News flash, they are already suffering. A quick firey death would be mercy to them.
I think the only way to protect Soul would be the use of low yield tactical nukes on the artillary pieces NK has aimed at Soul. A conventional attack could never take out enough units to keep them from lobbing some shells into Soul. Multiple nukes fired from outside of NK's radar range and dropped down on them simultaneously is the only assured way to limit the number of casualties in S. Korea.
Arkaign
Lifer
- Oct 27, 2006
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Tactical nukes cause severe local damage, but even ~1MT warheads (much larger than tactical nukes) aren't enough to do widespread damage outside of a couple dozen square miles (less in mountainous areas). NK doesn't have all of their artillery emplacements clustered up to the point where even a couple dozen tactical nukes would be much use. Further complicating the task is the fact that NK is very mountainous, which deflects the bulk of the energy release of those types of weapons. It took thousands of sorties to wipe out the bulk of Iraq's artillery, and they had a lot less build-up than NK has.
North Korea is about the size of Ohio, which may sound sort of small, but as far as land mass goes, is a pretty large area to cover due to the severity of the terrain, and 46,500+ square miles is a lot of places to hide SAMs, Artillery, etc. In one recent 8-year period alone, the NK army expanded the artillery by some 6,000 pieces. Total numbers are probably in the 30,000-40,000 range. Some of those will likely be clustered, and I'd guess that 50-60% of them should be within ~100km of the DMZ.
What I'm saying is basically what I said above, a conventional war against NK would succeed in the end, but at tremendous cost unless a plan was made and executed to take out the NK dictatorial leadership from the top down, with NK Army on board by force or by negotiation. Attempting to use anything but a maximum nuclear blanket strategy would leave many thousands of artillery emplacements intact and these would immediately be put to work killing hundreds of thousands of SK civilians (as well as allied military personnel, obviously).
The chief problems lie in the fact that 50 years of military buildup and incredible concentrations of dense population areas make for a very dangerous recipe indeed.
Nukes or no nukes, NK would level Seoul in the first 15 minutes of any conflict. They've been building artillery pieces into the mountains this entire time.
So we cannot do anything, sorry.
Edit - Not to mention that Japan, South Korea and just about every region in the area including China, would be covered in fallout. They might have issues with that.
Arkaign
Lifer
- Oct 27, 2006
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Given China's dependence on the stability of global markets, and their move from pure communism to a new hybrid capitalist system, their patience and support for NK is certainly at an all-time low. If China feels that their interests are significantly threatened, I think they will act, and I think they are also the best positioned and equipped to deal with the issue, from intelligence, regional assets, understanding of NK internal functionality, etc.
PottedMeat
Lifer
- Apr 17, 2002
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If they do act, and in such a way that gets the backing of Russia/EU/Japan/US in even the smallest way ( if NK attacks someone else for example ), they'll be able to get everyone off their backs about human rights/freedom issues for quite some time.
Lemon law
Lifer
- Nov 6, 2005
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Kim Jong ILL is a nut and so was his delusional father, as both thought they are some sort of a GOD figure. Kim's father is has been pushing up daisies for decades, Kim Jong Ill is now in pretty lousy health, and we can only hope his sonny boy named as his successor will be less of a nut case.
As it is, the best solution is for the South Korean economy to bail out the North, just as West Germany did for East Germany. As for China, its hegemony over the entire region is already insured. Meanwhile North Korea needs to economic aid to feed its people, and we must remember that the problem is not the North Korean people, its their nutty leadership.
As it is, the best solution is for the South Korean economy to bail out the North, just as West Germany did for East Germany. As for China, its hegemony over the entire region is already insured. Meanwhile North Korea needs to economic aid to feed its people, and we must remember that the problem is not the North Korean people, its their nutty leadership.
- Oct 9, 1999
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Overthrowing Dear Leader from within and/or a power struggle after his death will quite possibly lead to MORE crazy instability and bellicose threats to others from the North, bank on it.
Everyone jockeying for power will use the "threat from the running dog imperialists" to cloak their ambitions, and there is not one shred of evidence that there's a Gandhi or Mandela in the senior ranks of their military.
It's much more likely that there's a bunch of career fucktards whose main drive in life will be to hold onto all their perks and power by repeatedly pushing the fear button.
We do indeed live in interesting times.
Everyone jockeying for power will use the "threat from the running dog imperialists" to cloak their ambitions, and there is not one shred of evidence that there's a Gandhi or Mandela in the senior ranks of their military.
It's much more likely that there's a bunch of career fucktards whose main drive in life will be to hold onto all their perks and power by repeatedly pushing the fear button.
We do indeed live in interesting times.
Modelworks
Lifer
- Feb 22, 2007
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As soon as you discover how to make a contained nuclear explosion, let the worlds scientist know.
Modelworks
Lifer
- Feb 22, 2007
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I watched an interview with his oldest son today. The guy seemed like any other guy his age. Did not come off as a dictator and looked more like the party all night, anyone got a beer type. They asked him if he wanted to replace his father and he just laughed and said he wasn't the political type. He may be what they needed, unfortunately he isn't interested and so they are looking at the youngest son .
MovingTarget
Diamond Member
- Jun 22, 2003
- 9,002
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I don't ever want to see that happen, but part of me just wants NK to get it the hell over with or just collapse.
guyver01
Lifer
- Sep 25, 2000
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I think it was said perfectly in the movie WAR GAMES.
"The only solution is not to play"
There is NO winner in a Nuclear War. not even a 'controlled, contained' situation. It will quickly get out of hand.. and does anyone TRULY believe that Kim Jong Il will LIMIT his strikes? If he sees he's gonna die, he'll unleash the dogs of war all over the surrounding regions, because he has NOTHING to lose.
"The only solution is not to play"
There is NO winner in a Nuclear War. not even a 'controlled, contained' situation. It will quickly get out of hand.. and does anyone TRULY believe that Kim Jong Il will LIMIT his strikes? If he sees he's gonna die, he'll unleash the dogs of war all over the surrounding regions, because he has NOTHING to lose.
Given how many whackos around the world think the U.S. is a pinata to take out their frustrations on, can you imagine the line that would form to take a whack if the U.S. were to use the bomb again?
Artillery pieces have a range of about 10-12 miles at most. Rockets and missles would have a range of a 100 miles or so.
You'll never be able to take down the NK leadership from the inside. The people that are closest to "Dear Leader" are his most trusted and brainwashed people. They will never turn on him and would do anything it takes to keep him (and themselves) in power. If it comes between America and it's ally vs an enemy, remember, N Korea is still technically at war with the South. I'll pick for doing whatever it takes to ensure the least amount of casualties to America and allies.
The only way to win a war is to crush your enemies, not be nice and try not to kill their civilians. North Koreans have been brainwashed and have the mind set of the Japanese in WW2. Any troop to troop combat is going to be fucking nasty and more of our people are going to die than need be.
I think to many people look at war as a game and as tactical movements to out thik your opponent. While that helps, the ultimate goal is to kill as many bad guys as possible and loose the least amount on your side. That's how wars are won.
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