POLL: If you could kill a man, and get away with it. would you do it?

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SherEPunjab

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2002
3,841
0
0
yeah i'd kill someone, in a heartbeat, if it was justified to me.

i wouldn't kill for any money in the world, unless the person should have been killed.

I will only kill evil bastards. OBL, Musharraf, Ding Dong Ching of Korea, Sadaam Hussein, Islamic terrorists in general, the corrupt Enron executives. I would take deep pleasure in killing them.
 

HOWITIS

Platinum Member
Apr 26, 2001
2,165
0
76
ok, lets explain this further. i'm not talking about bin laden, oposing military, or someone who raped/ murdered a family member. i would kill them in a second. i'm speaking of someone just killing someone for the hell of it. or killing someone who pisses you off.


the guy i'm speaking of thinks the death penalty/laws prevents criminals and other bad elements from commiting murder.
 

gopunk

Lifer
Jul 7, 2001
29,239
2
0
Originally posted by: Lonyo
Can you even imagine how hard it would be to kill someone? You'd be taking a life, how could you actually manage to do that?

Do you mean shoot them, st@b them, inject, electrocute, strangle, or what? I don't think I could kill anyone any of those ways, obviously some sick folks feel they could.

(damned forbidden word crap, I was trying to use it in context)

"Click back button and edit work" - "You cannot post or edit a message twice", what is this crap?)

i could kill someone like that... they would have to have really pissed me off though... like tortured me for a long ass time.
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
Does this include Bin Laden?
If not, there is still one more person that I would kill if i could get away with it.

yeah i'd have to agree... some people NEED to die.. he is one of them.
too bad there's no option for 'depends on the person'
 

SherEPunjab

Diamond Member
Oct 23, 2002
3,841
0
0
Originally posted by: HOWITIS
ok, lets explain this further. i'm not talking about bin laden, oposing military, or someone who raped/ murdered a family member. i would kill them in a second. i'm speaking of someone just killing someone for the hell of it. or killing someone who pisses you off.


the guy i'm speaking of thinks the death penalty/laws prevents criminals and other bad elements from commiting murder.

NO.
 

amnesiac

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
15,781
1
71
Prison and the death penalty is a deterrent to some but not all. Psychopathic criminals display very little remorse or reaction to punishment.
 
Dec 28, 2001
11,391
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Join the army? sure!

Seriously, people become conscientious objectors at the very last second in battle, it seems.
 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
Now that those who practise justice do so involuntarily and because they have not the power to be unjust will best appear if we imagine something of this kind: having given both to the just and the unjust power to do what they will, let us watch and see whither desire will lead them; then we shall discover in the very act the just and unjust man to be proceeding along the same road, following their interest, which all natures deem to be their good, and are only diverted into the path of justice by the force of law. The liberty which we are supposing may be most completely given to them in the form of such a power as is said to have been possessed by Gyges, the ancestor of Croesus the Lydian.

According to the tradition, Gyges was a shepherd in the service of the King of Lydia; there was a great storm, and an earthquake made an opening in the earth at the place where he was feeding his flock. Amazed at the sight, he descended into the opening, where, among other marvels, he beheld a hollow brazen horse, having doors, at which he, stooping and looking in, saw a dead body of stature, as appeared to him, more than human and having nothing on but a gold ring; this he took from the finger of the dead and reascended. Now the shepherds met together, according to custom, that they might send their monthly report about the flocks to the King; into their assembly he came having the ring on his finger, and as he was sitting among them he chanced to turn the collet of the ring inside his hand, when instantly he became invisible to the rest of the company and they began to speak of him as if he were no longer present. He was astonished at this, and again touching the ring he turned the collet outward and reappeared; he made several trials of the ring, and always with the same result -- when he turned the collet inward he became invisible, when outward he reappeared. Whereupon he contrived to be chosen one of the messengers who were sent to the court; where as soon as he arrived he seduced the Queen, and with her help conspired against the King and slew him and took the kingdom.

Suppose now that there were two such magic rings, and the just put on one of them and the unjust the other; no man can be imagined to be of such an iron nature that he would stand fast in justice. No man would keep his hands off what was not his own when he could safely take what he liked out of the market, or go into houses and lie with anyone at his pleasure, or kill or release from prison whom he would, and in all respects be like a god among men. Then the actions of the just would be as the actions of the unjust; they would both come at last to the same point. And this we may truly affirm to be a great proof that a man is just, not willingly or because he thinks that justice is any good to him individually, but of necessity, for wherever anyone thinks that he can safely be unjust, there he is unjust. For all men believe in their hearts that injustice is far more profitable to the individual than justice, and he who argues as I have been supposing, will say that they are right. If you could imagine anyone obtaining this power of becoming invisible, and never doing any wrong or touching what was another's, he would be thought by the lookers-on to be a most wretched idiot, although they would praise him to one another's faces, and keep up appearances with one another from a fear that they too might suffer injustice.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,712
427
126
tbqhwy.com
yes i would OFF someone if i could get away with it. but it woudl have to be someoen from a selecit group. IE Saddam Bin Ladden, Ashcroft...... you get teh idea
 

MikeO

Diamond Member
Jan 17, 2001
3,026
0
0

There are people on this planet I would kill if I could get away with it.
 

Skel

Diamond Member
Apr 11, 2001
6,222
680
136
Kill a man... maybe. Kill a stupid thread and get away with it.... oh hell yes.
 

yowolabi

Diamond Member
Jun 29, 2001
4,183
2
81
Originally posted by: datalink7


Suppose now that there were two such magic rings, and the just put on one of them and the unjust the other; no man can be imagined to be of such an iron nature that he would stand fast in justice. No man would keep his hands off what was not his own when he could safely take what he liked out of the market, or go into houses and lie with anyone at his pleasure, or kill or release from prison whom he would, and in all respects be like a god among men. Then the actions of the just would be as the actions of the unjust; they would both come at last to the same point. And this we may truly affirm to be a great proof that a man is just, not willingly or because he thinks that justice is any good to him individually, but of necessity, for wherever anyone thinks that he can safely be unjust, there he is unjust. For all men believe in their hearts that injustice is far more profitable to the individual than justice, and he who argues as I have been supposing, will say that they are right. If you could imagine anyone obtaining this power of becoming invisible, and never doing any wrong or touching what was another's, he would be thought by the lookers-on to be a most wretched idiot, although they would praise him to one another's faces, and keep up appearances with one another from a fear that they too might suffer injustice.

Do you really believe this, or did you just think it's a relevant passage? I disagree with it. While it may be true for some, or even a majority of people, it definitely is not true for all. I do believe injustice is more profitable materially, but I don't live my life for the things that injustice would give me.

There are plenty of things that I know I could get away with that I wouldn't do because I know they're wrong and wouldn't want to live in a world where everyone did that same action. I don't believe in God or Karma(in that way), so if I don't think I'll be caught by any human, that means that it's entirely a personal moral choice. Lookers-on might see that person as an idiot, but anyone who can live their life based on an internal code of morality wouldn't care.

As relates to the death penalty though, it's not even the same situation. Even if it was true that people are only moral because they fear punisment for being immoral, murderers don't fit into that group. People usually murder because of an intense emotion like anger or fear, emotions that also take away your rationality. So those people aren't in any position to think about the consequences of their actions. If they were, most wouldn't commit the murder anyway.

Add to this that the death penalty is only given to a few murderers. Most get a number of years, up to life in prison. So even if they did think about the murder in advance, no one believes that the consequences of their act will be murder by the state. All it takes is 1 winner out of millions and everyone still plays the lottery. So when you know that out of hundreds or thousands of murders, only a couple get killed, no one will ever expect to be one of those few. If all murders automatically received the death penalty, then we could talk about it being a deterrent, since everyone would know "if I get caught, i'll be sentenced to die". In it's present form it's a joke. This is evidenced by the fact that murders didn't go up when the death penalty stopped or go down when it started back up again.
 

compudog

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2001
5,782
0
71
There are worse things that can be done to a person than death. I am by no means a pacifist, but I am not a killer.
 

dman

Diamond Member
Nov 2, 1999
9,110
0
76
Originally posted by: Kiyup
If you could just think a person dead, man would people be dropping like flies on the highway.

Might be fun if you could think people dead and they'd respawn like 25miles away from where they were. You'd have to start wondering who you pissed off if that happened. :) Gotta stop playing FPSers.

 

datalink7

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
16,765
6
81
yowolabi,

I suppose I should have said... that is from Plato's Republic. Socrates/Plato is trying to argue that it is always better to do justice instead of injustice. That is one of the counter arguments that crops up.

Here is another (poorly paraphrased by me):

To say that it is always better to do justice instead of injustice (note that justice can be interchangable with good), we have to set up the following scenario. Take a injust man, who can do whatever he wants. He does all kinds of injust things. But he is thought by everyone to be the most just man there is, and so recives all the rewards of being thought the most just man. Everyone thinks he is a good and moral person, while in reality he can break any ethic or moral that he wants, whenever he wants, and never gets caught doing it.

Now there is another man. He always does justice. Never commits an evil act. But he is thought to be the most despicable person alive. He gets no reward for doing any of the good things that he does, and is in fact despised for it. When he dies he is remembered as a great evil.

Now, can you truely say that the just man in the above scenario is better off than the unjust man? To truely say that you are better off doing justice as opposed to injustice, then you have to say yes, and truely be able to defend that position.
 

guyver01

Lifer
Sep 25, 2000
22,135
5
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Originally posted by: Lonyo
Can you even imagine how hard it would be to kill someone? You'd be taking a life, how could you actually manage to do that?

It gets easier after the first time

:Q