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Poll: Who Is Right?
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Zenmervolt
Elite member
Everyone and no-one. 🙂
ZV
Amused
Elite Member
How I see it:
People who believe success comes from hard work will more likely be successful. Those who believe it comes from luck or family will be less likely to become very successful.
One thinks wealth is given, and therefore will not strive for it. The other thinks wealth is earned, and WILL strive for it.
This poll is making a backwards assumption. Why not ask this question of middle and lower class people at high school graduation, and follow up in 20 years. The answers to this poll are simply self fulfilling prophecies. If you sit around waiting for wealth to fall in your lap, you'll never get it.
People who believe success comes from hard work will more likely be successful. Those who believe it comes from luck or family will be less likely to become very successful.
One thinks wealth is given, and therefore will not strive for it. The other thinks wealth is earned, and WILL strive for it.
This poll is making a backwards assumption. Why not ask this question of middle and lower class people at high school graduation, and follow up in 20 years. The answers to this poll are simply self fulfilling prophecies. If you sit around waiting for wealth to fall in your lap, you'll never get it.
eplebnista
Lifer
Hard Work
Pure luck.
No matter how hard you work, if your luck sucks, no one will notice.
A University education means little if you don't use it. If you're unlucky, the dean will find you in his daughter's bed and expel you.
If you are born into money, bad luck will wipe it out.
Luck is pretty much the only factor in the lottery.
Disttilled version:
Good luck makes up for any shortcomings. Bad luck wipes out any blessings.
Oh, and don't forget bad luck will have you meet your Maker too early to even begin earning success.
No matter how hard you work, if your luck sucks, no one will notice.
A University education means little if you don't use it. If you're unlucky, the dean will find you in his daughter's bed and expel you.
If you are born into money, bad luck will wipe it out.
Luck is pretty much the only factor in the lottery.
Disttilled version:
Good luck makes up for any shortcomings. Bad luck wipes out any blessings.
Oh, and don't forget bad luck will have you meet your Maker too early to even begin earning success.
sandorski
No Lifer
University Education
The reason:
First a definition of success: Success is not in being a billionaire, or acheiving some type of excess wealth. It is in acheiving a comfortable level of wealth, being the ability to own a home, raise a family, not worry about food or clothing, being able to afford reasonable levels of luxuries, and being able to retire without concern for fiscal matters. That's more or less my definition.
A University Education is the *most* likely way for anyone to acheive this level of financial status. That's not to ignore the other options, for they all could acheive "success", it's just that only University Education required careers offer that "success" to the masses.
Hard Work comes close and in fact without it a University Education is near impossible, but on the whole Hard Work alone can only acheive "success" for a small segment of society. Although, often those who acheive "success" through Hard Work alone can acheive much more wealth than a University Educated "success".
I think the problem with many who think Hard Work alone will make them successful is, that they look at a University "success"(Doctors, Lawyers, Executives) and are impressed, but then the Societal Hard Work Hero gains their attention and suddenly the Upper Middle Class/Lower Upper Class loses it's shine. They then dream of excess wealth as "success" and dismiss Education. Big mistake.
Rich relatives are great, but if you don't have them.....well.
Luck: This can work, but you have to accept fate as your guide whether it works or not. 🙂 Those who rely on Hard Work need some Luck, those who don't have Rich Relatives have no Luck, and those who get a University Education minimize their need for Luck.
The reason:
First a definition of success: Success is not in being a billionaire, or acheiving some type of excess wealth. It is in acheiving a comfortable level of wealth, being the ability to own a home, raise a family, not worry about food or clothing, being able to afford reasonable levels of luxuries, and being able to retire without concern for fiscal matters. That's more or less my definition.
A University Education is the *most* likely way for anyone to acheive this level of financial status. That's not to ignore the other options, for they all could acheive "success", it's just that only University Education required careers offer that "success" to the masses.
Hard Work comes close and in fact without it a University Education is near impossible, but on the whole Hard Work alone can only acheive "success" for a small segment of society. Although, often those who acheive "success" through Hard Work alone can acheive much more wealth than a University Educated "success".
I think the problem with many who think Hard Work alone will make them successful is, that they look at a University "success"(Doctors, Lawyers, Executives) and are impressed, but then the Societal Hard Work Hero gains their attention and suddenly the Upper Middle Class/Lower Upper Class loses it's shine. They then dream of excess wealth as "success" and dismiss Education. Big mistake.
Rich relatives are great, but if you don't have them.....well.
Luck: This can work, but you have to accept fate as your guide whether it works or not. 🙂 Those who rely on Hard Work need some Luck, those who don't have Rich Relatives have no Luck, and those who get a University Education minimize their need for Luck.
Amused
Elite Member
Connections: If you don't have them, you make them
Luck: Myth. Your fortune is your own. If the dean finds you in bed with his daughter, that's is your bad judgement, not "luck."
Dell and Gates MADE their money. There are many more like them who came from middle and lower class families.
The only good choice in this poll after hard work is an education. But even an education is meaningless unless you're willing to work hard.
Luck: Myth. Your fortune is your own. If the dean finds you in bed with his daughter, that's is your bad judgement, not "luck."
Dell and Gates MADE their money. There are many more like them who came from middle and lower class families.
The only good choice in this poll after hard work is an education. But even an education is meaningless unless you're willing to work hard.
Skyclad1uhm1
Lifer
You can work extremely hard, 24/7, as toiler cleaner, and you still won't make half the money a doctor makes. If you have a sh!tload of luck success may just drop into your lap, like winning the lottery, but else you at least need something to base it on.
Vic
Elite Member
"Hard work" isn't just manual labor. It means using your brains as well to get ahead.
I've met many successful people, and they all have one thing in common. They work hard (and apply themselves well, same thing but it takes out the stupid toilet cleaner comparison).
As for success, what is it? Not just being rich, that's an immature fantasy. Money makes things better but it does not solve all problems, nor does it bring happiness in and of itself. I've met many wealthy people, self-made wealthy people, who were not successful. For example, many of them worked 80 hour weeks, sacrificing friends and family, and despite their wealth were bitter and unhappy.
Success is not a destination but a never-ending journey. It is placing goals ahead of you, reaching those goals, and then moving onwards to bigger and better goals, reaching those and moving still further on. It is consistent and constant self-improvement which (many of you will find and some of you I'm sure know already) is the only environment that allows us humans to be truly happy.
To define it better: stagnation is to success as poor is to rich.
Perhaps the best success catch phrase I can think of right now is "Don't work harder, work smarter." Or Heinlein's definition of happiness, "Happiness is working long, hard hours at something you really love doing for the benefit of people you really love."
Luck? never heard of it, good or bad.
University degree? folks, my job is to take loan applications from people all day long. Of the many questions I ask, income and education are included. My findings after many years of doing this? If you want to be affluent middle class, get the best degree you can. It provides certification and opens doors. If you want to be truly wealthy, self-made wealthy, don't bother.
I've met many successful people, and they all have one thing in common. They work hard (and apply themselves well, same thing but it takes out the stupid toilet cleaner comparison).
As for success, what is it? Not just being rich, that's an immature fantasy. Money makes things better but it does not solve all problems, nor does it bring happiness in and of itself. I've met many wealthy people, self-made wealthy people, who were not successful. For example, many of them worked 80 hour weeks, sacrificing friends and family, and despite their wealth were bitter and unhappy.
Success is not a destination but a never-ending journey. It is placing goals ahead of you, reaching those goals, and then moving onwards to bigger and better goals, reaching those and moving still further on. It is consistent and constant self-improvement which (many of you will find and some of you I'm sure know already) is the only environment that allows us humans to be truly happy.
To define it better: stagnation is to success as poor is to rich.
Perhaps the best success catch phrase I can think of right now is "Don't work harder, work smarter." Or Heinlein's definition of happiness, "Happiness is working long, hard hours at something you really love doing for the benefit of people you really love."
Luck? never heard of it, good or bad.
University degree? folks, my job is to take loan applications from people all day long. Of the many questions I ask, income and education are included. My findings after many years of doing this? If you want to be affluent middle class, get the best degree you can. It provides certification and opens doors. If you want to be truly wealthy, self-made wealthy, don't bother.
Skyclad1uhm1
Lifer
If you buy a lottery ticket and win $25M, is that hard work or ambition according to you?
Luck does exist.
Amused
Elite Member
That's not luck. You happened to have the right combo of numbers. But there is no such thing as "luck."
"Luck" implies some kind of supernatural force.
Main Entry: [1]luck
Pronunciation: 'l&k
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English lucke, from Middle Dutch luc; akin to Middle High German gelücke luck
Date: 15th century
a force that brings good fortune or adversity
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