Power (line) conditioner?

[MagicConch]

I am thinking of getting a power line conditioner, are they worth it?

 

[Zepper]

Depends on how bad your line power is. The UPSes that are called "line-interactive" have a few steps of voltage compensation included. Or buying a PSU with active PFC you usually also get full-range AC that handles some line-side garbage on their own - all you'd need is a good surge/EMI/RFI filter. Most power conditioners and line-interactive UPSes also include the surge and noise filters.

.bh.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: MagicConch
I am thinking of getting a power line conditioner, are they worth it?

Buy a APC Smart UPS and it has a line conditioner built in.


Standard APC Smart UPS
Same as the standard APC Smart UPS but has an extended run time.

I have two 1000va Smart XL's and used the one with a worn out battery to run a 27' CRT television for 3 hours!

 

[MagicConch]

Thanks for the info, I didn't know UPSs have voltage compensation; that makes sense. I will check out the APC Smart UPS

 

[Blain]

Do line conditioners offer more robust circuitry than UPS, but lack the battery back-up time?

 

[soydios]

First off, all I have is a surge protector heading straight into my Antec NeoHE 550 power supply. Even with voltage fluctuations that come from things like turning on a vacuum cleaner in the same room, my overclocked system is rock-solid stable. You only need a line conditioner if you get some wide fluctuations in line voltage.

A dedicated line conditioner would obviously work just as you need it to.
A switching UPS will NOT regulate line voltage. They work by switching on the batteries when the power goes out. They just pass through the AC power during normal operation, the obvious exception being if it has a built-in line conditioner.
A line-interactive UPS WILL regulate line voltage. They work by constantly having the batteries connected. Electricity goes from wall(AC) to battery(DC) to output(AC). The voltage output from the battery is constant if there is no change in charge level.

 

[Zepper]

You can buy simple line conditioners which are the same as what is in the L-I (line-interactive) UPSes (a few steps of boost or cut on the transformer windings switched by solid state relays) or you can buy a ferroresonant transformer which does its magic by design and is stepless (no relays). Ferros are quite expensive. Only Best Power was known for them and Best is now part of a conglomerate. You can find them by googling on Ferrups which they still sell. Perhaps someone else does Ferros too but I don't know of them. The surge suppression and EMI/RFI filters might be better than what you would find in most UPSes too but you'll have to read the specs to find out.


Battery backups and L-I UPSes are not true UPSes. Standard, cheap battery backups have no steps on the transformer - ouside of a narrow range of voltages, it switches to the battery. While L-I UPSes provide a fairly narrow range of voltage correction thru stepped windings on the transformer (as I mentioned above), so the battery doesn't kick in unless the line voltage rises above or drops below what the transformer steps can handle.
. A true UPS is what soydios incorrectly called Line-interactive above - your equipment is always run off the battery (on the other two types there is always a small switching time between being on AC or on the battery - in PSU specs there is a value called "hold up time" (usually near 20 milliseconds) which is how long of a dropout the PSU can handle itself).
. In the old days some PSUs had so short a hold up time that few switched UPSes could keep them running (notoriously Astec). So now the ATX spec has a 17ms hold up time spec.
. The AC side of a true UPS is used just to keep the batteries charged. You can spot them by being very high-priced at least partly due to the quality of the batteries required and the higher ratings of the output components. They are usually not only full time but also have true sine wave output. A few fancy, L-I UPS like the APC Smart UPS line and similar also have true sine wave output. Most digital (and other DC powered) equipment doesn't need true sine wave. Most battery backups and line-interactive UPSes output a modified (stepped) square wave.

.bh.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: MagicConch
Thanks for the info, I didn't know UPSs have voltage compensation; that makes sense. I will check out the APC Smart UPS

That's a SMART decision.

 

[Googer]

Originally posted by: Zepper
You can buy simple line conditioners which are the same as what is in the L-I (line-interactive) UPSes (a few steps of boost or cut on the transformer windings switched by solid state relays) or you can buy a ferroresonant transformer which does its magic by design and is stepless (no relays). Ferros are quite expensive. Only Best Power was known for them and Best is now part of a conglomerate. You can find them by googling on Ferrups which they still sell. Perhaps someone else does Ferros too but I don't know of them. The surge suppression and EMI/RFI filters might be better than what you would find in most UPSes too but you'll have to read the specs to find out.


Battery backups and L-I UPSes are not true UPSes. Standard, cheap battery backups have no steps on the transformer - ouside of a narrow range of voltages, it switches to the battery. While L-I UPSes provide a fairly narrow range of voltage correction thru stepped windings on the transformer (as I mentioned above), so the battery doesn't kick in unless the line voltage rises above or drops below what the transformer steps can handle.
. A true UPS is what soydios incorrectly called Line-interactive above - your equipment is always run off the battery (on the other two types there is always a small switching time between being on AC or on the battery - in PSU specs there is a value called "hold up time" (usually near 20 milliseconds) which is how long of a dropout the PSU can handle itself).
. In the old days some PSUs had so short a hold up time that few switched UPSes could keep them running (notoriously Astec). So now the ATX spec has a 17ms hold up time spec.
. The AC side of a true UPS is used just to keep the batteries charged. You can spot them by being very high-priced at least partly due to the quality of the batteries required and the higher ratings of the output components. They are usually not only full time but also have true sine wave output. A few fancy, L-I UPS like the APC Smart UPS line and similar also have true sine wave output. Most digital (and other DC powered) equipment doesn't need true sine wave. Most battery backups and line-interactive UPSes output a modified (stepped) square wave.

.bh.

Auto-sensing PSU require a sine wave and usualy will automatically switch over to 220v when one is detected. The result is a PC that wont boot. Play it safe and stick with sine wave.

 

[Zepper]

"Auto-sensing PSU require a sine wave and usualy will automatically switch over to 220v when one is detected. The result is a PC that wont boot. Play it safe and stick with sine wave."

There may be a few two range auto-sensing PSUs that could have a problem with stepped square waves, but full range autosensing equipped PSUs should have no problem. At least I've never heard of it 'til now.

.bh.

 

[Rubycon]

A decent power supply should not have a problem - with stepped approximation to sine wave - which most of the UPS' in this discussion are mentioned.

True sine wave output is a feature on UPS' that are out of the price range of most PC users. I don't have a smart ups in front of me to test with a scope, but I don't believe it's a true sine wave output - it still has steps. (but are finer than say a cheaper unit)

We have Ferrups units and they are bulletproof and have absolutely no break in power when the mains fail. They are expensive, hot, and noisy - most folks would not want them in their office.

 

[coolpurplefan]

For the Tripp Lite Omni VS 1500, it says: "Automatic Voltage Regulation (AVR) circuits regulate brownouts as low as 75 and overvoltages up to 147 volts back to usable 120V levels without using battery power." Does Automatic Voltage Regulation mean line conditioner?

I thought it was included in the Omni VS1500 but now I'm not sure...?

 

[Zepper]

The more you are willing to pay, the wider the range of steps on the transformer. Looks like that Omni has a pretty wide range. Line conditioner is supposed to handle surges and spikes, noise filtering plus a range of voltage correction. So yes, the Omni has a degree of line conditioning.

.bh.