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Polaris Refresh (RX 500 Series) Rumors

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lobz said:
all of you who are trashing this polaris 'refresh' and the fact that amd decided to still call them 570/580 seem to forget what it really indicates: even vega 11 will be significantly faster (i.e. at least a category higher), than the 580
Click to expand...

Why not start Polaris at 570 then? It feels like a better upgrade and lets small Vega slot in at 580/590 levels and big Vega as a Fury replacement.

Of course who knows what the naming scheme will be after their announcement regarding Vega naming.

As a few others have pointed out with a good 480 you can already hit the rumored speeds for the 580. The 8-pin power connector is good in that it will allow for more OC headroom, but the chip itself also needs to be capable.
 
lobz said:
all of you who are trashing this polaris 'refresh' and the fact that amd decided to still call them 570/580 seem to forget what it really indicates: even vega 11 will be significantly faster (i.e. at least a category higher), than the 580.
Click to expand...

Does anyone else see the opposite logic? I'd feel a lot more confident in Vega if AMD rebadged the 480 to the 560, for example, as that leaves room for Vega 11 to go into 570 and 580, and Vega 10 into 590 and "RX Vega". Or 570 example as Mopetar posted above.

With 480 to 580 rebadging, I wonder if they really intend to have 4 chips above it in naming. Will all 4 Vega chips really use the Vega name?
 
crisium said:
Does anyone else see the opposite logic? I'd feel a lot more confident in Vega if AMD rebadged the 480 to the 560, for example, as that leaves room for Vega 11 to go into 570 and 580, and Vega 10 into 590 and "RX Vega". Or 570 example as Mopetar posted above.

With 480 to 580 rebadging, I wonder if they really intend to have 4 chips above it in naming. Will all 4 Vega chips really use the Vega name?
Click to expand...
I see zero logic in worrying about the exact specific name. Who cares? They can rebrand it and call it the 590 instead of 580...

Y'all do realize they can use whatever stupid naming system they want. All that matters is the performance of the actual lineup...
It could be 590 for Polaris 10, Vega lite, Vega lite x, tremendous Vega, tremendous Vega xxx

So worrying about whether the 480 is rebranded into the 580 vs 570 is one of the saddest conversations you can have showing very little actual thought into the actual products coming out

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
 
sm625 said:
Once again, US tech sites are a woeful disappointment.

https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https://www.computerbase.de/2016-06/radeon-rx-480-test/12/&edit-text=&act=url

Their data seems to suggest that each 2% increment in memory clocks brings you 1% additional performance.
Click to expand...

Seems like some games benefit more than others so creating separate profiles would be necessary as I expect that you get more returns from core clock increases until the memory bandwidth becomes the biggest bottleneck. For a more complete picture you'd want to also show how much additional performance you can get out of the 480 if you apply the same total power towards a core OC instead to show the difference.
 
crisium said:
Does anyone else see the opposite logic? I'd feel a lot more confident in Vega if AMD rebadged the 480 to the 560, for example, as that leaves room for Vega 11 to go into 570 and 580, and Vega 10 into 590 and "RX Vega". Or 570 example as Mopetar posted above.

With 480 to 580 rebadging, I wonder if they really intend to have 4 chips above it in naming. Will all 4 Vega chips really use the Vega name?
Click to expand...
it's not a question of logic, since they probably have decided to name all vega cards differently (rx vega) a long time ago.
 
tential said:
I see zero logic in worrying about the exact specific name. Who cares? They can rebrand it and call it the 590 instead of 580...

Y'all do realize they can use whatever stupid naming system they want. All that matters is the performance of the actual lineup...
It could be 590 for Polaris 10, Vega lite, Vega lite x, tremendous Vega, tremendous Vega xxx

So worrying about whether the 480 is rebranded into the 580 vs 570 is one of the saddest conversations you can have showing very little actual thought into the actual products coming out

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Sorry about your depression. Trigger warning: I'm going to be discussing video card names in the thread about a video card name change.

We can look at previous rebadging examples to make a guess. Rebadges to the same "number tier" in the next generation tend to mean that generation hardly has any improvement relative to others. I don't think there's been any example of such that has seen more than 1 chip faster than last gen's flasgship.

It also weakens the brand name, as already discussed. You don't have to be a stockholder or fanboy to be annoyed at missteps such as this.

I also think it's deceitful, with full intent to trick foolish consumers. Yes, anyone who buys a 580 thinking it's a meaningful upgrade to the 470 should have done their homework. But when was the last time you could have gone from a lower number Nvidia card to a higher number next-gen Nvidia card and not have had a meaningful upgrade? 970->1080, 780->980 Ti, 950->1060, etc. All worthy upgrades.

AMD claims to reboot the naming scheme every generation. What's next, Polaris 10 -> RX 680, but we will have 6 chips above it?

I genuinely think it's wrong to prey on consumers who dare give the company the benefit of the doubt. I call out Nvidia masquerading x04 chips as flagships, and I call out AMD on rebadging with intent to trick. Honest rebadging is just fine. I will offer my thoughts on the video card forum whenever possible.
 
crisium said:
Will all 4 Vega chips really use the Vega name?
Click to expand...

Sounded like that was the big announcement at GDC 😉. So Radeon Vega _____ for each. I could see this similar to 290 -> 390. Similar chip but with slight improvements and faster VRAM.
 
crisium said:
Sorry about your depression. Trigger warning: I'm going to be discussing video card names in the thread about a video card name change.

We can look at previous rebadging examples to make a guess. Rebadges to the same "number tier" in the next generation tend to mean that generation hardly has any improvement relative to others. I don't think there's been any example of such that has seen more than 1 chip faster than last gen's flasgship.

It also weakens the brand name, as already discussed. You don't have to be a stockholder or fanboy to be annoyed at missteps such as this.

I also think it's deceitful, with full intent to trick foolish consumers. Yes, anyone who buys a 580 thinking it's a meaningful upgrade to the 470 should have done their homework. But when was the last time you could have gone from a lower number Nvidia card to a higher number next-gen Nvidia card and not have had a meaningful upgrade? 970->1080, 780->980 Ti, 950->1060, etc. All worthy upgrades.

AMD claims to reboot the naming scheme every generation. What's next, Polaris 10 -> RX 680, but we will have 6 chips above it?

I genuinely think it's wrong to prey on consumers who dare give the company the benefit of the doubt. I call out Nvidia masquerading x04 chips as flagships, and I call out AMD on rebadging with intent to trick. Honest rebadging is just fine. I will offer my thoughts on the video card forum whenever possible.
Click to expand...

Deceit? You are calling out the wrong company, Nv has a long long list of such behavior. They get away with it because the press and consumers seem to have gotten tired of calling them on it. NV ignored them and kept doing it, and eventually everyone submitted and accepted the practice as normal. It's the same way the corporate mainsteam media works to push their agenda on the general population. Just one example is the 1060 and 1060 3GB, there was a time when it was unacceptable to the tech community for a cut down version of the same card to carry the same branding. It isn't a regular 1060 with less memory, yet nobody cares... But yet here we are criticizing AMD for the RX580 branding, and we even have no idea on it's performance, just guess work! I'd suggest turning your criticism to places where the facts are known, as in 1060 w/1280 cores vs. 1060 3GB w/1152 cores. Those are specs that we do actually know about.
 
tential said:
I see zero logic in worrying about the exact specific name. Who cares? They can rebrand it and call it the 590 instead of 580...
Click to expand...

Part of the reason is that thosecategories are meant to convey certain information, such as price and relative performance. If the 480 moved to the 570, it would be more suggestive of what the price/performance of the smaller Vega chip would be or how it fits into the lineup based on what those categories have meant historically. If you aren't going to use naming conventions to create product expectations, they are completely pointless and you may as well choose something that sounds cooler than 580.
 
piesquared said:
Nv has a long long list of such behavior. They get away with it because the press and consumers seem to have gotten tired of calling them on it. NV ignored them and kept doing it, and eventually everyone submitted and accepted the practice as normal. It's the same way the corporate mainsteam media works to push their agenda on the general population.
Click to expand...

trying to figure out what this has to do with a Polaris refresh?
Can you explain it to me?
 
Obviously, this plan was nixed (final digit denoting revision): https://videocardz.com/61721/amd-radeon-rx-400-series-naming-scheme-explained
AMD-Radeon-RX-400-series.jpg


Although naming using Radeon 500 series is disingenuous, as the Angry Video Game Nerd put it, "Call it whatever you want. Call it Super 3D Fuck Farts if you want.".
 
Can someone please explain why AMD couldn't just sell a factory overclocked 8gb rx480 slightly undervolted for power reduction (everyone says its possible), and not rename it to a 580?

Unless I'm missing something, is there something else the 580 will deliver that the 480 doesn't have?
 
happy medium said:
Can someone please explain why AMD couldn't just sell a factory overclocked 8gb rx480 slightly undervolted for power reduction (everyone says its possible), and not rename it to a 580?

Unless I'm missing something, is there something else the 580 will deliver that the 480 doesn't have?
Click to expand...

Maybe the answer could be provided by identifying the reason that intel renamed the Skylake 6700 processor to a Kabylake 7700 processor. Or the reason Nv renamed a GTX 680 to a GTX 770 and so on and so on...
 
There are some claims that AMD is switching from the 14 nm LPE process to the 14 nm LPP process. This could make it similar to the nVidia 480 -> 580 change where the chips were also based on a very similar die but with process improvements. The main difference was that the GTX 480 was so power hungry that the GTX 580 getting 10% more clock speed with yet lower power even though more shaders were unlocked meant a lot. Here, there are no more shaders to unlock, 10% more clock speed doesn't even come close to bridging the gap to 1070 level performance and going from 150 watts to 130-140 watts just doesn't matter that much - you are nowhere near the point where you don't need a PSU power header nor was the power of the RX 480 so high that you have the heat and noise problems that the GTX 480 had.
 
The Radeon 580, will be a respin of the 480, but use less power and have more performance at lower price. Not hard to figure out that AMD's future is Vega, and this Polaris respin is just a mature process for their low-end chips & mainstream market.

Radeon for you... and radeon for you... and radeons for everyone..!
 
w3rd said:
The Radeon 580, will be a respin of the 480, but use less power and have more performance at lower price. Not hard to figure out that AMD's future is Vega, and this Polaris respin is just a mature process for their low-end chips & mainstream market.

Radeon for you... and radeon for you... and radeons for everyone..!
Click to expand...
https://videocardz.com/67841/sapphire-radeon-rx-500-series-also-listed-online

It appears that RX 500 series actually will cost more than RX 480 series, when they launched, or at the same price level.

So this claim of you went to toilet. Lets wait for your other claims from other threads.
 
The launch price of the 390/X was $70/$120 lower than the launch price of the 290/X, but had double the RAM and slightly better perf/W. The problem is that the closeout price of the 290/X was significantly lower than the 390/X at launch. I guess what I'm saying is that even if the 500-series is the same or less than the launch price of the 400-series, it won't matter since the 400-series will still be cheaper while supplies last.
 
It's quite interesting that the prices listed in these latest leaks seem to be a fair bit higher than launch prices of Polaris. If these are just placeholders, what were the early leaked prices for RX 480/RX 470?
 
piesquared said:
It's quite interesting that the prices listed in these latest leaks seem to be a fair bit higher than launch prices of Polaris. If these are just placeholders, what were the early leaked prices for RX 480/RX 470?
Click to expand...

Yeah, that pricing doesn't make sense if the speculated details of the 570/580 lineup are accurate (i.e. very little in the way of performance improvement versus 4x0 cards).

You'd have to offer quite a bit of improvement over a $110AR RX470 4GB card or a $140AR RX480 4GB card to justify that pricing, or consumers will buy 4x0 cards instead. Then again, those prices are in EUR so can't tell if that's going to reflect North American pricing or not.
 
rx 500 series benches are out... wccftech

Absolutely no improvement aside from higher clocks.

I am kind of disappointed, but I totally expected this. What's more I suspect the 1060 refresh, which will likely use better memory, will see much larger gains at stock, which is how the reviewers will test the cards.


I am not too excited for Vega either sadly... It just feels like it's a day late, and a dollar short.
 
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http://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-rx-580-570-560-3dmark-performance-benchmarks/

AMD Radeon RX 500 Series Performance Numbers

The performance tests for the AMD Radeon RX 580 show that the chip was overclocked to 1500 MHz on the Polaris core and the memory was clocked to 2121 MHz (+121 MHz). This gained a good performance increase over the models that operate close to the stock speeds. Following is a compilation of all the AMD Radeon RX 580 performance numbers in 3DMark Firestrike.

TkpXY202.jpeg


More "leaked information" can be found in the linked thread.
 
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