PlayStation 4 Pro SoC Discussion

[Sweepr]

Rumours, rumours...

 

[poofyhairguy]

So this IS like the N64 RAM pack that made some games better when installed.

 

[monstercameron]

So this IS like the N64 RAM pack that made some games better when installed.

more like the new 3ds vs the 3ds...

 

[exar333]

4K is so silly.

The entire industry messed up.

HDTV should have been 720p then 1440p. 1080 should have never existed. 4K exists because it's easy for manufacturers of 1080 panels to make them, not because the 4K resolution is something particularly special.

1440 is plenty for HDTV, given normal viewing distances. For console gaming it would also be fine.

People should have focused on important factors, like contrast ratio, input lag (a huge problem with HDTVs), color gamut, and the like — instead of obsessing about pixel density. 1440 offers plenty of density considering the requirements for pushing very high-quality graphics at that size.

Until the people and environments start looking like real life then 1440 is plenty. We don't need low-grade graphics at 4K. Seeing a pixel is not as much of an issue as the quality of the gameplay and graphical realism/complexity.

4K is OK for monitors because people sit closer but it's overkill for console gaming. But, since we were fed 1080, a stupid standard, we're locked into the 4K overkill. As a result, no one is very happy with the state of console gaming. They're currently too weak for 1080 and getting to 4K is going to cost too much.

Good points.

Even 1440p is almost 2x the pixels vs. 1080P. Considering current consoles runs closer to 30fps, at 1080p with medium quality, 1440p is completely unattainable. Let alone 4K.

From my perspective, I really enjoy 4K, but agree that you need serious hardware to enjoy it. 4x the current hardware would get them to a similar tenuous place they are now with 1080p. Consoles almost need more like 6x the gpu grunt to really nail 4K and VR. I don't see that happening.

 

[happy medium]

Am I doing it right?

That picture would be more like saying the PS4 will play Xbone games.

Coleco Atari expansion interface FTW!

 

[ElFenix]

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2467457

 

[Sweepr]

Added a poll with the options provided by Eurogamer.

 

[Silverforce11]

^ Such a chip would be a bit expensive for consoles, where this generation both have gone with relatively "low end" hardware (Cat cores + HD7770 or ~7850), presumably so as to not lose money on each console sold, and keep the selling price low. Upgrading to big cores + the equivalent of a $500 GPU does not seem reasonable in this context, especially on a more expensive process.

Polaris 10 is going to be cheap, it's the power of 14nm FF leap.

It's just a case of marketing.

PS4K, 4K and VR! 60 fps 4K gaming!

$599 - $699.

They will sell out like hotcakes. Consumerism is stronk.

 

[escrow4]

How convenient, just as I scrap parts of my gaming box and go off to buy a PS4. I don't do 4K. Its pointless as the internet here sucks and there is little to no 4K content actually worth purchasing 4K hardware for. And 4K hardware isn't worth the cost.

 

[Rakehellion]

more like the new 3ds vs the 3ds...

And certain Game Boy Color games in the Game Boy Advance.

 

[Rakehellion]

4K is so silly.

The entire industry messed up.

HDTV should have been 720p then 1440p.

Yeah, except that's 4x the pixels of 720p. Not a trivial difference ~20 years ago when they first came out.

1080 should have never existed. 4K exists because it's easy for manufacturers of 1080 panels to make them, not because the 4K resolution is something particularly special.

1440 is plenty for HDTV, given normal viewing distances. For console gaming it would also be fine.

Says who? The whole point of ultra high definition displays is so you can't see all of the pixels.

People should have focused on important factors, like contrast ratio, input lag (a huge problem with HDTVs), color gamut, and the like — instead of obsessing about pixel density.

They're not mutually exclusive.

1440 offers plenty of density

And no one will ever need more than 64kb of RAM.

 

[superstition]

Yeah, except that's 4x the pixels of 720p. Not a trivial difference ~20 years ago when they first came out.

4K is a lot more pixels than 1440.

Says who?

tftcentral's article on visual acuity. It says that people think 4K is an improvement because they look at TVs in the showroom up close. (And, they're comparing them with 1080 sets not 1440 sets.) At normal TV viewing distances the ability to perceive the added resolution is greatly decreased. 1440 should be adequate for HDTV. It certainly would have been a more worthwhile upgrade over 720.

1080 shouldn't have existed. It doesn't offer enough resolution. The industry has fooled people into embracing too many incremental improvements.

The whole point of ultra high definition displays is so you can't see all of the pixels.

There is more to a TV upgrade than pixel density. I made a list of things that can be more important, like input lag and contrast ratio.

And no one will ever need more than 64kb of RAM.

Also, if you're going to try to mock my post at least post the complete thought:

1440 offers plenty of density considering the requirements for pushing very high-quality graphics at that size.

 

[myocardia]

How convenient, just as I scrap parts of my gaming box and go off to buy a PS4. I don't do 4K. Its pointless as the internet here sucks and there is little to no 4K content actually worth purchasing 4K hardware for. And 4K hardware isn't worth the cost.

Were you not aware that the internets is no longer the only place to find 4k content? 4k Blu Rays have officially launched. Every new movie from the major studios will be released on 4k Blu Ray immediately, and I can guarantee you that all of the best selling 1080P Blu Rays will be rereleased very soon on 4k Blu Ray. Some of them already have been, it turns out. Here is a list of currently available 4k Blu Rays @ Amazon.

 

[escrow4]

Were you not aware that the internets is no longer the only place to find 4k content? 4k Blu Rays have officially launched. Every new movie from the major studios will be released on 4k Blu Ray immediately, and I can guarantee you that all of the best selling 1080P Blu Rays will be rereleased very soon on 4k Blu Ray. Some of them already have been, it turns out. Here is a list of currently available 4k Blu Rays @ Amazon.

Irrelevant. I don't buy Blu-Rays, waste of money. $30 for what? And I have no 4K hardware at all. DVDs are the still the choice.

 

[2is]

Polaris 10 is going to be cheap, it's the power of 14nm FF leap.

It's just a case of marketing.

PS4K, 4K and VR! 60 fps 4K gaming!

$599 - $699.

They will sell out like hotcakes. Consumerism is stronk.

Current console hardware has a hard time managing 1080p @ 60fps and often times doesn't. An APU that can actually deliver 60fps @ 4K won't be cheap.

Chances are we are going to be looking at a whole lot of up scaled games, vs games actually being rendered at 4K

 

[Blitzvogel]

I see the release of a PS4k being the enabling of proper 30 and 60Hz 4K content like movies and video. I don't see games being a huge focus (and therefore graphics horsepower), unless Playstation VR is a motivator since 60Hz will be necessary. The PS4 in it's current state can't deliver consistent 60Hz/FPS+ at 1080p with decent graphics by today's standards without really pairing down visual quality.

 

[R0H1T]

Irrelevant. I don't buy Blu-Rays, waste of money. $30 for what? And I have no 4K hardware at all. DVDs are the still the choice.

Then you're not a (potential) customer, why don't you leave it at that instead of predicting that it's basically worthless for everyone else!

 

[VirtualLarry]

I see the release of a PS4k being the enabling of proper 30 and 60Hz 4K content like movies and video. I don't see games being a huge focus

This. This is Sony's move to shore up their movie studio(s), by using the PS4 to drive 4K UHD Blu-Ray adoption, just like they used PS3 to push Blu-Ray in the home.

 

[The Stilt]

Definitely cost savings. They've done it once already (GDDR5 ICs). PS4 motherboard is still heavily overbuilt, so it can be shaved down to cut the cost further.

14nm / 16nm shrink is not likely, since the ASIC would end up costing more and not less.

 

[beginner99]

Says who? The whole point of ultra high definition displays is so you can't see all of the pixels.

Problem is that most people already for full-hd buy too small screens or sit too far away. For 4k to see an actual difference compared to full-hd, you almost need to hug the screen. This is a limitation of the human eye.

At 2m viewing distance you need at least a 55" screen for 4k to be worth it, better 60". This is a huge screen and 2m (about 6.5 foot) is very close. Most people don't get this. 4K is only about getting more TVs sold because it's supposedly new and better. Since 3D failed, industry needed something new to promote. This is now 4K and VR.

 

[myocardia]

Irrelevant. I don't buy Blu-Rays, waste of money. $30 for what? And I have no 4K hardware at all. DVDs are the still the choice.

So, you're still watching a 480i or 480P television, then? Because the improvement of a Blu Ray over a DVD, assuming you're watching on a 1080P television, is more than 2x as much of an improvement as there was between VHS and DVD, and Blu Rays cost nowhere near $30 in 2016. I actually only own a few that I've paid more than $10 to buy new. Probably less than 5, if I had to guess.

 

[Flapdrol1337]

I don't think it'll be more powerful, just an update so it can play 4K H265 content, maybe a shrink so they can make a slim version.

 

[myocardia]

Problem is that most people already for full-hd buy too small screens or sit too far away. For 4k to see an actual difference compared to full-hd, you almost need to hug the screen. This is a limitation of the human eye.

At 2m viewing distance you need at least a 55" screen for 4k to be worth it, better 60".

If you actually believe what you just typed here, you need to find yourself a new optometrist. While I don't own a 4k television, I know two people who do. At one of their houses, the TV is ~12 feet from their 55" inch 4k TV, and at the other person's house, their 50" 4k TV is about exactly 10 feet away. I sit about exactly 8 feet from my 46" tweaked 1080P TV, and every time I see either of their TVs, I start looking for a reason to buy a 4k TV, since even from considerably farther away, the difference is readily apparent. I'd say that if my TV were a 55" 1080P model, it would be very, very easy to tell the difference between it and the 55" 4k TV...from at least 20 feet away, possibly more.

 

[Sweepr]

Definitely cost savings. They've done it once already (GDDR5 ICs). PS4 motherboard is still heavily overbuilt, so it can be shaved down to cut the cost further.

14nm / 16nm shrink is not likely, since the ASIC would end up costing more and not less.

Makes sense. I assume they have much better yields now, they could reduce the PCB and still get clockspeeds up a little bit at the same process. Pushing the CPU cores to ~1.8GHz, enabling all 20 CUs from the iGPU (current models have 2 of them disabled) @ 850-900 MHz would provide a 18-25% boost.

 

[Shivansps]

Im conviced it is to improve multimedia, increasing cpu or gpu power does not make much sence, they may be able to clock the APU higher but that about it.


Probably to add 4K BD UHD playback, meaning, new BD reader, a DP to HDMI 2.0a active converter, and a 4K H265 decoder co-processor -or UVD block update, but i dont think so-
And wharever it is on the VR set magic box.