Poll: Vinyl or CD?

[Triumph]

Originally posted by: glen
The clue as to which is better is that you can make a CD sound like vinyl by degrading the sound quality.
But, you can't make vinyl sound like a CD.
Folks love to feel special, and the more someone wants to feel special the more they will ignore reality.
People like to think they are that special person who has to listen to vinyl, sort fo like the Princess and the Pea.

exactly. many vinyl purists think they can hear the pea.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: cressida
Digital will alway have that step between bits, which you could increase the bits but it would be $$. Some people still perfer vinyl since it doesn't have the step. I prefer CD as mentioned beacause of portability.

There is no step.
The signal is analog. It is produced by the digital to analog converter.
People who tell you they hear that "step" are poor listeners, and don't understand math very well.

 

[NutBucket]

Even on my relatively "crappy" setup my vinyl still sounds better to me then CDs. I do comparisons between store-bought cds and LPs of the same album and vinyl wins every time. When I first bought my turntable I bought Moby's Play on LP and was simply blown away by the sound. I did back-to-back comparisons and my friends all agreed. I haven't been buying many LPs lately but I still prefer the way they sound. I'm tempted to try out SACDs.

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919

Originally posted by: Jzero

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919

Originally posted by: Jzero
I find vinyl to be less "fatiguing." My ears don't get tired after hours of listening to vinyl. Sound quality-wise, I really can't tell the difference between vinyl that isn't beat to hell and a CD. I'm just not that picky.

it depends on what you're listening to. you can't put a hot mix on vinyl.

I'm not sure I follow you...you mean you can't burn your own records? That doesn't have much to do with what one thinks sounds better...

a hot mix is one that is 'loud', and isn't very dynamic. you can't do that with vinyl or the needle will skip out of the grooves.

So what you're saying is that the reason my ears don't feel as fatigued is because the levels on the record are "softer" than they might be on the CD? That could well be...

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: Triumph
Since the title of the thread is "which sounds better to you, I can't really argue with anyone. They do sound different. But there are analogue purists out there who claim as fact that analogue sounds better. These people have simply convinced themselves that it sounds better because they want it to sound better. Many of them want to pretend that they have some sort of ultra sensitive hearing that can discern the minutest difference. They want to be part of a made up, self determined elite group of audio enthusiasts. It's really a case of self dillusion and mild dementia. Reading places like rec.music.audio makes me sick.

But if you enjoy it, then hey, whatever.

sure, but check out any science on "which reproduces the original waveform" and you'll find vinyl/reel-to-reel superior.

It really does have less to do with any sort of elitest group and more to do with music.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: glen
You can make a CD sound like vinyl.
Drop the bottom end at 40hz, roll of the lows from 120 to 40hz, roll off the highs, and compress the music to a 70db range

OK glen, I'm calling you out...

please post recordings that use the full dymanic range of a CD. You and I both know most modern CDs are mixed at a about 25 db.

-edit-

ps - I know we are both pretty hard core audio entusiasts (sp?), just getting a friendly debate going.

:beer:

 

[cressida]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: cressida
Digital will alway have that step between bits, which you could increase the bits but it would be $$. Some people still perfer vinyl since it doesn't have the step. I prefer CD as mentioned beacause of portability.

There is no step.
The signal is analog. It is produced by the digital to analog converter.
People who tell you they hear that "step" are poor listeners, and don't understand math very well.

*Shrug* That's what my EE professor told the class.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
The clue as to which is better is that you can make a CD sound like vinyl by degrading the sound quality.
But, you can't make vinyl sound like a CD.
Folks love to feel special, and the more someone wants to feel special the more they will ignore reality.
People like to think they are that special person who has to listen to vinyl, sort fo like the Princess and the Pea.

Glen,

I ask you - have you ever heard a nice analog setup or been in a recording studio? Its pretty darn incredible.

My main speakers are these:
here
and I have heard more expensive, but not better.
In fact I like mine more that any electrosttics I ahve heard.

 

[cronos]

true audiophiles will vote for vinyl, i guess.
they sound the same to me.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: cressida


*Shrug* That's what my EE professor told the class.

Ask him what the D/A converter does.
If he can't explain it, get your tuition money back.

The digital medium has "steps" but the D/A converter turns it into a wave.

 

[Triumph]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: Triumph
Since the title of the thread is "which sounds better to you, I can't really argue with anyone. They do sound different. But there are analogue purists out there who claim as fact that analogue sounds better. These people have simply convinced themselves that it sounds better because they want it to sound better. Many of them want to pretend that they have some sort of ultra sensitive hearing that can discern the minutest difference. They want to be part of a made up, self determined elite group of audio enthusiasts. It's really a case of self dillusion and mild dementia. Reading places like rec.music.audio makes me sick.

But if you enjoy it, then hey, whatever.

sure, but check out any science on "which reproduces the original waveform" and you'll find vinyl/reel-to-reel superior.

It really does have less to do with any sort of elitest group and more to do with music.

The fact of the matter is that many so-called audiophiles couldn't pick out the vinyl source a significant percentage of the time in a properly conducted blind A/B comparison.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
You can make a CD sound like vinyl.
Drop the bottom end at 40hz, roll of the lows from 120 to 40hz, roll off the highs, and compress the music to a 70db range

OK glen, I'm calling you out...

please post recordings that use the full dymanic range of a CD. You and I both know most modern CDs are mixed at a about 25 db.

-edit-

ps - I know we are both pretty hard core audio entusiasts (sp?), just getting a friendly debate going.

:beer:

Telarc - I win.

😀

 

[cressida]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: cressida


*Shrug* That's what my EE professor told the class.

Ask him what the D/A converter does.
If he can't explain it, get your tuition money back.

The digital medium has "steps" but the D/A converter turns it into a wave.

It's okay, I can't ever understand him with his German accent. 🙁

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
The clue as to which is better is that you can make a CD sound like vinyl by degrading the sound quality.
But, you can't make vinyl sound like a CD.
Folks love to feel special, and the more someone wants to feel special the more they will ignore reality.
People like to think they are that special person who has to listen to vinyl, sort fo like the Princess and the Pea.

Glen,

I ask you - have you ever heard a nice analog setup or been in a recording studio? Its pretty darn incredible.

My main speakers are these:
here
and I have heard more expensive, but not better.
In fact I like mine more that any electrosttics I ahve heard.

I always liked legacies. But to each his own. I love my electrostats and maybe it is because the are so unforgiving of the source that I prefer analog.

cheers!

For reference I have never, ever, ever heard a stereo truly reproduce the real thing. But man...horns, strings, guitar sure do sound good to me.

That's the great thing - we get to choose what we like. I prefer tone, you prefer slam.
😉

 

[Jzero]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: cressida


*Shrug* That's what my EE professor told the class.

Ask him what the D/A converter does.
If he can't explain it, get your tuition money back.

The digital medium has "steps" but the D/A converter turns it into a wave.

The DAC turns the digital signal into a wave, but for obvious reasons, it cannot clone the exact wave that the digital signal was based on.

You might think audiophiles are full of it when they say they can hear that the data is missing, but at least they are "technically" right that there is missing data....

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
You can make a CD sound like vinyl.
Drop the bottom end at 40hz, roll of the lows from 120 to 40hz, roll off the highs, and compress the music to a 70db range

OK glen, I'm calling you out...

please post recordings that use the full dymanic range of a CD. You and I both know most modern CDs are mixed at a about 25 db.

-edit-

ps - I know we are both pretty hard core audio entusiasts (sp?), just getting a friendly debate going.

:beer:

Telarc - I win.

😀

point, but tell me you haven't felt dynamic range with a good DJ on some turntables.

but we are turning this into a planar vs. distortion box debate and we all know who wins that one.

heheheheheehe

😉

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
The clue as to which is better is that you can make a CD sound like vinyl by degrading the sound quality.
But, you can't make vinyl sound like a CD.
Folks love to feel special, and the more someone wants to feel special the more they will ignore reality.
People like to think they are that special person who has to listen to vinyl, sort fo like the Princess and the Pea.

Glen,

I ask you - have you ever heard a nice analog setup or been in a recording studio? Its pretty darn incredible.

My main speakers are these:
here
and I have heard more expensive, but not better.
In fact I like mine more that any electrosttics I ahve heard.

I always liked legacies. But to each his own. I love my electrostats and maybe it is because the are so unforgiving of the source that I prefer analog.

cheers!

For reference I have never, ever, ever heard a stereo truly reproduce the real thing. But man...horns, strings, guitar sure do sound good to me.

That's the great thing - we get to choose what we like. I prefer tone, you prefer slam.
😉

you can get slam with a really nice sub.
What electro statics do you have?
My favorites have always been the Acoustat 2+2'shere are the legendary Acoustat 2+2's

 

[Triumph]

Originally posted by: spidey07
For reference I have never, ever, ever heard a stereo truly reproduce the real thing. But man...horns, strings, guitar sure do sound good to me.

That's the great thing - we get to choose what we like. I prefer tone, you prefer slam.
😉

That's very true, for any medium. It will never sound like the instrument is in your room. On the other hand, I've been to so many horrible sounding non-classical concerts that I leave wanting to only listen to the artist on CD!

 

[Howard]

Originally posted by: Twerpzilla
With a solid state amp you have crap for high freq

OK, chief!

 

[spidey07]

http://pics.bbzzdd.com/users/spidey07/2-ch.jpg

martin logan ReQuest...the true affordable gems of their line IMHO which later turned into the prodigies. Large 4x2 panel with a sealed 12" woofer crossed at 180 and absolute murder on an amp.

But I love them for the price I paid. spooky real. Before purchasing them I listened to a whole lot of speakers and continually I came back to them.

-edit- but I digress, if we're talking what "sounds" better then my vote goes for vinyl.

But SACD and DVD-a are closing the gap.

I'm sorry, but most all CDs have that brittle/tizzlely sound and only the best recordings sound good. all in the mix baby.

 

[glen]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: glen
You can make a CD sound like vinyl.
Drop the bottom end at 40hz, roll of the lows from 120 to 40hz, roll off the highs, and compress the music to a 70db range

OK glen, I'm calling you out...

please post recordings that use the full dymanic range of a CD. You and I both know most modern CDs are mixed at a about 25 db.

-edit-

ps - I know we are both pretty hard core audio entusiasts (sp?), just getting a friendly debate going.

:beer:

Telarc - I win.

😀

point, but tell me you haven't felt dynamic range with a good DJ on some turntables.

but we are turning this into a planar vs. distortion box debate and we all know who wins that one.

heheheheheehe

😉

When my susb hit, your bladder automatically empties. Ask, Viper or FFM, he (Viper) is using 1 of my subs. I was using 4. And, I have 6 12" in my mains.

 

[spidey07]

when my stats hit a cello and you rub your eyes looking for the cello player in the room or when the guitar sounds like he's in the room or maybe the spook sax player in my living room...well, then....

😉

 

[Twerpzilla]

Triumph, not BS at all, on a good tube amp, good tube preamp and good turntable system, the LP will sound so much better it will be a no brainer. Get a 330B SET amp, some Klipsh Khorns, and a Linn turntable and you will hear the differnce too. You may be shocked. I was.

Glen, I have heard $60,000 systems that sounded like ass. Its not the $$$ spent, but what u spend them on. I friend of mine just bought a used AES 300b amp, had another friend of mine build him a tube line stage, and just picked up some used Klipsch Fortes. Using another friends phono stage and TT, he has beautiful sound. The CD's sound remarkably good, but the vinyl is a step beyond what CD's are able to do. Maybe $2000 in the system, will have maybe another $1000 into a phone stage and TT in the next few weeks.

 

Originally posted by: Triumph

Originally posted by: spidey07
For reference I have never, ever, ever heard a stereo truly reproduce the real thing. But man...horns, strings, guitar sure do sound good to me.

That's the great thing - we get to choose what we like. I prefer tone, you prefer slam.
😉

That's very true, for any medium. It will never sound like the instrument is in your room. On the other hand, I've been to so many horrible sounding non-classical concerts that I leave wanting to only listen to the artist on CD!

have you heard dvd-audio?
it's amazing

 

[Rage187]

Had to go w/ the vinyl since I'm addicted to it.


Fear the Black Crack!

About a $100 a week habit.