Physics

[Topweasel]

Obviously Agieas option is a standalone card.

Nvidia's read like SLI was required. Which is kind of cool you buy two 7900GTXs and you can choose Graphics over Physics. On the other hand at 550 a Pop for someone cash strapped The agia looks like a better sulution, you buy a card that can follow you around for 3 years and allows you to buy video cards whenever you want. Spending a thousand dollars every time you upgrade just to make sure you a physics capabilities even with the benifit of having the card around for non Physics gaming seems like a bit much.

What about ATI, I can't read from their presser if Crossfire is required. If it is then once again smart Idea but a little over kill to get physics capabilities.

I wouldn't Mind getting a 7900GTX or 1900XT for video and a 7600GT or X1600 for Physics if those solutions where faster then Agieas Idea. Or if they rbranded their cards and made new drivers for Physics.

Imagine Picking up the new PhysForce 4400 (Nvidia) to go with the new X2900XTXXX (ATI) or The Physeon 7500 (ATI) to go with the new 8800GTXBKSP(Nvidia). But two have to go with a slow vid to keep costs down on Physics or spend up the but to get best single card graphics and spend that amount just to be able to get Physics is kind of stupid.

Hopefully they will both get a brain and rebrand their video products as physics cards and allow people SLI (Xfire) and Physics and not screw over people that want to get their card to go with someone elses graphics. But while they both are doing the SLI restriction I have a feeling even if Nvidias and ATIs solution is better, Agiea is going to be gaining market share. I am already looking at getting Agieas solution anyways.

 

[the Chase]

I agree. Also have to consider motherboards. I like the idea ATI came up with to cycle video cards on upgrades. So when you go from a X800 to a X1900XT as a graphics upgrade you use the X800 for physics. Then when you upgrade to the new X2900XTXX you then delegate the X1900XT for physics, and sell the X800 card. The problem with this is that most of us will need a new Xfire or SLI motherboard in addition to buying another graphics card. I'm happy with my Chaintech mobo right now and was never going to go SLI as the economics made no sense to me. I do have an open PCI (and a PCIe x1) slot though even with my soundcard installed. If Ageia could get their price down to the $200 range I think I would much rather prefer that than buying a $100-$150 motherboard and a $150-$450 video card.

The idea of just using one video card to split the chore of rendering graphics and calculating physics at the same time is pure delusion in my mind and should not even be considered as a viable option.

 

[Genx87]

My understanding is the physics done on the GPU will be more effects than interaction. Particle effects, fog, stuff like that. Where this standalone card can model interaction with objects like a wall collapsing or multiple items being tossed.

 

[Topweasel]

Originally posted by: Genx87
My understanding is the physics done on the GPU will be more effects than interaction. Particle effects, fog, stuff like that. Where this standalone card can model interaction with objects like a wall collapsing or multiple items being tossed.

I would double check on that as far as I know the HAvok engine and the Agiea one is roughly the same. I think its when the GPU shares Video and Physics work (worst Idea ever) is when the its used as more of a effects based physics.

 

[Topweasel]

Originally posted by: the Chase
I agree. Also have to consider motherboards. I like the idea ATI came up with to cycle video cards on upgrades. So when you go from a X800 to a X1900XT as a graphics upgrade you use the X800 for physics. Then when you upgrade to the new X2900XTXX you then delegate the X1900XT for physics, and sell the X800 card. The problem with this is that most of us will need a new Xfire or SLI motherboard in addition to buying another graphics card. I'm happy with my Chaintech mobo right now and was never going to go SLI as the economics made no sense to me. I do have an open PCI (and a PCIe x1) slot though even with my soundcard installed. If Ageia could get their price down to the $200 range I think I would much rather prefer that than buying a $100-$150 motherboard and a $150-$450 video card.

The idea of just using one video card to split the chore of rendering graphics and calculating physics at the same time is pure delusion in my mind and should not even be considered as a viable option.

Can you post a link that suggests that this is ATIs Idea, because they have been a bit cryptic with the pressers I have seen. At least Nvidia has clearly stated that it requires SLI (and therefore two expensive cards to get single highend video or two mid level cards just to keep the price at 7900GTX + PhysX card). If ATI does go that route it would be nice although I question whether it work with an Nvidia card. The reason I say that is if the 7600 or x1600 is better then the Agiea card then I could keep my 7800gtx and just get a X1600 for Physics, but if not I would have three choices get the PhysX card, buy a second 7800, or Buy a X1900XT and a X1600. If the performance is similar between Agiea, and the *600 series from ATI and Nvidia then I would go Agiea if not then even as one of the proponents of Physics I would have to sit this release out.

I hope that Agiea product is the best performer then all though anyways.

 

[Topweasel]

Damn no link yet. So does any one have an Idea of where ATI stated they would require CF for Physics, and even then they were the ones who said they would bridgeless for CF and later came out with something worse.

 

[the Chase]

Sorry Topweasel just came back to this thread- I'll search for the article I read about ATI doing it that way- I think it was a news post at Firingsquad but not sure. Will try to find.
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/ati_physics/ -on page 2 of this article near the bottom. Talks about using X1600 for physics and a X1900 for the graphics.

 

[the Chase]

Bump- did that article clear it up? Or just create more questions? I think there is a lot up in the air yet with both companies(ATI and Nvidia) solutions for this...

 

[SniperGuy]

I was under the impression that the PPU would actually be a chip ON a graphics card, not a card requiring an entire new slot.

 

[the Chase]

Originally posted by: SniperGuy
I was under the impression that the PPU would actually be a chip ON a graphics card, not a card requiring an entire new slot.

Might happen someday..

 

[SniperGuy]

Huh. I was lied to then.

 

[the Chase]

Well Nvidia and ATI are saying that their graphics cards as they are now will be able to do physics. What's unclear(to me) is if they will have to dedicate a whole card for the job or use just one card for both the graphics and physics. I'm calling shens on the 1 card only for both idea. I think personally that the seperate Ageia card is the way to go for "real" physics. Time will tell I suppose.