcing jobs on our own soil while we are pushing 10% unemployment a benefit?

 

[WhipperSnapper]

As always, no discussion of immigration should occur until everyone involved has watched this video in full:

Immigration Gumballs

 

[First]

Originally posted by: Darwin333

A net economic benefit? Do you really believe that they can't find an American to do those jobs? Said Americans, and their employers, would be paying payroll taxes versus mostly under the table work. To top it off, more Americans employed equals less unemployment benefits the government would be paying out. So how exactly is outsourcing jobs on our own soil while we are pushing 10% unemployment a benefit?

Because the few Americans that actually want to work for crap pay with no benefits in a dead-end job with no future are an extremely small subset of Americans. Americans can actually legally pursue higher education, they can actually work in gov't with great benefits, they can actually find stable jobs with a future, all because they're legal citizens. That's why they don't want those jobs, and that's why illegals take them; because their lives in their country of origin were far, far worse. They are a net economic benefit otherwise because they do in fact pay taxes, billions of them, especially in NY and CA (which have the most illegals) since those states have the highest state taxes. It's not hard to fathom. At all.

 

[rpanic]

Originally posted by: Evan

Originally posted by: Darwin333

A net economic benefit? Do you really believe that they can't find an American to do those jobs? Said Americans, and their employers, would be paying payroll taxes versus mostly under the table work. To top it off, more Americans employed equals less unemployment benefits the government would be paying out. So how exactly is outsourcing jobs on our own soil while we are pushing 10% unemployment a benefit?

Because the few Americans that actually want to work for crap pay with no benefits in a dead-end job with no future are an extremely small subset of Americans. Americans can actually legally pursue higher education, they can actually work in gov't with great benefits, they can actually find stable jobs with a future, all because they're legal citizens. That's why they don't want those jobs, and that's why illegals take them; because their lives in their country of origin were far, far worse. They are a net economic benefit otherwise because they do in fact pay taxes, billions of them, especially in NY and CA (which have the most illegals) since those states have the highest state taxes. It's not hard to fathom. At all.

Who did those jobs before; I don?t think the country has always had a massive amount of illegals here to do them. It?s silly to keep saying that they are jobs nobody will do there were people before doing them, and there are Americans doing them now where there are no illegals.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Originally posted by: rpanic

Who did those jobs before; I don?t think the country has always had a massive amount of illegals here to do them. It?s silly to keep saying that they are jobs nobody will do there were people before doing them, and there are Americans doing them now where there are no illegals.

Migrant workers have been plentiful in this country for a long time, well over 100yrs. Most of "these" jobs are hard labor in extreme conditions type jobs, like those tending crops in "The Grapes of Wrathe" or roofers, road workers, and construction jobs in the southern states where it's 100+ in the summer.

So there is validity to the argument that without illegals there will be many jobs that will be hard to fill, when the set of necessary jobs skills includes the ability to do hard labor in extreme heat (for example) it's hard to compete with migrant workers who are aclimated and accustom to these conditions.

 

[rpanic]

Originally posted by: GuitarDaddy

Originally posted by: rpanic

Who did those jobs before; I don?t think the country has always had a massive amount of illegals here to do them. It?s silly to keep saying that they are jobs nobody will do there were people before doing them, and there are Americans doing them now where there are no illegals.

Migrant workers have been plentiful in this country for a long time, well over 100yrs. Most of "these" jobs are hard labor in extreme conditions type jobs, like those tending crops in "The Grapes of Wrathe" or roofers, road workers, and construction jobs in the southern states where it's 100+ in the summer.

So there is validity to the argument that without illegals there will be many jobs that will be hard to fill, when the set of necessary jobs skills includes the ability to do hard labor in extreme heat (for example) it's hard to compete with migrant workers who are aclimated and accustom to these conditions.

Ok migrant workers in the fields, I can see being hard to fill for the amount of money they are paid. But most illegals are not in the fields they are in the cities, and there is nothing migratory about them. I keep hearing ?Oh how will the food get picked.? come on that?s not where most are. They are taking jobs that for the most part are temporary transition jobs that were done by teenagers and people looking for a side job to make a little extra money.

I have no problem with migrant jobs in the US it use to work; now it?s an excuse.

 

[xj0hnx]

Originally posted by: rpanic

Originally posted by: GuitarDaddy

Originally posted by: rpanic

Who did those jobs before; I don?t think the country has always had a massive amount of illegals here to do them. It?s silly to keep saying that they are jobs nobody will do there were people before doing them, and there are Americans doing them now where there are no illegals.

Migrant workers have been plentiful in this country for a long time, well over 100yrs. Most of "these" jobs are hard labor in extreme conditions type jobs, like those tending crops in "The Grapes of Wrathe" or roofers, road workers, and construction jobs in the southern states where it's 100+ in the summer.

So there is validity to the argument that without illegals there will be many jobs that will be hard to fill, when the set of necessary jobs skills includes the ability to do hard labor in extreme heat (for example) it's hard to compete with migrant workers who are aclimated and accustom to these conditions.

Ok migrant workers in the fields, I can see being hard to fill for the amount of money they are paid. But most illegals are not in the fields they are in the cities, and there is nothing migratory about them. I keep hearing ?Oh how will the food get picked.? come on that?s not where most are. They are taking jobs that for the most part are temporary transition jobs that were done by teenagers and people looking for a side job to make a little extra money.

I have no problem with migrant jobs in the US it use to work; now it?s an excuse.

This. The illegals working the fields is not even close to a majority. Most around here are doing construction, lawncare, dishwashing, working in service, and doing jobs that many Americans can, and indeed would do if they weren't able to farm them out to a cheaper illegal labor force.