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Poll: Labor unions, are they still needed?
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Thegonagle
Diamond Member
<< A worker is only worth what they are willing to take! >>
A worker's going to take the best he knows how to get. I believe that no one should have to work full time and not be able to afford and apartment, food, clothing, and healthcare.
<< Unions hold back as many as they protect. >>
The good out weighs the bad. The protection they offer is worth it. They're like the police. There are good cops and there are corrupt cops. On the whole, I think the police do a good job, and make my life safer/better.
I'm not in a union, because I'm making a bet that I can do better for myself than they can offer me, so they're not holding me back.
I think unions are still necessary today, but I believe that new unions need to be developed. Gone are the days of manufacturing in the US. While many people still work at these positions, their unions are on the decline. I would like to see unions for temporary employees and IT. Right now, a temp company is one of the largest employers in the US. Yet, employees working for these places have no rights. They don't even have the right to know how much profit the temp company is making off of them. They don't have a right to benefits or vacations or sick days. This, IMO, is just wrong. And I agree with unionization of IT. I've seen too many people taken advantage of by being hired at salary with no overtime.
Demon-Xanth
Lifer
There is a great need for unions in the tech industry. I work near where HP and PB/NEC would hire 90 temps, lay them off on day 89, then rehire them before they left the building. People worked as temps for over 3 years w/o recieving any of the full time benifits they should have.
I refuse to even deal with temp agencies for this reason.
I refuse to even deal with temp agencies for this reason.
If you've never been in a "Union" I'd think it would be hard to have an opinion here....😉
I personally have been, and keep up my card to this day! My family is in the Construction Biz and has been for years so when I reached 17 I got my card in the AFL-CIO. I was in the BAC and still am today because of the super cheap Life Insurance rates!😉 Although I haven't worked in the union for almost 10 years now, I still get my 1 million dollar Life Insurance cheaper than anywhere I could buy it plus a $100,000.00 accident policy is included!🙂
To be honest though, benifits seem to be the main reason for being a member today. I can't get the health Insurance coverage anymore because you have to work a minimuim number of hours to qualify each quarter, but, the coverage I had was absolutely great! It was part of our "benifits package" so nothing was actually deducted from our pay, and we had the best possible coverage! No deductables for anyone in your family and it covered everything from Doctors & hospitals wherever you wanted to go, to Optical & Dental all at no cost!
Of course the pay was not bad either!😉 I was about the only one while I was in college making $25+ an hour so I had what I called the "Total Package" becuase I was in school basicly full time for 5 years and still had money to burn of my own!
Someone mentioned above that the Unions may, or are trying to get into the tech sector........I can tell you I know that he is correct.....for FACT! My father & brother and many friends are still active in the local here and I went with them to a meeting a few months back........well, to make a long story short, they are VERY interested in getting a foot hold here and basicly tried to promote me to get involved!😉
I personally have been, and keep up my card to this day! My family is in the Construction Biz and has been for years so when I reached 17 I got my card in the AFL-CIO. I was in the BAC and still am today because of the super cheap Life Insurance rates!😉 Although I haven't worked in the union for almost 10 years now, I still get my 1 million dollar Life Insurance cheaper than anywhere I could buy it plus a $100,000.00 accident policy is included!🙂
To be honest though, benifits seem to be the main reason for being a member today. I can't get the health Insurance coverage anymore because you have to work a minimuim number of hours to qualify each quarter, but, the coverage I had was absolutely great! It was part of our "benifits package" so nothing was actually deducted from our pay, and we had the best possible coverage! No deductables for anyone in your family and it covered everything from Doctors & hospitals wherever you wanted to go, to Optical & Dental all at no cost!
Of course the pay was not bad either!😉 I was about the only one while I was in college making $25+ an hour so I had what I called the "Total Package" becuase I was in school basicly full time for 5 years and still had money to burn of my own!
Someone mentioned above that the Unions may, or are trying to get into the tech sector........I can tell you I know that he is correct.....for FACT! My father & brother and many friends are still active in the local here and I went with them to a meeting a few months back........well, to make a long story short, they are VERY interested in getting a foot hold here and basicly tried to promote me to get involved!😉
xraymongral
Banned
We most defintly need union. I live in Michigan, and know lots of people that work for GM/Delphi, and Ford. the stories of what these companies try to get away with are scary. Now, they do need to restructure unions and get rid of the scumbags that are running them, get rid of the orginized crime element.
Yes, they are still needed.
I work for a hugh corporation that is run by half wits. They constantly are changing ideas, systems, and all other major things that have got them where they are today. Each change is worse then the previous one. The company is slowly faltering and getting worse. These managment half wits also try to screw the employees which provide they service that they sell in every way possible. If it were not for the union trying to keep a few things in order and fair, there would be total confusion for the workers. These acountant type pensil pushers need to get some common sense and try and show respect for their workers and the people they sell their service to, their customers.
I work for a hugh corporation that is run by half wits. They constantly are changing ideas, systems, and all other major things that have got them where they are today. Each change is worse then the previous one. The company is slowly faltering and getting worse. These managment half wits also try to screw the employees which provide they service that they sell in every way possible. If it were not for the union trying to keep a few things in order and fair, there would be total confusion for the workers. These acountant type pensil pushers need to get some common sense and try and show respect for their workers and the people they sell their service to, their customers.
in principle unions will always be useful. you can no more judge unions
by their abuses anymore than you could anything else. unions are still
effective today because they operate on local level, in the trenches, so
to speak, advocating for worker rights in industries that continue
do not uphold fair labor practices. especially with farm laborers,
garment industry workers, illegal child labor practices, and
illegal corporate actions; none of these would necessarily see
government assistance because the workers may not know how to
reach so far help. union people are there at the grassroots
level investigating and agitating for change.
by their abuses anymore than you could anything else. unions are still
effective today because they operate on local level, in the trenches, so
to speak, advocating for worker rights in industries that continue
do not uphold fair labor practices. especially with farm laborers,
garment industry workers, illegal child labor practices, and
illegal corporate actions; none of these would necessarily see
government assistance because the workers may not know how to
reach so far help. union people are there at the grassroots
level investigating and agitating for change.
I'm generally a pro-union guy. But I have major problems with John Sweeney who heads the AFL-CIO.
This guy has to go, and the sooner the better.
I've also worked in both non-union and union shops. No doubt about it, I'd rather work in a union one.
The number of examples of union abuses and/or corrupt activities is often overblown and exaggerated and in any case is dwarfed by the abuses (or threat of, or ability to do so) that the corps can and often have done.
I could right a thousand lines on this subject, but this isn't the right type of forum for that.
This guy has to go, and the sooner the better.
I've also worked in both non-union and union shops. No doubt about it, I'd rather work in a union one.
The number of examples of union abuses and/or corrupt activities is often overblown and exaggerated and in any case is dwarfed by the abuses (or threat of, or ability to do so) that the corps can and often have done.
I could right a thousand lines on this subject, but this isn't the right type of forum for that.
anybody who says no needs a reality check. If it weren't for unions, the companies would be doing whatever they can to cut costs and make mo money. They would fire workers who get high up in seniority so that they could have cheaper workers, they wouldn't provide health care, it would be bad.
I'm non-union and make an above average wage with good benefits...caused by competition.
I deliver to both Union and non-union shops. Non-union are mostly pleasant to deal with and treat you like an equal. They generally are much more efficient and the docks are clean.
Contrast the Union shops. Populated by a bunch of grumps that delay work until 5 minutes before the next break and then leave 4 minutes early. The docks are a mess...'ain't my job!'
I've never overheard 2 Union guys talking that within 5 minutes they weren't bragging about screwing their employer.
I deliver to both Union and non-union shops. Non-union are mostly pleasant to deal with and treat you like an equal. They generally are much more efficient and the docks are clean.
Contrast the Union shops. Populated by a bunch of grumps that delay work until 5 minutes before the next break and then leave 4 minutes early. The docks are a mess...'ain't my job!'
I've never overheard 2 Union guys talking that within 5 minutes they weren't bragging about screwing their employer.
xraymongral
Banned
Granted, there are some non-union shops that are good, and plenty of losers working for union shops. I remember when GM shut down the Willow Run assembly plant, moving all the production to there Texas plant. Everyone pissed and moaned about it, but they were putting out junk quality cars. You drove by the parking lot during lunch, and you would see people drinking and doing whatever. Then they expected my sympathy. I would have been a bit more grateful for such a good paying job. The union mentality in Michigan is a crock of crap, but then the companys mentality sucks to. GM is always doing something to get rid of union jobs.
In my town, GM essentialy gave this guy a business, supplying the building and equipment to expand his bisiness. He takes came shaft blanks and cuts the gear and unfinished lobes on them, and does some other small parts as well. Then the parts are shipped to union GM plants. These all used to be union jobs, now they are sh!t hole, lucky to get $8/hour after 4 years, get fired for no substantiated reason jobs.
In my town, GM essentialy gave this guy a business, supplying the building and equipment to expand his bisiness. He takes came shaft blanks and cuts the gear and unfinished lobes on them, and does some other small parts as well. Then the parts are shipped to union GM plants. These all used to be union jobs, now they are sh!t hole, lucky to get $8/hour after 4 years, get fired for no substantiated reason jobs.
xraymongral
My 'dedicated route' takes me to Elkton and Sebewaing. Because of the economy and mainly because of Daimler Chrysler both Tower Automotive plants are really taking a hit. They are both Union, although not UAW. Sebewaing is supposed to close and Elkton is laying off.
I'm losing my route.
The folks up there are very good people largely unaffected by the corruption of the unions in the 'big city.' I'll miss them.
My 'dedicated route' takes me to Elkton and Sebewaing. Because of the economy and mainly because of Daimler Chrysler both Tower Automotive plants are really taking a hit. They are both Union, although not UAW. Sebewaing is supposed to close and Elkton is laying off.
I'm losing my route.
The folks up there are very good people largely unaffected by the corruption of the unions in the 'big city.' I'll miss them.
xraymongral
Banned
Red, don't be to harsh. I had a friend whose cousin was head of a roofing union, and you would not belive the sh!t that they pulled with some of these guys. I can easily see banging some guys wife. Especialy if there are alot of bikers in the trade. Michigan is such a died in the wool union state, it makes me puke sometimes. Never underestimate the extent of immorality by unions leaders.
Tominator<--I live about 10 minutes from Sebewaing, off of M-25. It is sad about Tower, they a mainstay of Sebewaing. Small town America taking it on the chin again.
Tominator<--I live about 10 minutes from Sebewaing, off of M-25. It is sad about Tower, they a mainstay of Sebewaing. Small town America taking it on the chin again.
Typical Liberal thinking...if I can't smell it, feel it or see it, it cannot exist. You have the right to believe anything you want....or not. That is YOUR choice. You remind me of an ostrich....you know, a big bird with a small head...a smaller brain....eyes filled with sand....you get the idea...
<< Yes, they are still needed.
I work for a hugh corporation that is run by half wits. They constantly are changing ideas, systems, and all other major things that have got them where they are today. Each change is worse then the previous one. The company is slowly faltering and getting worse. These managment half wits also try to screw the employees which provide they service that they sell in every way possible. If it were not for the union trying to keep a few things in order and fair, there would be total confusion for the workers. These acountant type pensil pushers need to get some common sense and try and show respect for their workers and the people they sell their service to, their customers. >>
You work for IBM?
Oh wait, you said your company has a Union. Sorry!
Well, I gotta say one thing here that stuck out blatently in this thread.........The matter of Presidents sleeping with "New Members" (apprentices) Wives......
OK, early in the thread much mention was given to the "Mafia" ties to the Unions right? Pretty well known fact actually in MANY areas and easily seen.....just look at the names!😉
Then we have the story of the Presidents, B.A.'s whatever sleeping with the wives right? I'm not saying it did/does happen or not because I myself have witness the BAC dealing with a member whom had an "alternative view" to those in power!😉 He was "politely" told his opinions were not appreciated! (read got his A$$ kicked after the meeting), so I do know and have witnessed corruption!😉
That said, let's examine the two...........Hmmmm, it may have happened......ONCE......but I doubt that! That would be a HUGE No-No as far as the Mafia (Mob) is concerned. In fact, Mafia Wars have started over that exact occasion....be it many years ago, their "Unspoken Laws" are still the same!😉 I just can't see it! It may have taken place......but if it did, I'm certain the party enjoying the wifes "treats" was in MUCH more trouble than even the hubby would have instilled upon him had he been able!😉
OK, early in the thread much mention was given to the "Mafia" ties to the Unions right? Pretty well known fact actually in MANY areas and easily seen.....just look at the names!😉
Then we have the story of the Presidents, B.A.'s whatever sleeping with the wives right? I'm not saying it did/does happen or not because I myself have witness the BAC dealing with a member whom had an "alternative view" to those in power!😉 He was "politely" told his opinions were not appreciated! (read got his A$$ kicked after the meeting), so I do know and have witnessed corruption!😉
That said, let's examine the two...........Hmmmm, it may have happened......ONCE......but I doubt that! That would be a HUGE No-No as far as the Mafia (Mob) is concerned. In fact, Mafia Wars have started over that exact occasion....be it many years ago, their "Unspoken Laws" are still the same!😉 I just can't see it! It may have taken place......but if it did, I'm certain the party enjoying the wifes "treats" was in MUCH more trouble than even the hubby would have instilled upon him had he been able!😉
xraymongral
Banned
The mafia is not as honerable as you seem to think. There rules of honer also are more directed to someone that is "in" the mafia, not some minion operative working for the union.
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