Political Poll:

[CyberSax]

Ornery - Good job on your earlier post. I like where Gore stands on the issues you presented. I am pro-choice, in favor of gun law, strongly believe that we need to help the environment by limiting fossil fuel emissions. In what I wrote before is that in October, Gore and Bush were going to debate in Mass. So the state started to get ready for the debate and spent a quarter of a million dollars. Bush recently decided not to have the debate because he (or someone in his campaign) decided that it would not be on fair grounds. he thought that Mass. was too democratic and he wouldn't stand a chance against Gore in the debate. My question is that if Bush thinks he is the better candidate, than why is he not coming her to debate? I would think that if Bush is the better candidate then he has nothing to be scared of and let him debate. I would love to see the both of them go at each other. I can't wait for the debates to begin. I am in favor of Gore at this time but if Bush can 'rub' me the right way then maybe he would get my vote. There is still a long way before the elections.

First of all, a quarter million dollars of Mass. taxpayer money is nothing, when you consider the fact that Mass. politicians like Frank Barney and the Kennedy's effectively swindled $15 billion of national taxpayer money by initially claiming that Boston's big dig project would cost 1/10 as much. Second, I can understand Bush's frustration of heading into Mass., a state which is extremely hostile towards Republicans. Why doesn't Gore stop being a pussy, and agree to a second debate in a more conservative state like Utah or Arizona?

 

[optoman]

They are going to debate in other states. It just pisses me off that Bush was suppose to come and now he says no. Yes the big dig is costing way more money than it should but a quarter of a million is still a lot of money. I seriously don't think Bush would win in a debate with Gore.

 

[Russ]

Well, the test that Ornery linked says that I am a "Libertarian-Leaning Conservative", and that my first three matches are:

George W. Bush
Alan Keyes
Howard Phillips

The only one lower than Gore was Ralph Nader.

Russ, NCNE

 

[JellyBaby]

Just a note to those fiscal conservatives who like the Libertarians but still want to waste their vote by going with Shrub: at least give thought to voting for every independent and libertarian at the state/local levels. Eventually, we'll need the electorate to vote for libs and the only way to do that is to vote in lib senators and reps.

 

[Ornery]

• • I think I need a big, fat joint... that or some sleep...

...wake me when the election is over :frown:

 

[JellyBaby]

<< ...wake me when the election is over >>

It already is: your choice is a second Bush or Clinton administration. Bigtime YAWN. The nefs will vote one beanhead or the other in, and their parties will continue the business of serving special interests and foreign states and once again the humble average American citizen draws the short straw.

 

[CyberSax]

People say all this sh|t about how wonderful third parties are, but have you ever watched a Third Party convention? I watched the entire Libertarian party convention this year: it was quite amusing, but disturbing at the same time. At the Libertarian convention, all the crazy nuts believed that anyone who was even remotely associated with the government was evil and was fit to be labeled &quot;a thief&quot; (most speakers kept referring to schoolteachers and members of the army like this). And they kept calling taxes &quot;stolen money&quot;. WTF? How do these morons propose roads to be built? Public services to be rendered? The country to be defended in the event of a war? Everyone there was either some rich person who just didn't want to pay taxes, or some drugged out hippy (lots of folks wearing tie dyed shirts). At the end of the convention, they had finally established a platform. But it wasn't much of a platform. Their idealogy is little more than an organized plan to demolish the government and institute some kind of perverse anarchy on the nation.

I'm sure there's considerable novelty in claiming that you endorse Harry Browne, but wake up and realize that the guy and his cronies are a bunch of morons. And Commie Nader ain't much better.

Actually, I'd actually prefer that a person vote for Gore, over Harry Browne or Nader. Gore is corrupt and liar, but he isn't insane

 

[Swag1138]

Im starting a write in campaign for Thomas J. Kickass.
Whos in?

 

[BoberFett]

Yes CyberSax, your good old boys are such a fine crop of human beings. :| <barf>

 

[Buddha Bart]

Cyber: that was nasty and worse, uninformed.

If you would like to know how they plan on buiding roads and other such projects, feel free to read their site, or sign up for their mailing list.

And like I said in my first post, I don't agree with them to the bitter end, but I believe we need a heavy libertarian influence on modern politics.

bart

 

[thedarkwolf]

One more for Harry Browne

 

[THELAIR]

Whats the current US Debt sitting at?

What was the surplus for fiscal year 1999 for the country?

If i recal, just off hand, the debt is around 3 trillion or so correct? And to the best of my knowledge the surplus was like 80 or so billion dollars right?

Heres my point.

Again, another Canadian looking in on the US system, we find your political commercials on TV quite amusing actually, but this is my point.

The province in Alberta during the 80's had a Regan like leader, massive spending on capital projects etc, thus running up the debt. It wasnt untill the early 90's that a new leader came into power and did all the unpopular things that a leader/politician shouldnt do.

* Slashed wages of civil servants (primarily teachers/doctors)
* blew up hospitals,
* disolved unions,
* ultimatium to the people who have been on welfare for over 2 years to either get a job or a free 100 dollar greyhound bus ticket outta the province
* and he did the worst thing imaginable raised taxes.

what did that accomplish? By trimming the fat to the bone, he turned the economy around in 5 years. By starting primarily from having a fiscal loss year after year to a gain, at first a measly hundred million or so, untill recently several billion dollars. What seemed like an unsurmountable debt that will take a generation to repay, it will be paid down and eliminated in only 3 more years, making Alberta the only province to be debt free.

With that news and a 5 billion surplus for fiscal year 99, the government decided to put 4 billion of that into debt repayment. The other 1 billion? As a tax relief in the form of 300 dollars to every man women and child over the age of 16. And they are sayiing that next year htey will slash business tax by a FULL 50%, making it a world competitor for attracting global business into the area.

Its an interesting point that the Finance minister, the guy who dreamed up the debt repayment plan is running as our nations next Prime Minister.

However in hte US all you hear is people saying &quot;wow they got all that money this year, id like to see some of that...&quot; Hello people, wake up.. you are spending billions more a year on interest on that 4 or 5 trillion dollar debt. Why doesnt anyone see this? Put a certain percantage of every surplus towards debt repayment, whatever is left over can be put aside for tax relief but not the other way, where 60% is tax relief and 40% is debt repayment etc etc

i dont know, maybe its different, i mean you have all be living with that debt looming over you for a few decades now, whats a few more trillion right?


anyways, im gettig 300 bucks from the govemenment... Now i get to decide what to spend it on Just imagine that on a federal level in your country. Every man women and child gets a 3,000 dollar dividend a year based on the performance of the country, or even more! thats just an example. Its not that far off, IF YOU START NOW... otherwise forget about it.

 

[saxman]

good points, the lair.

 

[JellyBaby]

CyberSax, you misunderstand the libertarian party's issues. The libs want to reduce the federal government to its constitutional levels. The states would remain in tact of course and still collect taxes for transportation services and public schools. National defense will be easily paid for by excise taxes and usary fees.

As for the libs being a bunch of &quot;loonies&quot; the same was said of governor Jesse &quot;The Body&quot; Venture of Minnesota. I don't see MN delcaring war on iowa. I don't see its citizens decrying the craziness of Jesse. In fact he's doing a great job from all I read. Average people (those not born and bred to be politicans like Albert and Shrub) make damn good public officials.

 

[DaBoneHead]

Jesse Ventura, because he is honest, plus it would be great to know that our president can whup the a$$ of any other nations president.

But seriously,

Bush is pursuing the presidency because it is his legacy. He isn't the most intelligent nor is he the most dedicated. I don't support 'royal' families in the US... Not the Kennedys', and not the Bushs' either.

Gore is in his own world, and I don't think he is a bad person, but he is too introverted, and has shown himself that much better than his environment.

Perot?!?! you gotta be kidding. Back in 92, his first choice for VP was Elvis, until someone sat him down and said &quot;Ross, Elvis really is dead...&quot;.

I want a real third party... WHO IS WITH ME!

 

[syber321]

I don't really trust Bush Junior....I haven't seen him take any real stands. He somtimes says he's for something, then not for it. He wants to do something, then he doesn't. Basically, he's just trying to impress everyone at once, and doesn't really show what he really believes in, if anything. I'd vote for Gore over Bush, definitely. Not that Gore is perfect though. I'd probably end up voting green or something, heh...

 

[JellyBaby]

syber321, everything you said about Shrub applies to Bore as well. Albert &quot;finger in the wind&quot; Bore is any better? Open your eyes!

But this is irrelevant. Vote for ideas not for people. If you don't exercise your civic duties you may lose them!

 

[Russ]

<< And they kept calling taxes &quot;stolen money&quot;. >>



Cybersax,

Taxes are stolen money. Or, more accurately, extorted money; at the point of a gun.



<< Gore just isn't as manipulated as Bush is >>



Bwuahahahahahahahaha!!!!!! Good one, Red!!!!!!

Russ, NCNE

 

[KingHam]

I'll vote for Bush because at least his special interests aren't the Red Chinese.

KingHam

 

[denali]

Well I just took that vote match test and it came out Harry Browne, Howard Phillips, Alan Keyes, Pat Buchanan, George Bush.

This will be the third election that I plan on voting Libertarian in. My other rule is never to vote for an incumbant or someone going for a different office. I also vote against anything that take money out of my pocket.