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Poll: 50% of repubs would support Trump postponing 2020 election!

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No, you don't understand it in the least, which is why you "don't believe many polls have any significance to them." By dismissing anything and everything you find inconvenient, you are illustrating the crazy which is exactly what this poll is measuring.

What are you talking about? What do I find inconvenient? Do you even know, or are you just saying things to make yourself feel better? I was with you until that sentence, but now youre clearly just making things up.
 
What are you talking about? What do I find inconvenient? Do you even know, or are you just saying things to make yourself feel better? I was with you until that sentence, but now youre clearly just making things up.

Maybe you could help us understand what part of the central limit theorem, the law of large numbers, etc, you are disputing?
 
Maybe you could help us understand what part of the central limit theorem, the law of large numbers, etc, you are disputing?

Im no expert, but doesnt the law or large numbers say that eventually most outcomes equalize if performed enough times? If thats the case, wouldnt every single poll just be 50% anyway if you asked enough people a binary question? Dont know what that central limit thingy is, I think im going to look it up.
 
Im no expert, but doesnt the law or large numbers say that eventually most outcomes equalize if performed enough times? If thats the case, wouldnt every single poll just be 50% anyway if you asked enough people a binary question? Dont know what that central limit thingy is, I think im going to look it up.

The central law of bidness says to stick to your core competency, ie. kenyan muslims and mexican rapists.
 
The central law of bidness says to stick to your core competency, ie. kenyan muslims and mexican rapists.

I literally dont even know what this means, any chance you plan on adding anything relevant to this discussion or will you just be parroting talking points?
 
Im no expert, but doesnt the law or large numbers say that eventually most outcomes equalize if performed enough times? If thats the case, wouldnt every single poll just be 50% anyway if you asked enough people a binary question? Dont know what that central limit thingy is, I think im going to look it up.

Law of large numbers is less important than the central limit theorem, law of large numbers just means random fluctuations are generally smoothed out.

The central limit theorem is basically the thing that makes scientific polling possible. In effect it says if you randomly select a sample from a larger group, so long as you have a sufficiently large sample the characteristics of that group will closely resemble the total population. The math shows the amount of people in your sample that you need is actually much smaller than you might think. It's why polling 1,000 people can accurately show what 320,000,000 people think.

The real challenges in modern polling are nonrandom samples due to low response rates. Having 300 people respond if it's a truly random sample is not an issue at all though. Assuming randomness their result is likely very accurate.
 
I literally dont even know what this means, any chance you plan on adding anything relevant to this discussion or will you just be parroting talking points?

Let's not pretend you can't recognize your party's own talking points. I think it's pretty relevant to remind conservatives when they get off track trying to do math.
 
Law of large numbers is less important than the central limit theorem, law of large numbers just means random fluctuations are generally smoothed out.

The central limit theorem is basically the thing that makes scientific polling possible. In effect it says if you randomly select a sample from a larger group, so long as you have a sufficiently large sample the characteristics of that group will closely resemble the total population. The math shows the amount of people in your sample that you need is actually much smaller than you might think. It's why polling 1,000 people can accurately show what 320,000,000 people think.

The real challenges in modern polling are nonrandom samples due to low response rates. Having 300 people respond if it's a truly random sample is not an issue at all though. Assuming randomness their result is likely very accurate.

Read a couple articles on it, thank you for your explanation. It seems to me that the CLT is highly reliant on having a large (enough) sample size that is truly random. It looks like the random aspect of it is the most important, and the hardest one to really achieve. I think in order for me to truly consider a poll significant, I would need to know their exact sample size and how they ensure that its a truly random group, asking 1300 people in California one question and asking 1300 Texans the same question would probobly give very different results (assuming the question was somthing about gun ownership etc..). Im going to continue looking into this topic, there appears to be a decent amount of theories on how this stuff works, but thats exactly what they are, theories.
 
Let's not pretend you can't recognize your party's own talking points. I think it's pretty relevant to remind conservatives when they get off track trying to do math.

I think youre a funny and sad troll, so im going to continue feeding you. Why do you think im affiliated with any party over another? Is it just easier for you to put me in that group because I dont automatically agree with everything you say?
 
Representativeness in these types of polls is very difficult. One can design the perfect polling strategy to achieve it but then get only a 20% response rate. Then one has to try to figure out if the respondents meet the representativeness requirements.
 
Read a couple articles on it, thank you for your explanation. It seems to me that the CLT is highly reliant on having a large (enough) sample size that is truly random. It looks like the random aspect of it is the most important, and the hardest one to really achieve. I think in order for me to truly consider a poll significant, I would need to know their exact sample size and how they ensure that its a truly random group, asking 1300 people in California one question and asking 1300 Texans the same question would probobly give very different results (assuming the question was somthing about gun ownership etc..).

The exact sample sizes are almost always given. As to how they achieve a representative sample there's a lot to read on it. As to whether you want to consider them significant or not that's your business but they are scientifically valid instruments that have proven very accurate over time.

In this case here even in a worst case scenario you're going to end up with something like only 40% of Republicans thinking we should delay the election because Trump made something up. Is that really much better?

Im going to continue looking into this topic, there appears to be a decent amount of theories on how this stuff works, but thats exactly what they are, theories.

They aren't 'just theories', they have been experimentally validated. In fact, you can grab some dice and validate them yourself if you feel like it.
 
I don't think anyone expects your sorts to have learned anything since then, not even yourself.

Good, nice and vague with an undertone of you having any idea what youre talking about. More of that, I know trolling isnt an exact science, and a lot of it depends on your audience, but direct insults usually wont retain as many people as passive-aggressive comments will. Bonus points if they dont make any sense, and youll REALLY get extra credit if you couldnt even comprehend them yourself. On its own, I give this a 55/100, but since I know you dont understand what you said, im going to bump you up to an easy 75/100. If you can find a way to creatively and indirectly call me a degenerate again, I can see high marks in your future.
 
Good, nice and vague with an undertone of you having any idea what youre talking about. More of that, I know trolling isnt an exact science, and a lot of it depends on your audience, but direct insults usually wont retain as many people as passive-aggressive comments will. Bonus points if they dont make any sense, and youll REALLY get extra credit if you couldnt even comprehend them yourself. On its own, I give this a 55/100, but since I know you dont understand what you said, im going to bump you up to an easy 75/100. If you can find a way to creatively and indirectly call me a degenerate again, I can see high marks in your future.

It's just simple fact that you're the typical degenerate media audience.
 
It's just simple fact that you're the typical degenerate media audience.

You built me up, only to let me right back down 🙁

10/100, and 5 points from griffindor.

You should start saying 10 things about yourself that are great, daily. I think itll help with your self loathing problem. You can count to 10, cant you?

Edit - Just in case.....

No shame in getting a few pointers my friend, math can get a bit tricky once youre dealing with more than 1 digit at a time.
 
Half the Republican base believes the unsecured border and the 10s of millions in the illegal population constitute an existential crisis whereby elections are at risk of being fraudulent. This is a deeply complicated subject, as it's the reason McCain and Bush failed to pass their "comprehensive immigration reform" 12 years ago. The base revolted against them for not wanting to secure the border and deport people first and foremost. These voters are scared, and acting crazy as a result.

"Acting?"
I know... you don't really understand them but they're the sorts I come from. I know a great deal about what drives at least some of them. I say it's a complex issue because there are various interests united here. There's plain old racists, there's nationalists, there's refugees, there's the poor. People who have different reasons but come together under this... issue. They really think it's important and that the nation is lost without effective action.

Reagan promised to secure it, and lied to them. Bush Jr promised... and lied. Trump promised and... well it gets old saying it after a while. With each successive liar trying to favor this voting bloc and failing to actually do something meaningful for them... they grow more desperate. Also because a state like Alabama has gone from 1% to 10% Hispanic in just the past 17 years. These voters have lived long enough to see the demographic tidal wave. They blame this issue, they blame past leaders, and this causes a sense of urgency. They cling to Trump for a desperate chance to fix it.

Trump is President in good part because he was the one to call it out and rally this segment of voters. Combined with his economic message, this made him stand out in the Primary. Otherwise he never stood a chance... but the rational Republicans were splitting the rational voters. Trump collected the rest, undivided.

Anyways, I've come to accept that there will be no mass deportation without violence. That it's just plain immoral. And in the face of such complexities my answer is to try and assimilate, to slow down immigration, to calm people. It's not easy to calm these voters though, especially next time the economy falters and Trump hasn't solved the issue for them. I'm afraid that, until we resolve their economic anxiety they're simply too embroiled into thinking something of value is being "taken" from them as a result of these "invaders". It's a depressing situation.

America needs a President who, on the back of a New Deal, can speak clearly with a sense of conviction that the moral choice for America is to respect the people living here, no matter their status. That we have taken the necessary steps to reduce their pain, and secure the economy. That they must give back by welcoming their fellow Americans. It's a nice dream, the trouble is how to get from here to there.
 
You built me up, only to let me right back down 🙁

10/100, and 5 points from griffindor.

You should start saying 10 things about yourself that are great, daily. I think itll help with your self loathing problem. You can count to 10, cant you?

It doesn't help your case to start blathering like some geriatric, this isn't conservative media.
 
Half the Republican base believes the unsecured border and the 10s of millions in the illegal population constitute an existential crisis whereby elections are at risk of being fraudulent. This is a deeply complicated subject, as it's the reason McCain and Bush failed to pass their "comprehensive immigration reform" 12 years ago. The base revolted against them for not wanting to secure the border and deport people first and foremost. These voters are scared, and acting crazy as a result.

"Acting?"
I know... you don't really understand them but they're the sorts I come from. I know a great deal about what drives at least some of them. I say it's a complex issue because there are various interests united here. There's plain old racists, there's nationalists, there's refugees, there's the poor. People who have different reasons but come together under this... issue. They really think it's important and that the nation is lost without effective action.

Reagan promised to secure it, and lied to them. Bush Jr promised... and lied. Trump promised and... well it gets old saying it after a while. With each successive liar trying to favor this voting bloc and failing to actually do something meaningful for them... they grow more desperate. Also because a state like Alabama has gone from 1% to 10% Hispanic in just the past 17 years. These voters have lived long enough to see the demographic tidal wave. They blame this issue, they blame past leaders, and this causes a sense of urgency. They cling to Trump for a desperate chance to fix it.

Trump is President in good part because he was the one to call it out and rally this segment of voters. Combined with his economic message, this made him stand out in the Primary. Otherwise he never stood a chance... but the rational Republicans were splitting the rational voters. Trump collected the rest, undivided.

Anyways, I've come to accept that there will be no mass deportation without violence. That it's just plain immoral. And in the face of such complexities my answer is to try and assimilate, to slow down immigration, to calm people. It's not easy to calm these voters though, especially next time the economy falters and Trump hasn't solved the issue for them. I'm afraid that, until we resolve their economic anxiety they're simply too embroiled into thinking something of value is being "taken" from them as a result of these "invaders". It's a depressing situation.

America needs a President who, on the back of a New Deal, can speak clearly with a sense of conviction that the moral choice for America is to respect the people living here, no matter their status. That we have taken the necessary steps to reduce their pain, and secure the economy. That they must give back by welcoming their fellow Americans. It's a nice dream, the trouble is how to get from here to there.

No, it makes perfect rational sense for people who got the better end of segregation to keep on top of them kenyan muslims, welfare queens, and mexican rapists.

It also rather makes sense to trade some votes on whatever side issues for a national platform for their message.
 
It doesn't help your case to start blathering like some geriatric, this isn't conservative media.

C'mon buddy, you can do this! Youre starting to falter, have you lost your confidence? You had a really decent post, and now theyre starting to return to the usual incoherent nonsense everyone on the forums has come to expect. Im afraid if you dont start picking your game back up, youre going to lose my interest. Care to try one last time? Maybe try saying somthing that has any sort of meaning associated with it, it doesnt even need to be true, you just need to confuse me long enough so I think its true.
 
C'mon buddy, you can do this! Youre starting to falter, have you lost your confidence? You had a really decent post, and now theyre starting to return to the usual incoherent nonsense everyone on the forums has come to expect. Im afraid if you dont start picking your game back up, youre going to lose my interest. Care to try one last time? Maybe try saying somthing that has any sort of meaning associated with it, it doesnt even need to be true, you just need to confuse me long enough so I think its true.

What would you say distinguishes you from any of the conservative media fans here?
 
Half the Republican base believes the unsecured border and the 10s of millions in the illegal population constitute an existential crisis whereby elections are at risk of being fraudulent. This is a deeply complicated subject, as it's the reason McCain and Bush failed to pass their "comprehensive immigration reform" 12 years ago. The base revolted against them for not wanting to secure the border and deport people first and foremost. These voters are scared, and acting crazy as a result.

"Acting?"
I know... you don't really understand them but they're the sorts I come from. I know a great deal about what drives at least some of them. I say it's a complex issue because there are various interests united here. There's plain old racists, there's nationalists, there's refugees, there's the poor. People who have different reasons but come together under this... issue. They really think it's important and that the nation is lost without effective action.

Reagan promised to secure it, and lied to them. Bush Jr promised... and lied. Trump promised and... well it gets old saying it after a while. With each successive liar trying to favor this voting bloc and failing to actually do something meaningful for them... they grow more desperate. Also because a state like Alabama has gone from 1% to 10% Hispanic in just the past 17 years. These voters have lived long enough to see the demographic tidal wave. They blame this issue, they blame past leaders, and this causes a sense of urgency. They cling to Trump for a desperate chance to fix it.

Trump is President in good part because he was the one to call it out and rally this segment of voters. Combined with his economic message, this made him stand out in the Primary. Otherwise he never stood a chance... but the rational Republicans were splitting the rational voters. Trump collected the rest, undivided.

Anyways, I've come to accept that there will be no mass deportation without violence. That it's just plain immoral. And in the face of such complexities my answer is to try and assimilate, to slow down immigration, to calm people. It's not easy to calm these voters though, especially next time the economy falters and Trump hasn't solved the issue for them. I'm afraid that, until we resolve their economic anxiety they're simply too embroiled into thinking something of value is being "taken" from them as a result of these "invaders". It's a depressing situation.

America needs a President who, on the back of a New Deal, can speak clearly with a sense of conviction that the moral choice for America is to respect the people living here, no matter their status. That we have taken the necessary steps to reduce their pain, and secure the economy. That they must give back by welcoming their fellow Americans. It's a nice dream, the trouble is how to get from here to there.

I'm going to call bullshit for the simple fact that in 2013 the senate came up with an immigration reform plan and passed it, that hinged on securing the border first before any other action could take place. Not only did the house not even bother taking up the bill but not a single Republican paid any price for not doing anything about immigration reform.

So it's not immigration reform that Republicans care about, its not border security, its not free trade or better trade deals either. I'm sure you can figure out what makes trump different and what his appeal is.
 
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