Planning out a new Q9450 system

[anindrew]

Hello all! I didn't want to hijack Chilli911's Q9450 thread, so I started my own.

I've been using an Athlon64 3500+ based system since about the time it came out 5+ years ago. It has been a great system that has lasted all this time. It has 2GB of DDR PC 3200 and an X1950 AGP (rockin' it old school). Amazingly, I can actually play Crysis at 1280x800 on High with everything cranked up...except with no AA (haha). Given that and the fact that my PCI slots are no longer recognized due to a power hit or electrical shock when replacing the chipset fan, I figured it was more than time to build a new system.

I plan to use the system for gaming, some audio production, perhaps a bit of AutoCAD, and general usage (email, internet, chatting, etc). I certainly like to multi task.

So far, I have decided on two components: Intel Q9450 and Enermax Chakra case (love the 250mm fan on the side). I'm also keeping my current hard drives and optical drives as they are pretty new.

It seems like the general consensus is that DDR3 currently isn't worth the price premium. I was going to stick with DDR2, but I'm not sure what speed to get. I'd like to get 4GB in a 2x2GB kit so that I could add more RAM later. I see some DDR2 1066 2x2GB kits for about $100ish. Is it worthwhile to get DDR2 that's faster than 800?

If I OC the Q9450, I'd be ecstatic to reach even 3.0Ghz. Anything over that would be awesome, but I wouldn't get this system with the goal of getting a super duper high OC. I don't even OC my current system, but a lot of that is beacause the 200Mhz extra I can get hardly makes any difference, anyway. The Zalman 9700 would probably handle whatever OCing I do easily.

As for a mother board, I was leaning more towards the Intel chipsets since I don't plan to use SLI, but the 780i doesn't look too bad. How is its performance versus X38, X48?

I was planning to get a 9800GTX for my graphics card, but both ATI and Nvidia are supposed to release new cards in the next couple weeks. I figured I would wait and see how they are performing before making a decision.

Perhaps I'll even be able to sell off some of my old components in the "for sale" thread here, too.

Thanks for reading! Please comment, advise, question, etc.

 

[TC91]

If you re not going SLI for sure, then definitely go for a p35 / p45 / x38 / x48 chipset over the nvidia. What is your budget for a motherboard? Most of the p35/45 / x38/48 boards will allow you to get your quad to 3ghz+. The intel boards run cooler, have less issues overall (680i and 790i both have sata corruption issues i believe, while the 780i is a patched up 680i that runs even more hotter). Getting ddr3 for a core 2 setup is generally not worth the money as the fsb of the core 2 architecture will bottleneck the memory, ddr2 atm considering the prices is the way to go. For the graphics card, definitely wait for the new cards to release.

 

[anindrew]

Thanks for the reply, TC91!

I'm definitely not going SLI. It always seems like a single card from the next gen can outperform 2 in SLI or Crossfire from the previous. I had read about instability issues on the nvidia chipsets. And I have certainly read about the stability of Intel's chipsets. It sounds like since SLI isn't a factor for me, I should stick with the Intel boards. I've had two Abit boards in the past, but they both bit the dust before their time. My current board is an older MSI (nforce3 ultra), but I can't say I'm a huge fan of it. I'm looking at the Gigabyte X38 and X48 boards that use DDR2. It's hard to tell the difference between some of them. They all get good reviews from what I've seen. I'll have to look up some reviews on the newer P45 boards. The P35 looked really nice and was very affordable, so I'd love to see how the newer version of it is.

I'd say my budget for a motherboard is a maximum of $300. The more under that it is, the better. I'm trying to keep the total system cost close to $1100.

 

[Tencntraze]

I just upgraded from my A64 3500 w/ 2gigs of ram, so I know where you're coming from. I got a q9450, the DFI LT X48 MB, 8GB RAM (why not, at $80-90 per 4GB). 2 of the memory sticks were bad, so I'm waiting on the RMA for those, but I'm running the CPU at 3.4GHz stable right now. The temps read 62-65 load, but I REALLY don't believe that as they seem to be reading high in general (which isn't uncommon from what I've read) even though I'm using RealTemp. Still, it's stable and I don't have particularly high voltages (I think 1.28 VCore and 1.3 VTT), so I'm not really worried. I really don't want to take out the motherboard and take off the heatsink to check it, as I followed the proper appliation guidelines; I may have put a touch too much AS5 on it, but definitely nothing horrible. Perhaps I'll feel less lazy when I add the new ram.

 

[anindrew]

Hi Tencntraze!

That's awesome that you were in the same boat as me. How are you liking your new system? I've heard DFI boards are supposed to be great, especially for OCing. Their prices are on par with the Gigabyte boards I'm looking at. Is the BIOS difficult to understand with all the crazy settings? Also, I'm curious what speed and brand of memory you bought. Thanks!

 

[Tencntraze]

There are definitely a lot of options to look at in the BIOS, so I played around with the obvious ones first to see where I could get. Originally I had my 3.4 O/C with something like 1.34v on the cpu, and now it's 1.28 due to various tweaking with the GTL and reading up with what people said. It seems that it's not so much the CPU that needs the voltage as it is the FSB. Though I did try reading up on a lot of the BIOS stuff before the board came (only natural while waiting on the stuff to be delivered), it didn't make as much sense until I had actually played with some of the settings myself, as it's completely arbitrary until you actually have used them.

As for ram, I picked up the gskill pc1000 ram because it was somewhere between $80-90 at NewEgg and figured why not. I suppose that I could have gotten lower speed with tighter timings, and I am curious if it's better to have that than run it at 4:5 at 5-5-5-15 (defaults). I'm not really going to get down and dirty with the memory tweaking and squeezing every last bit out of the O/C until I get my RMA'd RAM back, since I'd likely be wasting time as using all 4 memory slots will definitely affect my O/C and settings.

 

[SolMiester]

Snap guys, came from Newcastle 3500+ & 6600GT> Q6600 & 9600GT...

I knew I could never justify SLI or even high end for the casual game, so got a P35 without the 2nd PCIe slot...Your going to love the new build OP

 

[anindrew]

Hi SolMiester!

That says a lot about our old Athlon64 systems that they lasted us this long. I cannot wait to order the parts and put my new quad core system together. It sounds like I'm probably going to blown away by how fast the new system is.

Since I'm a bit more than a casual gamer, but hardly a "hardcore" one, I must wait and see some reviews and prices for Nvidia's and AMD/ATI's new offerings in a couple weeks.

I'm quite sure that I want to go with a Gigabyte X48 DDR2 board. All the reviews I read of recent Gigabyte boards make them sound very reliable, high quality, and fast performing. Other than the number of SATA2 ports, I see no difference between the DS4 and DQ6. I'll probably have to make a separate post to see if anyone knows. :thumbsup:

 

[darckhart]

I went from a xp2800 barton +gf2 -> q6600 G0 + x800xt (waiting for the new vid cards too ) a little under a year go, and you'll have no problem doing WHATEVER you want with the parts you have picked out so far. As for the DDR2 ram, like Tencntraze mentioned, there's some 2x2GB DDR2-1000 on newegg for about $85 and you'll be able to run 1:1 as high as you can manage. I know you're planning to reuse many of your old parts as well, but I'd recommend you pay a bit of attention to what PSU you're getting, especially if you intend to power a monster of a video card and many hard drives.

 

[tr1kstanc3]

what type of audioproduction? i record music using a motu 828mkII, cubase 3.0, reason 4.0, live guitars, etc. i am using an e7200 overclocked to 3.16ghz. no games on this box =]

 

[anindrew]

Hi darckhart! Thanks for the reply. It sounds like I'll just about wet myself when I see how fast the new system will be. I'm still trying to figure out the whole memory thing with what speed I ought to get (800, 1066, etc). The two Gigabyte boards I'm looking at both list DDR2-1200 as the memory standard. I'll probably get DDR2-1066 since that seems to be the most common 2x2GB kit (at least on newegg). As for a PSU, I'd like to get at least a 600W. I don't think I need something ridiculous. Maybe 700W if it's a good deal would be nice.

Hi tr1kstanc3! At the moment I don't have a nice audio interface. I had an M-Audio Delta66, but sold it off when my mobo's PCI slots stopped working. I do some voice-over, record guitars, and mess around with drum loops, too. I use a Studio Projects VTB-1 mic pre, a few different mics (mostly a Nady RSM-4 ribbon for guitars), and use Ableton Live 7 as my DAW. After I build the new system, I'll probably get another recording interface.

 

[1Haplo]

I have the X3350 (Q9450) running at 3.4 on the ASUS Rampage Formula. The Quads are great for encoding. I use Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 and compaired to the E6600 the Quads ROCK!. The Q9645 will do 400 FBS easy. most max out around 460-480 with H2O of better, on air 425-450.

If you are just going for 400 FBS and one Video card go with the P35/P45 Chipset, If you want higher FBS or CrossFire go with the X38/X48 Chipsets. and If you want SLI go with the Nvidia chipset.

If you are looking at price The ASUS P5Q Deluxe is around 209 and has slot of features. If that is too much look at the GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3R.

If price is no a issure go with the X48 such as the ASUS Rampage Formula, GIGABYTE GA-X48-DS4, DFI LP LT X48-T2R.

1Haplo

 

[jamesbond007]

Wow, sounds like a lot of upgraders here in the thread; along with the enthusiasts, too.

I just placed an order with NewEgg today that also has the Q9450. Boy, when I read 12MB of L2, I couldn't believe it. I remember the days (8-10 years ago?) when CPUs had 128+128KB or 256KB or even 512KB. I may be getting some of my numbers skewed, but it just brought back so many grand memories.

I went with the ASUS Rampage Formula board and 8GB of G.Skill RAM. (C'mon, who wouldn't populate a new build with 8GB of RAM when it's like $80-$90 for 4GB!!!)

Here's the complete list:
CASE ANTEC|SONATA PLUS 550 RT - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$149.99)
MB ASUS RAMPAGE FORMULA 775 X48 RT - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$289.99)
MEM 2Gx2|GSK F2-8500CL5D-4GBPK R - Retail (Qty=2, Price=$179.98)
CPU INTEL|C2Q Q9450 2.66G 775 12M R - Retail (Qty=1, Price=$329.99)
FD 1.44MB|SONY MPF920 Black % - OEM (Qty=1, Price=$7.99)
HD 150G|WD 10K 16M SATA WD1500AHFD - OEM (Qty=1, Price=$174.99)
DVD BURN PIONEER|DVR-215DBK SATA % - OEM (Qty=1, Price=$30.99)

And the best part...
Shipping and Handling Charge: $14.57
** This includes the Linksys 8-Port gigabit switch, too!

Based on what I've read, the 550W Antec PSU should suffice my system. I am only going to have the single WD Raptor HDD as I have a couple dedicated file servers with plenty of storage for my photos and work. Additionally, I'm recycling my nVIDIA 7950GT OC from my current rig, so I don't feel too worried about power consumption issues.

All in all, I'm very excited to upgrade. I'm going to either sell or give my Dell 3.4GHz P4/3GB to a family member. I've had the system since January 2005 and that has been the longest period I've EVER gone without upgrading. I use to be heavy into building new machines every few weeks when the ASUS A7V, A7V133, A7V333, etc etc were hot and heavy. Anyone remember the VIA 686B and SoundBlaster conflicts? :laugh:

Cheers! :beer:
~Travis

 

[anindrew]

Hi jamesbond007!

That sounds like a pretty killer system you're building. I'm still debating on which motherboard I'll get, but it's looking like it will probably be the Gigabyte GA-x48-DS4. The DQ6 version has a couple extras (2 more SATA, an additional BIOS back-up feature, heatsink on the bottom), but I don't really feel that they're worth the extra $60 when I'd probably never use them. The Q9450 just seems like such an awesome processor. I agree that 12MB of L2 cache is just ridiculous to think about compared to processors from a few years ago. My current Athlon64 3500+ has 128KB L1 and 512KB L2 cache. It was quite a performer in its day, too.

If you're going with 8GB of RAM, then I'm guessing you already have a 64-bit version of Vista? I'll probably get Vista Home Premium 64-bit OEM since it's $99 or so, but I was just going to get 4GB (2x2GB) for the time being.

Does newegg give a discount on shipping when you buy that many items? Or were you a smart shopper and bought items with free/low shipping?

I'll have to make another post here with the options I'm considering now.

 

[anindrew]

Here is an updated list of the items I plan to purchase. Please feel free to question, comment, etc. Thank you!

CPU = Intel Q9450

Motherboard = Gigabyte GA-X48-DS4
or = Gigabyte GA-X48-DQ6

Memory = G. Skill 4GB (2x2GB) DDR2 1066 5-5-5-15

Video card = ATI/AMD 4870
or = ATI/AMD 4850

Case = Antec 900
or = Enermax Chakra (but then I'd have to get a couple case fans)

2 Fans (if needed) = Scythe Slipstream

CPU cooler = Xigmatek HDT-S1283

Thermal = Arctic Silver 5

OS = MS Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit

I'd keep the 75GB and 150GB WD Raptors from my current system and the two DVD burners.

That's all for now, folks!

 

[jamesbond007]

Anindrew,

Yes, I have Vista 64-bit through MSDN from school. I didn't TRY and look for things that had free shipping, but it was a factor if I couldn't decide between a few things. I have built a few systems for friends using the Antec 900. While it is a decent case and pretty large, I think it looks gaudy and just too much to look at. The Antec case I went with had to have no doors (absolutely HATE them!) and reasonably priced. I have been building with Antec cases for years and they've always been my favorite. Nice, thick steel casing, smooth edges (for the most part - better than most), and they are also very aesthetically pleasing as well. I just hope their power supplies are up to snuff these days. There's a PC Power and Cooling 750W that can be had for $150 before a MIR. While that would have been DAMN nice, I wanted to save a little where I could and went with the case + PSU combo. For $150, I couldn't go wrong. (unless the PSU is a lemon or sucks really bad!)

I'm pretty pumped about the motherboard. It is without a doubt the most expensive I've ever bought. However, I do think that it will be worth it in the long run. I know ASUS has a very good track record and I've always been pleased with their performance and options. I'm honestly not an overclocker at heart, but it is tempting to take my 2.66 to at least 3+GHz on air, if possible. After reading the in-depth article on AnandTech about the Rampage Formula motherboard, there's some tweaks that can be had with the memory to give a pretty good boost. I am not keeping my hopes up too high since I will have 4 modules installed. This obviously will take a toll on how high or how fast I can get the RAM to go.

I work a ton in Photoshop and Lightroom processing photos and my 3.4GHz would take up to a couple minutes to do some actions or to run some scripts to generate galleries or resizing/sharpening for web for several hundred photos. (digital proof galleries) I am really looking forward to the next installment of Creative Suite 4 that is going to be optimized for Windows 64-bit platforms. It won't be until CS5 until the Macs get the 64-bit versions available!

For your system, I would suggest the Antec case SOLELY because I've had the best luck with them and their quality has always been consistent. Looking at both cases you've interested in, I'd say they're equally ugly, so take your pick! :laugh: I can't comment on the video cards because I haven't been keeping up to date. However, I have read recent reviews about the current nVIDIA drivers and they've been very flaky in Vista and most say to stick with the 169 series. It looks like your decision to go the ATi route seems to be a smart one.

Best of luck! I'll let you know how the system is. I ordered it today and haven't gotten a tracking number yet, so I'm not sure if the UPS 3-day will get it here before the weekend. Bummer since I have Friday off from work, too!

~Travis

 

[aamsel]

Why are so many of you choosing X48 instead of P45 for use with a single video card?
Just wanted to know, since most articles read that the P45 should be a more
advanced northbridge with 45nm process than the X48 using 1 video card.

Is it that most of you plan to run crossfire at some point???

Please advise.

 

[anindrew]

You do raise a good point. Most likely, I will use only one graphics card. I'm planning to get the 4870, but I am curious how much the 4870x2 will be. I like having the option to run Crossfire at some point, too. Some of the P45 prices encroach upon the prices for some X48 boards. The Asus Maximus II Forumula looks awesome, but it costs MORE than the X48 board I'm planning to get. You never know: I may reconsider at the last second to save a little money by getting a P45 board.

aamsel, are you looking at getting a P45?

 

[aamsel]

Yes, I am looking at either the:

ASUS P5Q Deluxe
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813131297

or:

GIGABYTE EP45-DS4P
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813128346

 

[Qbah]

I'm running:

Q9450 @ 3.2GHz
- with a TRUE+Nexus Silent 120mm
- 48C Prime95 load temps :shocked: RealTemp monitor
- every voltage stock, just FSB @ 400MHz (hardly a taxing overclock )
- dead silent

GA-EP35-DS3R
- no problems what so ever

2x2GB Corsair XMS2 DHX CL4 RAM @ 800MHz
- cool
- huge heat sinks if you wish to o/c

2 Samsung 500GB drives in RAID0
- dead silent
- very fast
- reliable

Corsair HX520 PSU
- high quality
- very reliable
- dead silent

Antec P182 Case
- 3 Nexus Silent 120mm fans - dead silent... and I mean *dead*
- excellent cable management
- very good air flow
- looks wicked

Radeon HD 4870 (arriving tuesday/wednesday)
- awesome price for awesome performance
- heard it's pretty quiet in idle
- if not I'm gonna put some quiet cooling solution on it

One gripe though... the 12V ATX cable from the PSU is... well... short-ish. It does make it to the proper socket, however the cable is pretty strain, will need to find a solution for that if I wish to fit my new GPU.

Overall: best spent $$$ in the last 4 years. It's leaps and bounds faster, quieter and smoother than my previous setup, which wasn't bad at all in the first place

 

[anindrew]

Hi aamsel,

It's a tough choice between those boards you listed. The Gigabyte is less expensive, but has 2 more USB ports (and 2 on-board USB expansion). The Asus has 2 more SATA, but probably has on-board USB expansion. I'm sure either one would be great. It would be really cool if some company figured out a way to enable Crossfire on P45 with both PCI-E running at x16. Another thing to consider is that there are X48 boards for about $30 more. I get the impression that Crossfire is not a factor for you. I have read that the P45s overclock VERY well, too.

Qbah,

That's a real nice setup you have! I hope I'll be able to OC my Q9450 doing the same thing you did. I'm planning to get a Xigamatek HDT-S1283 cooler. That ought to help keep the CPU cool.

Update: Planning to get a Corsair TX750 power supply and will most likely get an AMD/ATI 4870 when the price gouging ceases unless the 4870x2 is released for around $400 (I can dream, right?).

 

[aamsel]

The Gigabyte Gigabyte GA-X48-DS4 does look like a really good board also.
Again, no plans to run crossfire, but would this be as fast for a Q9450?
It has a higher die process than the P45, but does look to have a substantial stock cooler.

One concern I have about P45 is that the IDE support is on an external chip, and I curently use IDE-based DVD burners.
I realize that I could change them to SATA very cheaply, but is this worth it?

So, it is still Gigabyte vs ASUS, and X48 vs P45, and all I intend to use is one video card.

I currently have an Intel D975XBX2, but have had no real joy overclocking a "good" E6600 on it.

Gigabyte also officially supports the Xeon processors on many of thier boards, such as the X48-DS4 and the EP45-DS4P.

Also the ASUS P5Q Deluxe looks very good, although it seems to be getting kind of "Mickey Mouse" with features, with the Gigabyte not far behind.

Please tell me what to get! <grin>

 

[anindrew]

If you're absolutely sure that you will never run Crossfire, then I would go with a P45 board. They were made to support the newer 45nm dual and quad cores. Here is a review where the reviewer was able to get his highest overclock on a Q9450 using the Asus P5Q Deluxe: click here.. His tests also showed the P5Q Deluxe pretty much matched the performance of the GA-X48-DQ6, and even beat it in a few tests.

So yes, it would be just as fast with the Q9450. Even if the IDE support is on another chip, I don't think that would matter much. It's not like DVD burners are maxing out the bandwidth of IDE. Plus, it seems like all the newer motherboards only have one IDE anyway. That can handle two burners.

The Gigabyte P45 board with the four LANs in it seems a bit silly unless you're running some type of server. The Asus P5Q Deluxe seems all right.

From what I've read, there is very little difference between the ICH9R and the ICH10R.

Great, now I'm considering P45 instead of X48. I know Anand is working on a P45 round-up for early July.

 

[aamsel]

But I am also considering THIS:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813128346
that does NOT have 4 LAN ports.
My decision is:
Is/can a Gigabyte board be the same quality as a good, working ASUS board?

 

[Qbah]

Originally posted by: aamsel
But I am also considering THIS:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813128346
that does NOT have 4 LAN ports.
My decision is:
Is/can a Gigabyte board be the same quality as a good, working ASUS board?

Definately I had an ASUS P5LD2 Deluxe board and comparing it to my new Gigabyte I don't see any difference. I would even say the GA one is more robust and looks better built. And the ASUS one was a high quality, performance board with the i945 chipset.

Don't know bout the P45 version, but my P35 runs flawelessly. Youød need to look around the web to find some reviews of the EP45. Or wait for Anand to post theirs.