POLL: can you drive stick shift? and if you can...

[Wadded Beef]

can you double can you drive stick shift? AND...
double clutch or heel-toe?

(yes i know it's called double de-clutch downshifting but we'll call it double clutching for simplicity's sake)

i personally can double clutch, but haven't tried heel toe, the pedals in my car are pretty far apart plus i've got big feet that get stuck down there if i move em too vigorously...though it's something i'd like to learn

 

[kyparrish]

rh71 has your first question covered...

maybe you could have just made a poll about "double clutching" or "heel-toeing"???

 

[Goosemaster]

I, for some odd reason, think I know what people mean by double clutching, buut then get sidetracked and end up regarding it as something else.

Basically, I know how to handle my POS, and I prove everyday. Really nothing else needs to be said.

Thanks for your time

[/thread]

 

[MikeMike]

if you cant double clutch, yet you can drive a standard, you really need something on you to be checked.

MIKE

 

[Yossarian]

Originally posted by: nourdmrolNMT1
if you cant double clutch, yet you can drive a standard, you really need something on you to be checked.

MIKE

why is that.

 

[Wadded Beef]

Originally posted by: nourdmrolNMT1
if you cant double clutch, yet you can drive a standard, you really need something on you to be checked.

MIKE

most people i know who drive stick can't double clutch...

 

[JulesMaximus]

I never really understood the reason for double clutching. I can heel toe though and I can drive a stick.

 

[jagec]

I can do all three.

However, it's really hard to heel-toe on my current car, with my big feet

 

[Demo24]

I can sorta drive a stick. Dont have a car thats got one to practice enough though Hopefully Ill grab a car soon and Heel toeing here I come

 

[MikeMike]

double clutching as in shifting into neutral, and then rev matching correct?

MIKE

 

[FoBoT]

i have one manual transmission car, i don't know what you are talking about, double dutch heel to toe, sounds like some kind of jump rope dancing

 

[Vic]

Yes, I can double-clutch and heel-and-toe.

And your poll is a little skewed. Proper double-clutching requires doing heel-and-toe, while doing a heel-and-toe does not require double-clutching.

Heel-and-toe = using the gas and brake at the same time while clutch in or out of gear in order to blip the throttle and match revs prior to a downshift while braking. This reduces stress on the synchros while enabling for a smoother and faster downshift without upsetting the vehicle balance.

Double-clutch = clutch in, shift to neutral, clutch out, heel-and-toe rev-match, clutch in, downshift, clutch out

 

[Goosemaster]

Originally posted by: nourdmrolNMT1
double clutching as in shifting into neutral, and then rev matching correct?

MIKE

Really?

I usally rev match before I shift so I con't get caught in neutral

push clutch, rev, shift, opo or let in sfotly, depending on the sit.

 

[Goosemaster]

vic, why brake?

I jsut rev match perfectly and then apply the brake at the end so that the car does msot of the work.

clutch in, blip throttle, shift, blip again if need be, and then let it engine brake + the brake

 

[91TTZ]

Double clutching is an old term made popular by lame movies like the Fast the & Furious. If you see some racerboy claim that he double clutches around town all the time, you know he'a a loser and he really needs something on him to be checked.

For those who don't know, double-clutching was needed on very old manual transmissions without synchros. All modern manual transmissions have synchros eliminating the need for double-clutching.

Most young idiots do it "because its kewl", and then crash their car into a tree.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
I never really understood the reason for double clutching. I can heel toe though and I can drive a stick.

To synchronize the gear tooth linear velocity for the input and output gears. Drive a non-synchro transmission sometime and you'll see why it's used.

"Heel and toe" is a specific subset of double-clutching that involves simultaneously making a double-clutched downshift and braking.

ZV

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
I never really understood the reason for double clutching. I can heel toe though and I can drive a stick.

Double-clutching is ideal for shifting into 1st while still moving forward.

The reason is to spin up the transmission input shaft between the clutch and the gear so that it matches engine speed prior to gear engagement with the output shaft. Otherwise, without the double-clutch, the input shaft will still be spinning at the output shaft speed regardless of any engine rev-matching you do with the clutch in. So the only way to do rev-match the input shaft is to clutch out and mechanically connect it to the engine, blip throttle rev-match, and then clutch in and shift.
Try it sometime in your STi. When you get it really smooth it will feel like the stick just fell right into the gear missing the synchros entirely.

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Double clutching is an old term made popular by lame movies like the Fast the & Furious. If you see some racerboy claim that he double clutches around town all the time, you know he'a a loser and he really needs something on him to be checked.

For those who don't know, double-clutching was needed on very old manual transmissions without synchros. All modern manual transmissions have synchros eliminating the need for double-clutching.

Most young idiots do it "because its kewl", and then crash their car into a tree.

not really.

It does make the shifter move a little nicer.

And I'm calling shens on the poll. It takes a tremendous amount of practice to double-clutch/heel-toe well.

Vic I'm pretty sure can and he could vouch for me.

But I also believe that it takes a whole lot of work/practice to get anywhere near decent/seemless at it.

 

[TwoBills]

Hard on the brakes, clutch in, 3rd to neutral, clutch out, rev to match, clutch in, click into 2nd. Takes about a second. Double clutching and heel and toe go together like bread and butter.

Now I gotta go explain to my kid what happened at Gettysburg.

 

[Wadded Beef]

Originally posted by: 91TTZ
Double clutching is an old term made popular by lame movies like the Fast the & Furious. If you see some racerboy claim that he double clutches around town all the time, you know he'a a loser and he really needs something on him to be checked.

For those who don't know, double-clutching was needed on very old manual transmissions without synchros. All modern manual transmissions have synchros eliminating the need for double-clutching.

Most young idiots do it "because its kewl", and then crash their car into a tree.

no... i do it to save the brakes and synchros. plus it's kewl

 

[Bullhonkie]

I single clutch rev-match when I downshift. Don't see any reason to really double clutch on modern cars with syncros. I can heel-toe but the whole motion is still a bit exaggerated. I need to work on being able to do it faster while staying smooth with it.

 

[91TTZ]

If you notice, the young people on most message boards do everything that young idiots everywhere else do, yet they don't want to be stereotyped. The car forum I frequent used to be more mature, but with the cars getting older and the price dropping, we're getting plenty of people who ask ridiculous kiddie questions like "can I put lambo doors on my Z", or "how do I double-clutch my Z?". It's funny how people in the previous years didn't talk about that crap, but with the younger kids buying the cars and watching 2F2F, they bring that "scene" with them.

 

[SilentRavens]

All the way proper double clutching on a stick.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Goosemaster
vic, why brake?

I jsut rev match perfectly and then apply the brake at the end so that the car does msot of the work.

clutch in, blip throttle, shift, blip again if need be, and then let it engine brake + the brake

Think flying off the freeway at 80mph and coming up to a downhill off-ramp stoplight. Brakes on smoothly the whole time while rev-match downshifting, 5->4->3.


edit: I hardly ever double-clutch. Not necessary IMO except for the rare moving downshift into 1st.

 

[Goosemaster]

You guys need to see, errr, experience my Dad driving his Izuzu rodeo...lol

what a site..

florrs it, clutch in ..long pause, jerking shift, lets in the clutch in all at once....somehow, his clutch still last a hell of a long time...

that said, you'd get quite dizzy as a passenger...

..and when I give him a ride in my car all i hear is "what's wrong with your car, is it the transmission again" because the shifts are smooth