Hayabusa Rider
Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
- Jan 26, 2000
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So if you are ordered to rape someone or kill a child you should follow it? That seems like what it would mean if you take it to its logical conclusion.
rudder
Lifer
- Nov 9, 2000
- 19,441
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U.S. soldiers do follow orders. If an officer is following his orders and being true to his honor, he would never ask a subordinate to rape someone. Officers do not have unlimited powers to order thier subordinates to do what they please. A grunt would be well within his rights to refuse a direct order like that.
I have yet to see the video so I cannot comment on what happened. But I would just like to point out that last Thursday we honored our WWII vets. And guess what, a few of them shot unarmed individuals. Towards the end of the war it was not uncommon for Germans to take some pot shots at GI's and then run out to surrender. Sometimes these unarmed German soldiers were gunned down particulary if they killed or wounded a GI before surrenduring. So I reserve judgement on this soldier until I hear the whole story and not just view a few scond video clip.
Originally posted by: Infohawk
Just curious. Troops deserve support but at some point they can cross the line and be deserving of disapproval. What is it for you?
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Why don't you just say, I do not support the war or the troops and stop with the kid games
1. Participating in any violence- All wars are more violent then anything you could dream of
2. Participating in an unjust war- LOL the lefts name for the war
3. Killing ANY civilians- we have soldiers dying trying to protect civilians as it should be
4. Killing defenseless civilians- if it does happen it is not by intentions and sad fact is people die in war
5. Abusing the enemy- that has been gone through enough
6. Torturing the enemy- look at number 5
7. Never. No matter what a soldier does I approve.- that is stupid
I support the troops and what they are doing, It is a sad fact that we always lose our best but they will not be forgotten and will always be supported, By me anyway
Just curious. Troops deserve support but at some point they can cross the line and be deserving of disapproval. What is it for you?
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Why don't you just say, I do not support the war or the troops and stop with the kid games
1. Participating in any violence- All wars are more violent then anything you could dream of
2. Participating in an unjust war- LOL the lefts name for the war
3. Killing ANY civilians- we have soldiers dying trying to protect civilians as it should be
4. Killing defenseless civilians- if it does happen it is not by intentions and sad fact is people die in war
5. Abusing the enemy- that has been gone through enough
6. Torturing the enemy- look at number 5
7. Never. No matter what a soldier does I approve.- that is stupid
I support the troops and what they are doing, It is a sad fact that we always lose our best but they will not be forgotten and will always be supported, By me anyway
You didn't really pay attention, did you? I am asking when will you disapprove of a soldier. Are you really saying you will NEVER disapprove of a soldier? I wanted to see if there were people that unethical and I was shown to be right. If a soldier rapes someone and you approve you are sick. If you had read the other posts you would have seen that I was talking about specific soldiers, not generally.
No one advocates killing babies or raping. You've taken this thread to extremes. It's rediculous at this point. I do not believe our soldiers are raping or intentionally killing babies, and neither do you. All these what if's are rediculous.
It's a hypothetical question you reading comprehension flunky. Do you get it now? What if... At what point...
So if you've been around longer than me this is a new account?
If you have been in P&N longer then you will know that your statement suggesting the mods are biased is garbage.
SP33Demon
Lifer
- Jun 22, 2001
- 27,928
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I fail to see the point you are trying to prove, Info. Do you create threads like this to make yourself feel better that people agree with you that the war is wrong? Most of America agrees that the war is wrong, and yes I voted for Kerry to get this clown named Bush out of office, but I got over it. I support the troops 100%, and our president, even if it means giving him a second chance to right his wrongs. You, on the other hand, let it eat at you night and day, when you should just let it go. Yes we know we shouldn't be there, yes Bush fcked up, but now we are too far into the mess to get out. There are some things that you, as a citizen, have no control over, so you may as well let it go before you have a stroke. Last but not least, that's the difference between moderates and the far left, we (moderates) think logically while the left thinks fanatically.
Depends on the situation, things are rarely as black and white as you paint it, is the baby injured, does it have a chance for life or is it going to die anyway but in more pain?
I want you to give me a real world example of womeone who have been ordered to do anything like that.
Until you do, let me say this, i have been doing this for 17 years and i have never been ordered to carry out such a task nor would i order my men to do so.
I find your question dishonest and looking to find some blame where there is none to be found.
A soldier follows orders that are laid out by his commander, that is it.
Are you sure? Think about the Nanking massacre. I think it's reasonable to assume some pretty heinous things have been ordered in history-- including shooting unarmed civilians and kililng babies (edit: healthy babies)
. You didn't really pay attention, did you? I am asking when will you disapprove of a soldier. Are you really saying you will NEVER disapprove of a soldier? I wanted to see if there were people that unethical and I was shown to be right. If a soldier rapes someone and you approve you are sick. If you had read the other posts you would have seen that I was talking about specific soldiers, not generally.
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Yes infohawk I really did pay attention to your b.s. and everyone knows what you mean, Generally. I think you know I am one of them soldiers you hate so much. The soldiers in Iraq are doing something you could never do and 98% of the others here, You little yourself with your post. God Bless our troops and the USA
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Yes infohawk I really did pay attention to your b.s. and everyone knows what you mean, Generally. I think you know I am one of them soldiers you hate so much. The soldiers in Iraq are doing something you could never do and 98% of the others here, You little yourself with your post. God Bless our troops and the USA
It was just a fragment of information from an entire vignette. I would not say I "support" that marine, but I do feel I am not informed enough to make a valid contribution as to his ultimate disposal. There is a system in place to weigh the evidence and decide his guilt, I will let the system work.
As for the original question in this thread, I personally would not support a soldier acting in a cruel fashion outside the normal and expected cruelties of war. Harming a civialian on purpose, not taking prisoners (especially when surrendering) (and assuming it is entirely possible to take on POWs at that point of the attack). Exceeding their authority with a "might makes right" attitude. OTOH I suppose in the heat of attack and condition of weariness, not every soldier is fit to make the best decision. It's just not an easy gig, you know?
Pliablemoose
Lifer
- Oct 11, 1999
- 25,195
- 0
- 56
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