Possible coup in Turkey

[theeedude]

I am fine 🙂 Thankfully I never needed to be an Erdogan or Gulen sympathizer to do well in school or work. Plus, I am an atheist so they would probably stone me to death, not arrest me. Thank you for your concern 🙂

Good to hear, I hope you find a way to move to the West, so you don't have to pay taxes to subsidize these Islamist autocrats.

 

[sontakke]

Do you believe Trump Supporters will be welcoming him with open arms???????

 

[agent00f]

Let's hope they assume he's one of the good ones.

 

[Jaskalas]

Turkey continues its alignment with Russia.

Turkey accuses Ukraine of participating in military coup

What will Turkey look like after the Erdogan revolution?
Whose ally will they be?

Erdogan will visit Russia on August 9

 

[agent00f]

Pretty ironic considering a defining attribute of abrahamic religion is division of the world into good/evil with oneself always conveniently on the right side.

The reality is ergodan's well aware we want his allegiance so he plays hard to get.

 

[chucky2]

Christ Bummer and Billary, please don't let Turkey get F-35!

 

[werepossum]

Christ Bummer and Billary, please don't let Turkey get F-35!

That's going to be a huge windfall for the Clinton Family Foundation.

Assuming Turkey even WANTS the F-35.

 

[Jaskalas]

A close-up of Campbell's Turkish team that attempted coup

Bakır and Topçu have been working with Campbell, the former U.S. Commander of the International Security Assistance Forces (ISAF), a NATO force in Afghanistan, for a long time during their duty in ISAF.

Campbell retired from his post in ISAF earlier this year and undertook the “duty" for organizing the coup in Turkey.

After his retirement in March, Campbell started working with an 80-person team of the American Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) to organize a group of Fetullah Terrorist Organization (FETÖ) gangs inside the Turkish military.

It's a bad time to be a member of NATO in Turkey right now.

 

[norseamd]

A close-up of Campbell's Turkish team that attempted coup

It's a bad time to be a member of NATO in Turkey right now.

What the fucking fuck did I just read?

And we still have not taken our nuclear weapons out of there yet?

 

[chucky2]

That's going to be a huge windfall for the Clinton Family Foundation.

Assuming Turkey even WANTS the F-35.

Oh, they'll want it. Russia will make it worth their while, for sure. If you were Turkey wouldn't you want both the best strike fighter out plus the $$$ under the table in your personal account from Russia?

 

[agent00f]

Readers might want to take Ergodan controlled publications with larger than usual grain of salt.

 

[bshole]

Readers might want to take Ergodan controlled publications with larger than usual grain of salt.

No they shouldn't. They shape the worldview of the Turkish people. He who controls the information, CONTROLS EVERY FUCKING THING. It is absolutely critical that the Turkish people are allowed to see information outside of the propaganda of its Islamist leader. Without that, they will follow him right back into the dark ages.

Despite legal provisions, media freedom in Turkey has steadily deteriorated over the last five years[when?]. Since 2013, Freedom House ranks Turkey as "Not Free".[2] Reporters Without Borders rank Turkey at the 149th place out of over 180 countries, between Mexico and DR Congo, with a score of 44.16[3] In the third quarter of 2015, the independent Turkish press agency Bianet recorded a strengthening of attacks on the opposition media during AKP interim government.[4] The final 2015 Bianet's monitoring report confirmed this alarming trend and underlined that once regained majority after the AKP interim government period, the Turkish government further intensified its pressure on the country's media.[5]

 

[agent00f]

No they shouldn't. They shape the worldview of the Turkish people. He who controls the information, CONTROLS EVERY FUCKING THING. It is absolutely critical that the Turkish people are allowed to see information outside of the propaganda of its Islamist leader. Without that, they will follow him right back into the dark ages.

I was just pointing out that the link above some are taking seriously comes from a Erdogan paper.

 

[werepossum]

Oh, they'll want it. Russia will make it worth their while, for sure. If you were Turkey wouldn't you want both the best strike fighter out plus the $$$ under the table in your personal account from Russia?

Good point. My point was that if Turkey buys the F-35, then they are susceptible to the USA cutting off spare parts and engineering assistance, and that's assuming that we don't build in any kill switches. However, clearly Russia would love to have a dozen or so examples with trained pilots and technicians, so that they could not only take it apart but actually fly against it.

 

[Oric]

http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archive...ly/23/the-real-story-behind-the-turkish-coup/

The west’s response to the crisis was disgraceful.

Instead of immediately supporting Turkey’s besieged democratic government, Washington, London, Paris and Ottawa all issued only lukewarm, half-hearted support. President Erdogan is not liked, particularly by the US. He is a Muslim, too independent-minded, insufficiently response to American demands in spite of his support for the anti-ISIS war in Syria and Iraq. Perhaps worst of all, Erdogan is sometimes critical of Israel over its repression of the Palestinians.

As a result, leading US neocon papers, like the Wall Street Journal, Washington Post, and NY Times drip with venom over Erdogan. CNN’s coverage of the coup was astoundingly biased and nasty, worthy of the old Pravda. The anti-Erdogan neocons began spreading the ludicrous canard that the coup was a false-flag operation staged by the Turkish leader himself. It was the real thing. Even Turkey’s opposition parties sided with Erdogan’s AK.

Erdogan is hardly perfect. He is often too authoritarian and made a mess in Syria. But his triumph in protecting Turkey’s hard-won democracy should be lauded and strongly supported by his NATO allies, starting with the US – which was quick to support the brutal military coup in Egypt. Time for Washington to come clean on its murky links to Gulen.

 

[agent00f]

http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archive...ly/23/the-real-story-behind-the-turkish-coup/

Ergodan is really not helping his case with the purge.

 

[chucky2]

Good point. My point was that if Turkey buys the F-35, then they are susceptible to the USA cutting off spare parts and engineering assistance, and that's assuming that we don't build in any kill switches. However, clearly Russia would love to have a dozen or so examples with trained pilots and technicians, so that they could not only take it apart but actually fly against it.

I don't know if Turkey would ever be that overt, but they could simply have an "accident" where a panel gets lost/damaged and the Russians end up being able to get production stealth coatings/materials that they otherwise would have a hard time procuring. Not to mention getting to see the systems and hardware, obtaining copies of them, etc. We already know the F-35 is going to smoke anything flying short of an F-22 (and even then, because of better sensor fusion, it will be able to give F-22 a run for money), so the Russians aren't going to be looking at how it performs physically. They need to be able to beat the stealth and sensors, that's why giving an F-35 to Turkey and risking they get access is stupid. But, Turkey is in NATO, and, getting F-35 orders is important to LM and Gov...so....

 

[Jaskalas]

Readers might want to take Ergodan controlled publications with larger than usual grain of salt.

What Ergodan tells his people is important. It informs us as to what he and his people are likely to do next. And blaming NATO / US for the coup is very telling. He can switch sides and no longer worry about "Democracy".

 

[Jaskalas]

What the fucking fuck did I just read?

Here's "another" source.

Former NATO commander ‘behind failed coup against Erdogan’

According to Yeni Safak, Campbell "also managed more than $2 billion in transactions via UBA Bank in Nigeria by using CIA links to distribute among the pro-coup military personnel in Turkey."

The retired US general had allegedly paid "at least two secret visits" to Turkey since May up to the attempted coup, which the Turkish authorities blamed on what they call the Fethullah Terrorist Organization (FETO).

 

[agent00f]

Just fyi, rt is russian government, and tends to be liable to report anything that makes the US look bad. Doesn't mean it's untrue, but keep that in mind.

 

[Jaskalas]

Just fyi, rt is russian government, and tends to be liable to report anything that makes the US look bad. Doesn't mean it's untrue, but keep that in mind.

You think the truth matters in politics? Because in Turkey, Russia, and elsewhere... those reports are known to THEIR people as the truth. It's what at least half the world is going to believe. That a United States General and NATO Commander lead the coup.

We have to address those beliefs whether they are real or not.

 

[agent00f]

You think the truth matters in politics? Because in Turkey, Russia, and elsewhere... those reports are known to THEIR people as the truth. It's what at least half the world is going to believe. That a United States General and NATO Commander lead the coup.

We have to address those beliefs whether they are real or not.

Sure, so long as we're clear this is what Erdogan wants people (by that it's mostly his domestic audience) to think.

He's then going to ask for minor concessions and we're going to give them because calling his bluff of going to the other side might be costly. He looks good in front of the base and stays a dictator we can count on for a while.

 

[sontakke]

Anybody who thinks following statement is true was born yesterday.

After his retirement in March, Campbell started working with an 80-person team of the American Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) to organize a group of Fetullah Terrorist Organization (FETÖ) gangs inside the Turkish military.

Nobody names their own organization "Terrrorist" organization; not even ISIS!

That should have been your clue that it was an Onion (style) article.

 

[Jaskalas]

Anybody who thinks following statement is true was born yesterday.

Nobody names their own organization "Terrrorist" organization; not even ISIS!

That should have been your clue that it was an Onion (style) article.

Hence why I linked RT. That's not onion, it's from Turkey. And if you don't like what Erdogan is saying about us... well, what are we going to do, kick him out of NATO?

I'm betting our leaders are preparing to hand over Gulen. As well as giving a free pass to human rights violations during the Erdogan revolution. They cannot imagine a world in which we don't beg Turkey to remain in NATO.

 

[werepossum]

I don't know if Turkey would ever be that overt, but they could simply have an "accident" where a panel gets lost/damaged and the Russians end up being able to get production stealth coatings/materials that they otherwise would have a hard time procuring. Not to mention getting to see the systems and hardware, obtaining copies of them, etc. We already know the F-35 is going to smoke anything flying short of an F-22 (and even then, because of better sensor fusion, it will be able to give F-22 a run for money), so the Russians aren't going to be looking at how it performs physically. They need to be able to beat the stealth and sensors, that's why giving an F-35 to Turkey and risking they get access is stupid. But, Turkey is in NATO, and, getting F-35 orders is important to LM and Gov...so....

No warplane is perfect. What Russia would want is knowledge about the engagement window (how the F-35 appears to their systems, how their aircraft appear on the F-35 systems), the effects of types of jamming systems, where the F-35 is better and where it is worse than competing Russian designs. If one knows where one's advantages lie, then good pilots have a huge advantage.

In World War II, Vietnam and Korea the American designs were outclassed by German/Japanese and Soviet designs, but (after the initial learning period) managed positive kill ratios. The Zero for instance was a much better fighter than the Wildcat - better speed, better turning radius, heavier armament, better climbing and acceleration, sharper angle of attack. The Wildcat had only a few advantages - better diving speed, better roll, heavier build, and more ammo. The Zero's advantages also lessened at high altitude. Initially American pilots were massacred. Later, having figured out the zero's advantages, American doctrine shifted to maximize the Wildcat's advantages and minimize the Zero's advantages. By the time the much superior Hellcat was introduced, American pilots of similar training and experience had a favorable kill ratio due to this.

This is what I meant. If Russian pilots are free to fly the F-35 against Russian planes, they go into any conflict knowing where their aircraft have advantages and disadvantages. No aircraft is better at everything, but intimately knowing your opponent's advantages and disadvantages initially is a huge advantage over the guy who has to figure it out from gun footage, radar and air shows.