You doubt me? What you speak about is insurrection , TREASON. There's a discussion of this in another thread. You and those who think like you are abberant, kind of like Ted Kaczinsky. You remember him, right? That's all you are, except you'd make it easy for the real Americans to f#$% you up because we'd know exactly where to find you.
I know, I also think there's something inherently disgusting about people who are constantly advocating (or secretly hoping for) some kind of civil war. Frankly, I've heard just about enough out of Dave and Shadow on this topic to understand they keep fanning the flames on purpose. What sick, twisted bastards to wish another civil war on this country over something as moronic as the ten commandments. Just stop talking and get your F'n monument out of the courthouse.
no, the real traitors are those that pervert the constitution to thier own ends, who twist the meaning of and flat out ignore the law, and who do not seem to care as long as they get thier way and force it on others through judical proclimation at the expense of the legislative process of elected represenatives of the people...all in the name of "fairness"
just about every history teacher/professor i had always said that if the checks and balances system ever became unbalanced, it would be through the judicial branch, and it is happening before our eyes.
you talk of remembering. well i remember! thats the kind of #%!@#% we fought a revolution against over 200 years ago in the first place! and if you feel like backing up your threats, then do it! i have all you want. i can shatter your stereotypical illusions at 500+ yards. the army trained me well.
LOL!!! did you mention "ad hom posts" earlier? i think you did, thanks for a great example! most of my discussion was on a different subject though...you know the one where i actually provided proof to back up my claim while others could only post opinion...it hurts getting your clock cleaned in honest debate by one of the hated christians does'nt it?
so what's next? re-writing historical documents so they do not have the words "God" and "creator" in them? what about after that? outlawing public expressions of religion altogether? and after that?
keep pushing, it is only a matter of time until you get pushed back.
Which side do you think that Gays will fight on?
According to a proposed U.S. Constitutional Ammendment, Gays are inferior people:
11-19-2003 Gays to be considered inferior by U.S. Law
Advocates of gay marriage hailed the ruling Tuesday as a landmark advancement of their cause. But the case also has galvanized opponents who want to protect heterosexual marriage by perpetuating discrimination against gays.
The opponents are promoting an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would overturn any state law that treats gay and married couples equally. For the first time since the end of slavery, it would insert language in the Constitution defining one group of Americans as legally inferior to others.
According to a proposed U.S. Constitutional Ammendment, Gays are inferior people:
11-19-2003 Gays to be considered inferior by U.S. Law
Advocates of gay marriage hailed the ruling Tuesday as a landmark advancement of their cause. But the case also has galvanized opponents who want to protect heterosexual marriage by perpetuating discrimination against gays.
The opponents are promoting an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that would overturn any state law that treats gay and married couples equally. For the first time since the end of slavery, it would insert language in the Constitution defining one group of Americans as legally inferior to others.
Who said they never happened? God never happened, as far as trying to come to an agreement about government is concerned. Just because those people decided mistakenly that they would proclaim their religions in legal documents doesn't mean that it's right. But that doesn't make those documents religious. The Ten Commandments is explicitly part of Judeo-Christian ideology, used as an excuse for oppression of and violence against "non-believers". It belongs next to the Jim Crowe laws.
- May 18, 2001
- 24,117
- 2
- 0
Blah blah, blah blah.
Civil war, yes or no?
You seem to think anyone who has an alternative view to current affairs wants to start a war.
In a democracy, you have the right to hold your own point of view. You have the right to lobby for your belief or cause.
Just because a large group gets the wind up themselves about an issue does not mean Civil War is a given.
Civil war
Riiiiiight. Just stay away from government buildings and keep your militia membership to yourself. Maybe the feds won't notice. I hope so, for your sake.
Samuel Adams, speech at the Philadelphia State House, August 1, 1776:
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen."
It would be truly Ironic if the neo-con's Patriot act nabbed seditious forum Rambo?s like "Shadowhawk" (is that an intentionally juvenile moniker?) for spouting his treasonous filth. I find little to no distinction between your comments and those of other fundamentalist terrorists like Bin Laden; you both want to kill Americans, except you want to do it, in addition to being a religious zealot, because you're a homophobe and a "renowned constitutional historian". That's almost funny?.
Are you suprised that someone might get a bit testy to the fact that you're calling a seditious revolution? You do remember your own original basis for this thread, don't you? I would suggest, at the very least, read the title of it. Somewhere along the way you go apresh1t about the semantics of atheism but you've made a lasting impression already. Once in a while you come back from your tangent and regurgitate your call to arms and then passivly criticize reaction to it. Very odd, and very irritating.
homophobe? when have i ever been that? i have never even typed the word "homosexual" on this forum EVER until now, much less had a conversation about them. is this the ole lib slander tactic being played out? when all else fails call people names? and where in left field did you grab "renowned constitutional historian". i have never claimed that. but it seems i know enough history to remember the constitution was designed as a liitation on the government, not the people.
as for my name, i am a cherokee, there are another named "winterhawk" chief mankiller's son, you going to show us your "tolerance" by making fun of that too?
i do not WANT a civil war! do you really think i look forward to shooting at men wearing the same uniform i used to wear myself, many of which probobly are men i served with?!?! i PRAY it never comes to that! but when my right get taken away and this government sets itself above it's own laws drastic action may possibly need to be taken!
here are some quotes from a man, is he a traitor too?
"The beauty of the second amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it."
"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government"
"I am not a friend to a very energetic government. It is always oppressive"
"What country can preserve its liberties if its rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance?"
The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first.
so what kind of radical miscreant uttered those quotes, have any idea?
i respond in the manner i am treated. so when i am treated in a civil manner i respond in kind, when some comes on and makes baseless accusations and resorts to simple name calling as a simple smear tactic, i repsond a bit differently. this would not confuse most people. i love my country, and i fear the direction the government is going, had i lived 200 years ago i would definatley not been a federalist.
Hmm... just a second... magic google ball says TJ! Do I get an honorary seat on the NRA for that?
"homophobe? when have i ever been that? i have never even typed the word "homosexual" on this forum EVER until now, much less had a conversation about them. is this the ole lib slander tactic being played out? when all else fails call people names?"
Well you're not alone in that stereotype so don't fret! Just about anyone who forcefully interjects their belief structure unto the prerogative of consenting adults they've never met in their lives get lumped into such a category. If you weren't afraid of homosexuals, I doubt you'd really give a rat's a$$ whether or not they decided to change vows with their loved ones.
"and where in left field did you grab "renowned constitutional historian". i have never claimed that. "
Oh, no? Ok, "but it seems i know enough history to remember the constitution was designed as a liitation (?) on the government, not the people."
It wouldn't make much sense for you to state "but when my right get taken away and this government sets itself above it's own laws drastic action may possibly need to be taken!" if you weren't well qualified in historical academia, otherwise such a statement might be construed as... how can I put this delicately... completely and utterly bat sh1t crazy?
The only "saving grace" is that you "PRAY it never comes to that." Christ would be proud, "Shadowhawk"! The restraint you've demonstrated above is truly unparalleled. Why, you actually PRAY you don't murder other people for taking YOUR rights away! Blessed be thy name, Shadow Hawk!
I wonder if those men you "served" with ever realized you'd frag them if they so much as oppressed your right to oppress. If I had to toss a couple dozen sand bags with you in the desert, you creep the ever-living hell out of me. I wonder if the Unabomber has a spare bunk in his cell?
"homophobe? when have i ever been that? i have never even typed the word "homosexual" on this forum EVER until now, much less had a conversation about them. is this the ole lib slander tactic being played out? when all else fails call people names?"
Well you're not alone in that stereotype so don't fret! Just about anyone who forcefully interjects their belief structure unto the prerogative of consenting adults they've never met in their lives get lumped into such a category. If you weren't afraid of homosexuals, I doubt you'd really give a rat's a$$ whether or not they decided to change vows with their loved ones.
"and where in left field did you grab "renowned constitutional historian". i have never claimed that. "
Oh, no? Ok, "but it seems i know enough history to remember the constitution was designed as a liitation (?) on the government, not the people."
It wouldn't make much sense for you to state "but when my right get taken away and this government sets itself above it's own laws drastic action may possibly need to be taken!" if you weren't well qualified in historical academia, otherwise such a statement might be construed as... how can I put this delicately... completely and utterly bat sh1t crazy?
The only "saving grace" is that you "PRAY it never comes to that." Christ would be proud, "Shadowhawk"! The restraint you've demonstrated above is truly unparalleled. Why, you actually PRAY you don't murder other people for taking YOUR rights away! Blessed be thy name, Shadow Hawk!
I wonder if those men you "served" with ever realized you'd frag them if they so much as oppressed your right to oppress. If I had to toss a couple dozen sand bags with you in the desert, you creep the ever-living hell out of me. I wonder if the Unabomber has a spare bunk in his cell?
no. just a cookie.
again i have never even had a conversation on the subject. but hey go ahead and assume whatever, and continue with the sophomoric insults, if that is what it takes to make you feel better about yourself, knock yourself out! it seems to be all you are capable of.
that should have been "limitation" i am sure even you could have extrapolated that. as for knowing history, i canot help it if i actually learned something in school.
""In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a scarce man; brave, hated, and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot." Mark Twain.
actually, i pray the situation does not come to that. if it does however, i will not hesitate to fight.
actually we all talked about it alot. about how the government is getting to powerful, the rights of the people being slowly drained away..etc.etc. if the dreaded time comes about 2/3 of the army will be on my side. at the very least 1/2
even if not however, i find dying fighting for the principles this country was founded upon a preferable alternative than life in a tyrranical nation that is nothing but a perverted version of it's former self.
if your that scared dude just call the FBI on me. my IP address is logged.
and have a good night!
Hey Shadow, seeing the posts from the characters in here shows how people easily became what they did in such a Country that tried to take over the world in the late 1930's. Very scary indeed.
It's also been very obvious of the shortcomings of History lessons in schooling now and lack of Patriotism. It's hard to fault them 100% since things like the Pledge of Allegiance have been made illegal and outlawed in school. There is no Morality taught at home or school anymore either so none of this should be any surprise. We are breeding Anarchy.
I see we have a lively discussion. I am let down at the lack of actual intellegent thought. How can this discussion keep raging without a mention of Madison and Maidisonian Factions. A civil war is not a certain thing but there are contributing factors. The US was considered a melting pot at one point, you ad in different cultures and they infleunce the composition of the stew. People are now being taught the tossed salad instead. The salad is bad, its the wrong way to view it. Diversity is bad. You are not an African-American, or a Latin-American. DANGER! If you can't keep the spirit that we are just Americans you have allowed factions. Racial diversity welcomes clear cut factions and these factions are key for civil war because they dam up all compromise. Us and them becomes much easier when you have relaxed the idea of assimilation right down to the minute detail that now children aren't taught the melting pot but the mixed or tossed salad metaphore. As far as past civil wars are concerned the South was about diversity and difference of opinion and freedom to believe and practice how you want as long as you are left alone. The North which won the war pushed a policy of forcing its views on the South and abolishing "gay marriage, abortion, gun control" or what was in the day called slavery. Its all the same, it was a belief and a the system that won forbid a difference of belief about a bunch of different issues. I am not saying slavery is the same as abortion or gun control, but that it being a different practice or belief it directly parallels the others. The North won and many people believe the North was right, that slavery is wrong, that there should be no abortion or gay marriage and that these things are wrong. Leftists will talk about being left alone as if its the Holy Grail of American idealogy. Its not.
Imagine I have an island (even in a landlocked state) near your community. You can't hear or see what I do on the island but you know that I raise puppies and kittens. I raise these animals for the sole purpose of torturing them. I am not hurting anybody, do you have a right to declare my actions illegal? Do you have the right to force me to cease and desist my torture of these animals. They are under the law my property like your car. I am not harming a single citizen, the only harm that can be inferred is how digusted you are by my actions. Change kittens to gay marriage etc. Morality has a long tradition of being legislated in this country. It is part of being an American to legislate morality and force others to comply with it. Its not about freedom.
If you are born without legs and have arms that don't move this isn't considered normal. It happened naturally but it is considered a defect of nature or a form illness. Some people are born with healthy bodies but corrupt conscience and an inferior use of their mind to determine right from wrong. These people are subject to the morality laws setup by our representatives who know better. A society will enforce morality or it will be destroyed. Many gay advocacy groups want to allow man boy sex. That is they want to lower the age of consent to 9 years old so men in their 50s can have sex with boys age 9. Well it all starts by lowering the age to 16, or allowing to men to have sex.
What is a "lifestyle?" Kidnapping little children and sodomizing them is a lifestyle. Killing your neighbors and eating them is a lifestyle. Having two mommies is a lifestyle. Hell a lifestyle is simply you doing whatever the hell you want. Playing computer all day and not having a job is a lifestyle.
Leftists are driven by emotion as the primary decision making motive and justification. Conservatives are driven by reason as the primary decision making motive and justification. Leftists call those who dissent heartless and make please to your feelings. A conservative will show you studies, statistics, scientific analysis and game theory. Leftists believe there is no absolute truth, Conservatives believe there is absolute truth. To compromise the truth with lies ends up with lies and the truth is soiled. Right with wrong becomes wrong. Conservatives can't compromise with leftists because you can't mix and measure of falsehood and the wrong with the truth and right. The civil war may evolve out of a well informed group on the right, the left can only initiate a civil war through hippocrasy. If there is no right or wrong and absolute truth, then it is possible that conservatives are right, and it is possible they are wrong, but to a conservative there are absolutes so they know they are right.
The Congress continues to increase the number of Republicans elected. States that have been traditionally democrat have gone republican in recent elections. The bottom line is America is on the right, but since the terms are normative America is always in the center. The leftists don't realize they are leftists and call Fox news a right of center moderate news channel a conservative rightist channel. Well its not hard right and to think that and say it gives away how much parallax the left is suffering from. How is it these Republicans that are so not popular and nobody in the middle agrees with end up getting the majority of votes and taking over all sorts of seats in government. WAKE UP, ITS BECAUSE THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS AGREE WITH THE REPUBLICANS. You may never change your political views, but as the society ebbs and flows your views can go from ultra conservative to ultra liberal without changing. As long as everyone else shifts the normative system shifts and your relative position keeps changing. A lot of people are getting very angry with George W. Bush. Take time to look around and see if you have changed or at least if the rest of America has all of a sudden become stupid and wrong.
You are usually considered crazy if you disagree with everyone else, like what day it is, how normal it is to talk to yourself etc. It is possible that everyone but the far left is wrong, but try and consider that maybe 70% of the population isn't wrong and its just a difference of opinion and you are now part of the minority opinion. How poorly you accept and deny this, such as considering Bush an unelected president, indicates the danger of a Madisonian faction. I don't care if Bush only gets 1 vote, if by the Constitution that makes him the President then so be it. I prefer the Democracy from which I decent to the tyranny with which I agree. I more and more get the feeling the left prefers the tyranny than this democracy. "He wasn't elected" "They control the supreme court" etc are all not attacks on the Republicans but attacks on the very foundation of the legitamacy of the United States Constitutional Republic. I see people throwing around the entire government like it was a triffle.
Ben Franklin said you need a revolution every 100 years, but he also said don't take too lightly the consequences of a revolution. If you desecrate this current regime in favor of another don't complain if you get a Christian Zealot who makes all the leftist social agenda punishable by death, if you tempt fate and chance you can think your right all the time but when nobody agrees with you and nothing goes as you say what does it really mean to be right?
It is of no comfort to me that I am under the yolk of many hands than under the yolk of a single tyrant.
Imagine I have an island (even in a landlocked state) near your community. You can't hear or see what I do on the island but you know that I raise puppies and kittens. I raise these animals for the sole purpose of torturing them. I am not hurting anybody, do you have a right to declare my actions illegal? Do you have the right to force me to cease and desist my torture of these animals. They are under the law my property like your car. I am not harming a single citizen, the only harm that can be inferred is how digusted you are by my actions. Change kittens to gay marriage etc. Morality has a long tradition of being legislated in this country. It is part of being an American to legislate morality and force others to comply with it. Its not about freedom.
If you are born without legs and have arms that don't move this isn't considered normal. It happened naturally but it is considered a defect of nature or a form illness. Some people are born with healthy bodies but corrupt conscience and an inferior use of their mind to determine right from wrong. These people are subject to the morality laws setup by our representatives who know better. A society will enforce morality or it will be destroyed. Many gay advocacy groups want to allow man boy sex. That is they want to lower the age of consent to 9 years old so men in their 50s can have sex with boys age 9. Well it all starts by lowering the age to 16, or allowing to men to have sex.
What is a "lifestyle?" Kidnapping little children and sodomizing them is a lifestyle. Killing your neighbors and eating them is a lifestyle. Having two mommies is a lifestyle. Hell a lifestyle is simply you doing whatever the hell you want. Playing computer all day and not having a job is a lifestyle.
Leftists are driven by emotion as the primary decision making motive and justification. Conservatives are driven by reason as the primary decision making motive and justification. Leftists call those who dissent heartless and make please to your feelings. A conservative will show you studies, statistics, scientific analysis and game theory. Leftists believe there is no absolute truth, Conservatives believe there is absolute truth. To compromise the truth with lies ends up with lies and the truth is soiled. Right with wrong becomes wrong. Conservatives can't compromise with leftists because you can't mix and measure of falsehood and the wrong with the truth and right. The civil war may evolve out of a well informed group on the right, the left can only initiate a civil war through hippocrasy. If there is no right or wrong and absolute truth, then it is possible that conservatives are right, and it is possible they are wrong, but to a conservative there are absolutes so they know they are right.
The Congress continues to increase the number of Republicans elected. States that have been traditionally democrat have gone republican in recent elections. The bottom line is America is on the right, but since the terms are normative America is always in the center. The leftists don't realize they are leftists and call Fox news a right of center moderate news channel a conservative rightist channel. Well its not hard right and to think that and say it gives away how much parallax the left is suffering from. How is it these Republicans that are so not popular and nobody in the middle agrees with end up getting the majority of votes and taking over all sorts of seats in government. WAKE UP, ITS BECAUSE THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS AGREE WITH THE REPUBLICANS. You may never change your political views, but as the society ebbs and flows your views can go from ultra conservative to ultra liberal without changing. As long as everyone else shifts the normative system shifts and your relative position keeps changing. A lot of people are getting very angry with George W. Bush. Take time to look around and see if you have changed or at least if the rest of America has all of a sudden become stupid and wrong.
You are usually considered crazy if you disagree with everyone else, like what day it is, how normal it is to talk to yourself etc. It is possible that everyone but the far left is wrong, but try and consider that maybe 70% of the population isn't wrong and its just a difference of opinion and you are now part of the minority opinion. How poorly you accept and deny this, such as considering Bush an unelected president, indicates the danger of a Madisonian faction. I don't care if Bush only gets 1 vote, if by the Constitution that makes him the President then so be it. I prefer the Democracy from which I decent to the tyranny with which I agree. I more and more get the feeling the left prefers the tyranny than this democracy. "He wasn't elected" "They control the supreme court" etc are all not attacks on the Republicans but attacks on the very foundation of the legitamacy of the United States Constitutional Republic. I see people throwing around the entire government like it was a triffle.
Ben Franklin said you need a revolution every 100 years, but he also said don't take too lightly the consequences of a revolution. If you desecrate this current regime in favor of another don't complain if you get a Christian Zealot who makes all the leftist social agenda punishable by death, if you tempt fate and chance you can think your right all the time but when nobody agrees with you and nothing goes as you say what does it really mean to be right?
It is of no comfort to me that I am under the yolk of many hands than under the yolk of a single tyrant.
Good post.
I didn't realize Franklin said there would be Revolutions every 100 years, damn we're as over due as a big California Quake. That also means that is normal and is a let down in intelligence and allowing History to repeat itself especially stupid History. Just highlights we're not as smart as some believe they are.
I didn't realize Franklin said there would be Revolutions every 100 years, damn we're as over due as a big California Quake. That also means that is normal and is a let down in intelligence and allowing History to repeat itself especially stupid History. Just highlights we're not as smart as some believe they are.
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