Pregnant Women Warned: Consent to Surgical Birth or Else

[Phanuel]

Troll troll troll your boat, gently up the stream without a paddle, merrily merrily merrily merrily, life is just a violation of my rights!

 

[Subyman]

I really do scratch my head at some of your posts. The article links to the main blog article, and it doesn't explain why she had 3 previous C sections. Generally when a C section is preferred it has to do with very real potential complications that can occur in Vaginal delivery that post a major risk to the baby and the mothers life.

In addition with each C section comes a very real risk of uterine rupture if a woman tries to do a normal vaginal birth.

Now having said all that, women can choose not to have their baby in a hospital setting. Many women do home birthing. Some women use a midwife who is trained in home birthing.

The article seems to be leaving a lot of information out. I guess you are tying to make some weird point that because they are forcing her to have a C section that somehow this relates to abortion? Not sure what your getting at.

Thread should end here. Superfluous headline to get clicks.

 

[alzan]

Absolutely not.

Do you violate someones rights because of a perceived risk?

Yes there was an increased risk to the child. How much risk risk? So that gives the doctor and hospital permission to restrain and preform a medical procedure against her will?

Well, if we are going to start minimizing risk, when do we start giving lobotomies to convicts?

When do we minimize risk to ourselves and give you a frontal lobotomy?

Or better yet an amygdalotomy?

 

[MrPickins]

Do you violate someones rights because of a perceived risk?

Sometimes, yes..

Try buying a gun if your heath care provider reasonably believes you're a threat to yourself or others (and has reported it).

Try yelling "fire" in a crowded theater.

 

[alzan]

I love TH threads. Every other thread on P&N results in an explosion of angry bickering, but here everyone can come together to disagree with one person.

Yes, it's lovely the way he brings unity to our normal divisiveness.

 

[zinfamous]

Where are the people who staunchly defend a womans right to make decisions for her body?

We've been here all along, explaining to you how utterly dumb you are.

 

[zinfamous]

Do you still assert that the doctors can be forced by her to perform a procedure which they consider to be so dangerous as to be unethical?

Of course he does. He fully supports the right of the state to force abortion clinics to perform unnecessary, and unethical procedures on their patients. He has never, not once, defending a patient's choice regarding their own body. Not in a sound, ethical manner.

And he isn't doing that here, either. The unsurprising thing is that he doesn't realize it.

 

[zinfamous]

You're like a little kid who just learned a new word. I'm glad I could teach it to you, but one small bit of advice: the more you use it the less power it holds.

He also learned "affirmed" or "affirm" yesterday. He's been using it a lot this morning

 

[zinfamous]

Wow, just wow. Yall are ignoring a lot of important facts.

The hospital made the first threat.

The woman was trying to protect her body from a medical procedure she did not consent to.

How difficult is that to understand?



Did you read the article? Probably not.

The hospital did not say "if you show up here in labor".

The letter said, if you set foot inside the hospital.

Where do you get her walking into a hospital is a medical emergency?



It is really sad how many people here support the hospital forcing a woman to go trough a medical procedure she did not consent to.

Yall better hope you are never in disagreement with your doctor. One day you might find yourself being restrained against your will.

You are a goddamn fool. Read the comment, numbnuts.

that tugboat can't toot over soon enough to whisk you away from the rest of us.

 

[zinfamous]

Doctor - You have cancer and need aggressive treatment.
alzan - what are my chances?
Doctor - 50/50
alzan - I have led a good life, thank you but I would like to die with dignity.
Doctor - stay right here.
Doctor - calls lawyer, gets a court order, restrains you and makes you go through treatment.

Do not make excuses and do not minimize the impact of this example on patient rights.

And that never happens. Physicians always give you the right to choose chemo. Always.

You are such an unforgivable toolshed.

 

[Texashiker]

that tugboat can't toot over soon enough to whisk you away from the rest of us.

If you know anyone who is hiring let me know.

 

[z1ggy]

Numbnut post #249328439 from TH trying to link some women's "rights" issue to one of his right wing agenda claims.

Hospital refuses to deliver a baby vaginally for a woman who is at a very high risk of injury/death from this and high risk for baby (due to her previous C sections) so they can't get sued by said woman or her family if things go wrong. Makes perfect sense to me.

But F it ya'll, this women should have her rights!! But then again I can see how TH could get this clear cut issue confused with abortion or what ever else he wants.

 

[Texashiker]

Numbnut post #249328439 from TH trying to link some women's "rights" issue to one of his right wing agenda claims.

Hospital refuses to deliver a baby vaginally for a woman who is at a very high risk of injury/death from this and high risk for baby (due to her previous C sections) so they can't get sued by said woman or her family if things go wrong. Makes perfect sense to me.

But F it ya'll, this women should have her rights!! But then again I can see how TH could get this clear cut issue confused with abortion or what ever else he wants.

So much hate. Did your mother drink heavily while carrying you?

I think you finally answered how well crack babies were going to integrate with society.

Take your meds, everything will be better tomorrow.

 

[werepossum]

I think it'd be easier for me to ignore this flavor of stupid if it wasn't related to what I do. I've seen some sad realities, really tragic things, and here some guy doesn't consider harmful consequences to irresponsible actions. Imagine a gun rights supporter saying the right to bear arms means it would be a violation of human rights if he couldn't order another to fire into a crowd. No right is free from responsibility and the greater the potential harm the more due diligence must be applied. This is a fundamental requirement in any so called free society.

Well said. I think Texashiker has the core of a point about hospitals mandating some things. My next door neighbor has been an RN for almost forty years and at her current hospital corporate writes two prescriptions for EVERY in-patient, one of which is a blood thinner. Recently corporate began writing what should be the daily dose to be given hourly, which would have caused the patients to bleed out internally and die. Standardized practices can be a problem. However, this particular case seems almost entirely devoid of that aspect. It certainly appears that the woman was unreasonable whereas the doctor and hospital were completely unreasonable and, moreover, were proven correct.

Goes to show one thing - in health care, the stupidity that kills you is probably your own.

 

[werepossum]

Numbnut post #249328439 from TH trying to link some women's "rights" issue to one of his right wing agenda claims.

Hospital refuses to deliver a baby vaginally for a woman who is at a very high risk of injury/death from this and high risk for baby (due to her previous C sections) so they can't get sued by said woman or her family if things go wrong. Makes perfect sense to me.

But F it ya'll, this women should have her rights!! But then again I can see how TH could get this clear cut issue confused with abortion or what ever else he wants.

Kind of even worse than that. The hospital actually agreed that she has the right to attempt a VB, but referred her to another hospital better equipped to handle the serious complications likely to result from such a choice. The woman then attempted to get a court order to force that particular hospital to acquiesce to her desires.

Had she succeeded, that should grant her an automatic pre-qualification for a Darwin award.

 

[alzan]

So much hate. Did your mother drink heavily while carrying you?

I think you finally answered how well crack babies were going to integrate with society.

Take your meds, everything will be better tomorrow.

Yours obviously did.

 

[Texashiker]

Yours obviously did.

Nope, my mother took up the habit of drinking.

Besides not respecting the womans right to protect her body, the posters here have shown a general lack of respect.

Resorting to insults due to a simple disagreement exhibits juvenile behavior.

 

[z1ggy]

So much hate. Did your mother drink heavily while carrying you?

I think you finally answered how well crack babies were going to integrate with society.

Take your meds, everything will be better tomorrow.

It's not hate, it's just me and everybody else pointing out another misinformed post by you. This article has nothing to do with women's rights in the sense of what you support. The women has the right to give birth any way she chooses. So bam, right there, your point is moot. But then she goes on to try and FORCE the hospital to help her deliver in a way that will allow them to be liable for her death or possibly the death and/or injury of the child. So, all in all, you are supporting a retarded woman who is basically attempting her own suicide and probably the harm of her child. If anybody's mama drank, it was yours.

 

[alzan]

Nope, my mother took up the habit of drinking.

Besides not respecting the womans right to protect her body, the posters here have shown a general lack of respect.

Resorting to insults due to a simple disagreement exhibits juvenile behavior.

You probably should have thought of that before post 313.

You want respect?

Haha

 

[Exophase]

"Did your mother drink while carrying you?"
"Did yours?"
"How dare you resort to insults."

I'm speechless. You're doing this on purpose, right? You have to be, don't you?

 

[Texashiker]

So, all in all, you are supporting a retarded woman who is basically attempting her own suicide and probably the harm of her child. If anybody's mama drank, it was yours.

Rights can not be based on risk.

I understand your point that the woman was trying to force a hospital to do something they disagreed with.

So what if the hospital and/or doctor disagreed with the womans decision. If she showed up in labor, life flight to another hospital.

What did the hospital say they would do? Get a court order to preform a medical procedure against her will. Which is a gross violation of human rights. Maybe the hospital needs to start circumcising baby girls? Refuse and the hospital will get a court order.

The womans decision affects just her and the baby.

The hospitals and judges decision could affect thousands of women. At this hospital you do not get to pick what course of medical care you want.

You either have to follow our instructions, leave, or you will be forced to receive care against your will.

Good thing more doctors and hospitals do not act like that.

 

[Exophase]

If she showed up in labor, life flight to another hospital.

You think that they should air lift a woman in labor to another hospital to honor her desire for treatment that goes against their best medical judgement? Wow.

 

[Texashiker]

You think that they should air lift a woman in labor to another hospital to honor her desire for treatment that goes against their best medical judgement? Wow.

What happens when a hospital is unable to provide treatment?

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Rights can not be based on risk.

I understand your point that the woman was trying to force a hospital to do something they disagreed with.

So what if the hospital and/or doctor disagreed with the womans decision. If she showed up in labor, life flight to another hospital.

What did the hospital say they would do? Get a court order to preform a medical procedure against her will. Which is a gross violation of human rights. Maybe the hospital needs to start circumcising baby girls? Refuse and the hospital will get a court order.

The womans decision affects just her and the baby.

The hospitals and judges decision could affect thousands of women. At this hospital you do not get to pick what course of medical care you want.

You either have to follow our instructions, leave, or you will be forced to receive care against your will.

Good thing more doctors and hospitals do not act like that.

In my whole life I have not once, in writing, on line, in person, or by any other means called someone a stupid wise and beautiful woman. Today I do. I name you "stupid wise and beautiful woman".

 

[alzan]

What happens when a hospital is unable to provide treatment?

The hospital was willing to provide the treatment that gave the best chances of a healthy birth.

Why do you refuse to acknowledge that point?