Poll :: New Case, or New HSFs

Hard Ball

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I have been looking at getting better cooling for the first system in my sig; especially for the summer months, since I don't have A/C in my room. Thanks to all who answered questions about HSFs, and Cases in my three previous threads in C&C forum.

Now I think my next purchase would be either this case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811133154

Or a pair of these heatsinks:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835118223

Now, the question is, which of these purchases would help to keep my CPUs cooler. I know, I know, if I can get both, that will be the best solution, but I think I can only justify one of the purchases in the next little while. So which should it be??
 

zagood

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There may be a problem with mounting dual 9500s. There was someone else that had a dual CPU system and was looking at them, then decided not to because they would interfere with each other.

Not having any dual CPU motherboards, I don't know what to suggest.

I would say though that the new case would be the place to start. You're dishing out a lot of hot air from those dual Opties, better to start with getting that air out of the case first.

-z
 

potato28

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Ask Fullmetal Chocobo for HS/F conflicts, but I'd buy the HS/F since you dont have AC. BTW what case do you have currently?
 

Hard Ball

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Thanks,

I guess I didn't give sufficient information;

A poster at 2cpu.com actually confirmed to me that dual 9500s will work with my motherboard; here:
http://waffles.gotdns.com:81/Computer%2...20more%20mods/Zalman%209500%20install/
So that is not a concern.

My current case, while certainly not the same as the thermaltake xaser, is not completely aweful int eh cooling department either. My current case is almost exactly like this (different PSU, of course):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811144007

And my current HSFs are these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835106034

So now, with more information, would I better off getting the new case, or the new HSFs.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Corporate Thug
honestly, the CNPS 9500 is overpriced.

I would get a XP90 for ~ $30 and get very similar performance


Thanks for the suggestion;

But by the looks of it, Thermalright won't be able to fit without some major difficulty on Asus K8N-DL, at least if I want to attach fan to it. The CNPS was selected in part because it was actually reasonably easy to install on a dual socket system where two sockets are vertially arranged in close proximity.
 

Fullmetal Chocobo

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Well, given the fact that I've upgrade my HSFs several times now, from stock, to the Swiftech MCX603's, to my current pair of Thermalright SI-9XV's, I'd say go with the HSFs, as they seem to have the grestest effect.. I've also upgraded and changed around the fans in my case to see how the temps would change, and it was minimal.

I've went to extensive lengths to minimize the delta between the two procs to little avail, but the temps themselves are a lot lower. I would recommend setting up either a fan or blow-holes to provide fresh air to the procs, as that has made the biggest difference insofar as the case goes...
 

Zap

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Oct 13, 1999
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Your existing case is fine provided you're pushing enough RPMs in those fans. I had one (same chassis) and it did a fine job cooling, except it just wasn't very quiet (not noisy, just not quiet). If you want to run very quiet then you'll want a case with larger diameter exhaust fans, otherwise yours is fine.

Your HSFs aren't the best but no need to spend $120 on better HSFs.

Thermalright XP-80 with fan $25 for two

Okay, just kidding about the name, but basically if you take an XP-90 and shrink it a bit to make it work with an 80mm fan instead of 92mm fan, then you'd have these quad-heatpipe copper base coolers that ship with the new socket 939 retail box Opterons and higher end x2 CPUs. There's a thread about these that has been active the past few days. People have been getting great results and some have ditched their XP-90s in favor of these. Getting two with fans for less than the price of one XP-90 without fan (comparing shipped price) is a bargain. Get 'em while the getting is good!!! Being that these are retail box HSFs, they clip in just like stock fans and they'll most likely fit your board.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Zap
Your existing case is fine provided you're pushing enough RPMs in those fans. I had one (same chassis) and it did a fine job cooling, except it just wasn't very quiet (not noisy, just not quiet). If you want to run very quiet then you'll want a case with larger diameter exhaust fans, otherwise yours is fine.

Your HSFs aren't the best but no need to spend $120 on better HSFs.

Thermalright XP-80 with fan $25 for two

Okay, just kidding about the name, but basically if you take an XP-90 and shrink it a bit to make it work with an 80mm fan instead of 92mm fan, then you'd have these quad-heatpipe copper base coolers that ship with the new socket 939 retail box Opterons and higher end x2 CPUs. There's a thread about these that has been active the past few days. People have been getting great results and some have ditched their XP-90s in favor of these. Getting two with fans for less than the price of one XP-90 without fan (comparing shipped price) is a bargain. Get 'em while the getting is good!!! Being that these are retail box HSFs, they clip in just like stock fans and they'll most likely fit your board.

Hey, that looks like a pretty robust cooling device, cudos to AMD for making it standard for the X2s; and thanks for pointing that out to me.

I have some serious doubts though, whether two of those will be able to able to fit onto my mobo, here is a picture of it:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Showimage...tended+ATX+Server+Motherboard+-+Retail

The two sockets are vertically aligned (in the orientation of the retention clips), and only slightly more than the width of an IHS apart; so just by visually inspecting int the new AMD HSF and the board, it looks like that either two of them simply won't have enough space, or it will take some major work to get the retention mechanism to work. Plus, the HSF dosn't list S940 compatibility.

Can anyone confirm or deny that it will or will not work with dual S940 boards? specifically Asus K8N-DL??


Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Well, given the fact that I've upgrade my HSFs several times now, from stock, to the Swiftech MCX603's, to my current pair of Thermalright SI-9XV's, I'd say go with the HSFs, as they seem to have the grestest effect.. I've also upgraded and changed around the fans in my case to see how the temps would change, and it was minimal.

I've went to extensive lengths to minimize the delta between the two procs to little avail, but the temps themselves are a lot lower. I would recommend setting up either a fan or blow-holes to provide fresh air to the procs, as that has made the biggest difference insofar as the case goes...

Thanks for the tip; maybe modding the case a little would help some as well, then I wouldn't have to choose between improving the HSFs and the case air flow. Would would be some good location to add extra fans, blow holes through the case??

I am thinking about getting a couple of these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835888104
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835888701
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811999482

any of the above, and reverse the direction of the air flow, so that they will pull air out of the case; and then place these on the top 5" bays, so that they will help vent hot air from the case. Would this plan work? is reversing the air flow on these HDD coolers feasible?
 

Zap

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Oct 13, 1999
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A friend of mine also has the Asus board and his reported temps are quite different between the two CPUs. I don't know if he ever found out if one socket was reporting higher temps or if it was one of the CPUs (by swapping sockets). A HSF that will work on socket 754 will also work on 939 and 940 since they all use the same mounting mechanism. I think these retail box HSFs will fit fine because if you look at the picture, they have the same clipping mechanism as all other retail box HSFs, and it looks as if no part of the heatsink extends past the clip. I could be wrong of course... perhaps someone who actually has one of these can verify. If you wait a few days I should receive mine (probably by Wednesday).
 

Fullmetal Chocobo

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What mods you do to improve air flow completely depend upon your setup. For example, when I had the Swiftech coolers, I was looking at installing fans right about the HSFs. But with my current SI-9XVs, the best thing would be to blow air across them. Best would be from the bottom, into the first fan, but that isn't possible due to the video card. Instead I'm installing a 120mm fan in front of the HSFs, and then using a duct (once I fvcking find one. OIY) to blow it back onto the two HSFs. So get what you are going to get, and then start making plans for what other measures of cooling can be accomplished for your setup. If you are thinking about getting the HSFs, wait til you get those to mod your case, because you'll likely end up getting them anyway (as you have already set your eye on them). :)
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Zap
A friend of mine also has the Asus board and his reported temps are quite different between the two CPUs. I don't know if he ever found out if one socket was reporting higher temps or if it was one of the CPUs (by swapping sockets). A HSF that will work on socket 754 will also work on 939 and 940 since they all use the same mounting mechanism. I think these retail box HSFs will fit fine because if you look at the picture, they have the same clipping mechanism as all other retail box HSFs, and it looks as if no part of the heatsink extends past the clip. I could be wrong of course... perhaps someone who actually has one of these can verify. If you wait a few days I should receive mine (probably by Wednesday).

Thanks for the insight,
If you look at the clipping mechanism carefully, when the clip on the curved side fo the heatpipes is flush with the extent of the pipe, the other side would protrude out from the clip (the ends of the heatpipes). The bottom picture (one with the HSF upside down) does not seem to be a good indication, since you can only see the clip on one side, while the other side the clip is completely invisible, meaning that the other end would be at most flosh with the extent of the heat spreaders.

Any more insight would be helpful.


Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
What mods you do to improve air flow completely depend upon your setup. For example, when I had the Swiftech coolers, I was looking at installing fans right about the HSFs. But with my current SI-9XVs, the best thing would be to blow air across them. Best would be from the bottom, into the first fan, but that isn't possible due to the video card. Instead I'm installing a 120mm fan in front of the HSFs, and then using a duct (once I fvcking find one. OIY) to blow it back onto the two HSFs. So get what you are going to get, and then start making plans for what other measures of cooling can be accomplished for your setup. If you are thinking about getting the HSFs, wait til you get those to mod your case, because you'll likely end up getting them anyway (as you have already set your eye on them). :)

I'm thinking about getting one of these:
http://www.xoxide.com/thermaltake-icage-module.html

What do you think?
Could the direction of the fan be reversed without too much trouble??
 

Fullmetal Chocobo

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Originally posted by: Hard Ball
Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
What mods you do to improve air flow completely depend upon your setup. For example, when I had the Swiftech coolers, I was looking at installing fans right about the HSFs. But with my current SI-9XVs, the best thing would be to blow air across them. Best would be from the bottom, into the first fan, but that isn't possible due to the video card. Instead I'm installing a 120mm fan in front of the HSFs, and then using a duct (once I fvcking find one. OIY) to blow it back onto the two HSFs. So get what you are going to get, and then start making plans for what other measures of cooling can be accomplished for your setup. If you are thinking about getting the HSFs, wait til you get those to mod your case, because you'll likely end up getting them anyway (as you have already set your eye on them). :)

I'm thinking about getting one of these:
http://www.xoxide.com/thermaltake-icage-module.html

What do you think?
Could the direction of the fan be reversed without too much trouble??

Are you getting those for bling? Or for function? Because if you are going for function, I'd suggest something like these Supermicro SATA enclosures. I've got two of them in the server, and they are wonderful. And if you are going silent, then the 92mm fans can be swapped out, although they come with Sanyo Denki fans, which I was pleasantly surprised to find out.

About the ones you linked, yes, I'm pretty sure you could pull the fan off, and put it going the other direction to reverse the direction of air flow.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Originally posted by: Hard Ball
Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
What mods you do to improve air flow completely depend upon your setup. For example, when I had the Swiftech coolers, I was looking at installing fans right about the HSFs. But with my current SI-9XVs, the best thing would be to blow air across them. Best would be from the bottom, into the first fan, but that isn't possible due to the video card. Instead I'm installing a 120mm fan in front of the HSFs, and then using a duct (once I fvcking find one. OIY) to blow it back onto the two HSFs. So get what you are going to get, and then start making plans for what other measures of cooling can be accomplished for your setup. If you are thinking about getting the HSFs, wait til you get those to mod your case, because you'll likely end up getting them anyway (as you have already set your eye on them). :)

I'm thinking about getting one of these:
http://www.xoxide.com/thermaltake-icage-module.html

What do you think?
Could the direction of the fan be reversed without too much trouble??

Are you getting those for bling? Or for function? Because if you are going for function, I'd suggest something like these Supermicro SATA enclosures. I've got two of them in the server, and they are wonderful. And if you are going silent, then the 92mm fans can be swapped out, although they come with Sanyo Denki fans, which I was pleasantly surprised to find out.

About the ones you linked, yes, I'm pretty sure you could pull the fan off, and put it going the other direction to reverse the direction of air flow.


Thanks for the suggestion,

at the moment, I don't think I can go for a full blown enclosure; I don't have need for hot swapping at the moment; I only have 5 X 5.25 drive bays, and I need two of these for opticals, so at most I can get a 3 bay cage; plus, that's a bit more than what I'm planning on spending. If I should get a genuine EATX case in the future, then I would definitely consider the ones you pointed out.

I'm thinking that if I can improve the airflow in my current case considerably with minor modding, then I would be able to spend the majority of the planned funds on the HSFs, which would be the best of both worlds.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
Crack racks = machines used for distributed computing. Just noticed that you had several machines, and thought you might be running SETI or something.

These are true crack racks.


Oh, OK,

I have nothing like those distributed farms as pictured on that websites. All the machines I've had have been in standard cases.
Two of my systems are worth a dime in distributed computing (1.7, almost initial P4, and P-III in an ultra-portable), the Gateway is the workhorse that's with me most of the day; I do have the 2p/4C opteron system that I run a lot of my code on. I was doing F@H on my opteron system, but it seems that couple of the older cores does not seem to be fully compatible with X86_64 Fedora, so I'm not sure if I will be able to continue.
 

Fullmetal Chocobo

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The term 'crack racks' refers to have a bunch of relatively (normally) cheap machines used for crunching lots of data. And a lot of people just use a lot of P2/P3 machines.

Okay, so you do run some distributing computing. That's good to hear. :) My wife just built her machine (Opt 148, 2GB, 74gb Raptor), and I'm looking forward to pitting it up against my server (dual Xeon 2.66, 1.7TB total, 2GG RAM). I'd like to see what kind of numbers you churn with that dual opty as well, even though I am pretty sure I will never do an entire platform upgrade on the server. Just too expensive.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
The term 'crack racks' refers to have a bunch of relatively (normally) cheap machines used for crunching lots of data. And a lot of people just use a lot of P2/P3 machines.

Okay, so you do run some distributing computing. That's good to hear. :) My wife just built her machine (Opt 148, 2GB, 74gb Raptor), and I'm looking forward to pitting it up against my server (dual Xeon 2.66, 1.7TB total, 2GG RAM). I'd like to see what kind of numbers you churn with that dual opty as well, even though I am pretty sure I will never do an entire platform upgrade on the server. Just too expensive.


Cool, fellow DC enthusiast :)

As for the Opterons, they can do really well, upto 1200 per day if they are getting later cores and good WUs from F@H. But I often get some of the older cores, particularly, a couple of them cause a lot of problem, and often would dive me this message:

CoreStatus = 0 (0)
Client-core communcations error: Error 0x0
Deleting current work unit & continuing

Whenever I get one these two particular cores, I would lose 70-80% of the WU that are running on my machine. Also, there was one particular protein: p1136_p1130_L939_K12M_335K would acutally cause my system to freeze, and I couldn't even remotely log in, and could only fix it by doing a hard shutdown. I guess F@H 64bit linux support is a bit spotty, or something similar. I'm pretty sure that it's not the hardware, since I run a lot of my own codes on there anyway, and also prime95, 3Dmark, etc run fine in Windows.
 

Fullmetal Chocobo

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Originally posted by: Hard Ball
Originally posted by: Fullmetal Chocobo
The term 'crack racks' refers to have a bunch of relatively (normally) cheap machines used for crunching lots of data. And a lot of people just use a lot of P2/P3 machines.

Okay, so you do run some distributing computing. That's good to hear. :) My wife just built her machine (Opt 148, 2GB, 74gb Raptor), and I'm looking forward to pitting it up against my server (dual Xeon 2.66, 1.7TB total, 2GG RAM). I'd like to see what kind of numbers you churn with that dual opty as well, even though I am pretty sure I will never do an entire platform upgrade on the server. Just too expensive.


Cool, fellow DC enthusiast :)

As for the Opterons, they can do really well, upto 1200 per day if they are getting later cores and good WUs from F@H. But I often get some of the older cores, particularly, a couple of them cause a lot of problem, and often would dive me this message:

CoreStatus = 0 (0)
Client-core communcations error: Error 0x0
Deleting current work unit & continuing

Whenever I get one these two particular cores, I would lose 70-80% of the WU that are running on my machine. Also, there was one particular protein: p1136_p1130_L939_K12M_335K would acutally cause my system to freeze, and I couldn't even remotely log in, and could only fix it by doing a hard shutdown. I guess F@H 64bit linux support is a bit spotty, or something similar. I'm pretty sure that it's not the hardware, since I run a lot of my own codes on there anyway, and also prime95, 3Dmark, etc run fine in Windows.

Sweet. After they killed SETI classic, I printed my certs (from 100 - 2500), and went to doing DPAD. Wife is currently setting up BOINC and going to run SETI on her machine.
 

Zap

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Originally posted by: Hard Ball
[regarding retail box heatpipe HSF]
Any more insight would be helpful.
I won't have any more insight until I get mine in my hands. :D The best bet for you at this time would be to see if you can find some pictures of this unit installed on a motherboard, preferably from various angles so that you can judge whether or not there is little enough protrusion to allow a pair to fit on your motherboard. Perhaps look in the thread about this HSF and ask someone who already has one to take some pics and measurements for you. If all else fails, perhaps I can do the task once I actually receive mine.

Originally posted by: Hard Ball
I'm thinking that if I can improve the airflow in my current case considerably with minor modding, then I would be able to spend the majority of the planned funds on the HSFs, which would be the best of both worlds.
One thing to do that will give you free airflow as well as decrease noise is to cut out the fan grills that are stamped from the case.
 

Hard Ball

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Originally posted by: Zap
Originally posted by: Hard Ball
[regarding retail box heatpipe HSF]
Any more insight would be helpful.
I won't have any more insight until I get mine in my hands. :D The best bet for you at this time would be to see if you can find some pictures of this unit installed on a motherboard, preferably from various angles so that you can judge whether or not there is little enough protrusion to allow a pair to fit on your motherboard. Perhaps look in the thread about this HSF and ask someone who already has one to take some pics and measurements for you. If all else fails, perhaps I can do the task once I actually receive mine.

Thanks for the link, I will study it carefully, and hopefully come up with a decision.

Just looking at this picture:
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/chenli/www/AM...-Heatpipe-lazyman-9959.jpg?uniq=2ozfom
it seems that in its normal position, the HSF will protrude a bit over the edge of the retention bracket.

Originally posted by: Hard Ball
I'm thinking that if I can improve the airflow in my current case considerably with minor modding, then I would be able to spend the majority of the planned funds on the HSFs, which would be the best of both worlds.
One thing to do that will give you free airflow as well as decrease noise is to cut out the fan grills that are stamped from the case.

I will try that at some point too.

How easily do you think I will be able to make slits and holes in the plastic face plate and door at the front of the case?